Ways that men "check out " of family life

[Whatwouldscullydo]

Inspired by another thread where its apparently unreasonable to expect someone to stay and help on Xmas day and wanting them to do so is controlling, it got me thinking of all the ways in which partners , very often male partners, check out of family life

We see many threads on this also

We have- hobbies. The ones that seemingly involve alot of time and/or expense. Often involve smoking or drinking or getting dirty and smelly so inevitably upon return showers etc are needed before they can hug or pick.up.a child.

Luxury poos. Never is it ok to wait for u. You must wait for them by any means necessary. Strange how even bodily functions can be used to assert dominance or unavailability.

The " I've been at work all day" excuse. We all know the house cleans itself. The dinner miraculously appears in the slow cooker and the kids can walk several miles to school by themselves even in reception.

The " we can't afford the time.off work " excuse. Usually followed by a day off fir them to do their hobby.

The " you have the car" clause. Because buses don't exist.. nor do trains . I mean how did i manage before I got the car?

The falling asleep on the sofa method. This is a particularly frustrating one because fir some they honestly believe their presence in the house is enough to be considered to be contributing.

And last but not least the " I don't know where anything goes/how to get there/ I don't know anyone / the kids prefer u to do it" method used to excuse no one putting washing away or getting home work.done while you are working.

Feel free to add any more

[DuckbilledSplatterPuff]

@Warblerinwinter

I think, looking back, a lot of issue start when mums go on maternity leave . There is a big pressure that becuase “you are not working” and family finances are mainly male partners once full maternity pay stops, that you can feel a bit guilty about “just” looking after the baby. You feel you have to justify your time by taking on all the household tasks etc. for a lot of mums (especially first time mums) we struggle with guilt in saying to father that they need to do 50% of nights- or we just stay doing most of nights after breastfeeding has stopped.
The male partner actually never has it so good- generally their workload outside work reduces.
And then it never goes back to how it was nice maternity leave finishes. Unless you’re really really clear during maternity that this is a temporary “favour” for him and not a default.
I think by second child a lot of women realise how naive they were first time round…but it is too late

This!

[Dozer]

I think issues start much sooner, in social influences on girls and boys.

Eg I internalised the idea that cooking and making things nice for others was an important way to show care and love.

I deliberately only dated boys/men who seemed domestically competent, but still believed/believe the above and do far more than my fair share.

[Whatwouldscullydo]

Actually I work part time . On top of all te life administration, house stuff, picking up and dropping off kids, all the drs dentist optician, hair dressing appointments and after school/weekend activities. And any night time requirements with the kids. School uniform shopping, school supply shopping etc

Imagine if we just randomly stopped at 5.00 as our 40 hours were over

[Slowchimes]

@RJnomore1

Anyway -why are you getting a angry with me and not the bloke who’s treating you like a household appliance?

Just wow.

I am not remotely angry! I am laughing at the way you choose to support women !

[FissionMailed]

@Whatwouldscullydo

Actually I work part time . On top of all te life administration, house stuff, picking up and dropping off kids, all the drs dentist optician, hair dressing appointments and after school/weekend activities. And any night time requirements with the kids. School uniform shopping, school supply shopping etc

Imagine if we just randomly stopped at 5.00 as our 40 hours were over

A lot of men think their working day ends at the front door, a lot of women think their working day ends when they go to sleep.
Obvious who benefits from that.

[Lorw]

The problem is children grow up seeing mum do everything and men do nothing and then treat them like a doormat, boys then think that’s it’s okay and that’s how you treat women and girls thinks that’s how they should be treat by men and the cycle begins again. Got to break that cycle.

[RJnomore1]

Change only comes from discomfort. Telling women something is completely normal and ok when it isn’t will not create any change.

Support isn’t about normalising they abnormal and the wrong. Sometimes it’s about pointing out to people they have the power to make things different rather than accepting the status quo.

Glad you find it funny. It’s all such a laugh isn’t it.

[Whatwouldscullydo]

fission

Correct me if I'm wring but u also have no right to moan u are too tired to do anything when you are watching YouTube or gaming til god knows what time

[Dozer]

IME mothers (including myself!) working part time after DC while men stay full time plays into this dynamic.

[FissionMailed]

@Whatwouldscullydo

fission

Correct me if I'm wring but u also have no right to moan u are too tired to do anything when you are watching YouTube or gaming til god knows what time

I knew a guy who would stay up till 3am playing games, then moan when his partner asked him to "do her a favour" and look after his own kids at 10am because he's just too tired to put up with their noise..

[EightWheelGirl]

Not to be deliberately contrary, but tbf an equal (probably larger) amount of women check out of full time work and many don't seem too desperate to go back to five days a week once the kids are at school. Seen quite a few threads about women not wanting to return, including one recently where OP was annoyed because partner didn't want to take the bulk of the financial burden.

Less women do this than in previous generations but there are a lot more women living off a man than vice versa. Can't really deny that.

[EightWheelGirl]

Isn't it also the case that women are around 33% more likely to divorce a man who earns less than them and SAHD also have a much higher divorce rate. This would seem to imply that when the tables are turned it isn't the life of privilege which many on here claim men have.

[Alayalaya]

My husband has no idea what our son has for Christmas and I’ve wrapped them all too. I used to buy presents for everyone but then he would complain I wasn’t putting in enough effort to choose thoughtful gifts for his family. He had totally just checked out of responsibility for Christmas. So I told him if he’s going to criticise my gift choices then in future he needs to shop for his family himself. I still shop for our son because I don’t trust him to make enough effort, if his family has no gifts then I don’t care but I care that our son has gifts so I do handle that.

Today I wrapped our son’s gifts and I told him the paper and tape was on the dining table for him to wrap his family’s gifts. So he got really angry and said he works full time so why can’t I help him and be supportive by wrapping them too? I said I’ve helped him by purchasing and wrapping all of his son’s gifts and he will need to wrap the gifts for his other family members. He has done it but he’s huffed and been bad tempered the whole time.

In a normal year I would have started earlier and just wrapped them all, but this year I’m struggling with a recent bereavement so everything has just been left very late and I don’t have time to facilitate him not doing his share.

[Comedycook]

My husband has no idea what our son has for Christmas and I’ve wrapped them all too

Jus realised that dh has no idea what presents our DC have for Christmas. They are all wrapped (by me) and under the tree. He has no idea until they open them on Christmas day. Same for birthdays...he has no input into present buying.

[Spiderelf]

@Athomewiththehales89

I wouldn’t buy presents or cards for anyone including all of our families and friends so you are choosing to as I wouldn’t be bothered if they had nothing 😂

To be fair I'm not bothered if my in laws didn't get anything either.

I'm not the idiots who raised a lazy, selfish arse.

[Fadingout]

I think it’s unfair to blame women. Social conditioning has played a huge part especially when children come into it. My DH pulls some of his weight but he does the chores he wants to do. Hangs out washing, rarely irons, has cleaned the bathroom a hand ful of times. I wish I’d found mumsnet in my 20s. My DH lived with his mum who basically did everything for him and I think he thinks him doing anything is amazing. He’ll take our eldest child to football and can find time in his working week (he works at home) to go and watch him play after school for an hour. But get him to review either of our severely disabled childrens ehcps and he says he can’t do it, I’m more experienced. He opts out. I’ve tried not cleaning bathrooms, having a conversation (he gets very narky as apparently despite it being a reasonable conversation) I’m getting at him. I take on the load especially where our two children with severe special needs come in. Yet he’s an intelligent professional who is a high earner. I suspect he just doesn’t really care enough and is used to a woman picking up after him. I stopped working due to no childcare for years and have been working for the last two and am now full time yet the mental and a lot of physical load is mine. It doesn’t matter how many conversations we have, nothing changes. I assume he thinks I’ll just put up with it or he just doesn’t care enough to put himself out. Financially I don’t feel in a position to leave. But it does make me really resent him when I’m the one showering our children, brushing their teeth, giving meds because “it’s not in his routine” yet he can organise his hobbies, go out at the last minute. That’s not an issue. Mostly it just makes me very sad.

[LadyCatStark]

“Needing” to wash the car whenever there’s house work to be done. The perfect ruse because he looks “busy” and like he’s “helping” but he’s actually having a few hours to himself pottering and listening to music through his AirPods.

[PrincessPaws]

And if you think relationship counselling will solve the problem of dh emptying his pockets out on to the dining table and leaving his shoes cables and papers and half empty coffee cups all over the house, then frankly I think you are the one that needs counselling!

Well if he doesn't care about your home what does he care about? His car? In which case scoop up all the shit and dump it in the footwell of his car. His gym bag? Ditto all shit gets dumped in his gym bag, He doesn't really care at all? In which case if it is there for more than 48 hours it goes in the bin....yes, it's a pain for a little while because once again you are thinking about it, but it's no more than you are doing already.

I can guarantee that if it starts to inconvenience him then he'll stop leaving his mess everywhere, but while you clear up after him he has absolutely no incentive to change. I think this is what @RJnomore1 means by bad behaviour being facilitated by women. You aren't to blame for the mess but you clear it up meaning he doesn't have to care.

It's like strategic incompetence, why do so many people accept the 'I don't know how' excuse? 'Well you are an intelligent man, I'm sure you'll figure it out' or even 'I'm not going to fall for strategic incompetence, you are more than capable so stop with the bullshit and get on with it' usually makes them look a bit sheepish and just get on with it. No-one should accept it, they should call it out every fucking time. If they know they won't get away with it then they won't do it.

[Longcovid21]

The "I've contributed to Xmas by buying 1 gift" whereas the wife literally brings Christmas- food, cleans house, wraps presents thinks of everyone and everything. Then he maybe carves a joint of meat or something

[Longcovid21]

Then he gets drunk and incapable of entertaining kids or helping clear up.

[KatharinaRosalie]

Isn't it also the case that women are around 33% more likely to divorce a man who earns less than them

Most likely because they can afford to. How many posts are there on MN where the woman desperately wants to leave, but she's a SAHM/very part time worker who has given up her career to support him, so she simply can't afford to?

[purplesequins]

why do so many people accept the 'I don't know how' excuse?

possibly because that would leave children's basic needs unmet. disabled children unmedicated. important school desicions not made. children's dental check ups, eye checks etc not done.

[SparklingLime]

If they know they won't get away with it then they won't do it.

So it’s up to women to police this behaviour, @PrincessPaws? Exhausting.

[Nomoreusernames1244]

Yep. There’s a thread running where the dh has decided he wants gammon, so the poster is running around trying to figure out what goes with gammon, how to cook it, and what to serve with it.

He wants gammon, he can figure out how to cook it and what to serve with it.

Why do women take responsibility for men’s choices?

[Whatwouldscullydo]

I'm sure schools would also have something to say if kids showed up with no lunch , dirty clothes etc

" oh I was engaging in a game of chicken with my dh, I didn't give in , go me" won't cut it