BBC article has been reported to police as a "Hate Crime".

[Maskless]

That BBC article has been reported to the Met Police as a "Hate Crime". And it seems that others are now going to follow suit and perhaps even inundate the Met with this silly and vexatious claim.

Just when you think they cannot do anything more bonkers, they surprise you again.... and again.

@MonsignorMirth

i don't know if it qualifies as "hate crime" but it's certainly hateful at least.

You didn't make it to the third post in this thread then?
No, there was no crime.
The target was rapists. If you think that applies to all transwomen, Margarita, that's on you.
Do you believe the women who have given their accounts in the bbc article?
I know you won't answer, so I don't know why I bother.

I see I was correct and marg was not able to state that they believe the women win the article.

@MargaritaPie

So "transwomen are rapists"?

You can keep implying (falsely and disengeously) that anyone on this thread has said this or you can face up to the fact that transwomen (as males) have capacity to rape. No one on this thread has said that all men rape in the same way that no one on this thread has said that all transwomen rape. Principally because its not true - but that's what was said in the BBC article - 'some'. Not all.

You, along with with the rape apologist signatories of that open letter, seem unable to grasp this.

Is the point here meant to be that a transwoman picked at random is more likely to be a rapist than a random non-transwoman?

In terms of members of the transgender community in prison.

The court heard that in 2019 there were 163 transgender prisoners in England and Waless*, 81 of whom had been convicted of one or more sexual offences.** ( The Guardian)

This percentage of transgender prisoners convicted of sexual offenses can be compared to the general male prison population.

As at 31 March 2019 there were 13,359 prisoners serving sentences for sexual offences, which represented 18% of the sentenced prison population.
( offender management statistics bulletin)

This suggest that that a more in depth study around the issues raised Margarita would be helpful, it could well have happened? If it has a link could help answer her question.
It would certainly seem possible that there are statistical differences in sexual offending rates between biological males who identify as transgender and those who don't.
Although without a more in depth study I wouldn't want to state anything as certain.

@MargaritaPie

So "transwomen are rapists"?

Don't be silly. You do realise there were some transwomen happy to contribute to the piece - neither rapists nor rape apologists. Perhaps you should try to gain some of their rationality.

Trying to deflect from your appalling rape apology post ?

No one is helped by wild statements such as " trans women are rapists" however.
They are inflammatory and untrue, which is why no one is actually saying anything like that.

I’m quoting MonsignorMirth here

You seem completely unable to determine what makes someone a rapist or not. Clue: it's raping.

And again

You seem completely unable to determine what makes someone a rapist or not. Clue: it's raping.

Because I think someone needs to understand this.

Marg seriously

You seem completely unable to determine what makes someone a rapist or not. Clue: it's raping.

Do you get it yet?

A rapist is someone who rapes.

And no rapist has a special identity that makes that untrue.

No one is helped by wild statements such as " trans women are rapists" however. They are inflammatory and untrue, which is why no one is actually saying anything like that.

Well, one person is. I'm not going to respond to our friend from PIE but at this point, where they are just constantly spouting transphobic guff and rape appologism, I think we should all just ignore and report their posts.

@donquixotedelamancha

No one is helped by wild statements such as " trans women are rapists" however. They are inflammatory and untrue, which is why no one is actually saying anything like that.

Well, one person is. I'm not going to respond to our friend from PIE but at this point, where they are just constantly spouting transphobic guff and rape appologism, I think we should all just ignore and report their posts.

I agree. They have shown us exactly who they are on this thread. Contemptible

'Given the number of transwomen in the world, yes you could say "some transwomen are rapists". You could also say the same for just about any given group.'

Yes.

Some male sports coaches are rapists.
Some male police officers are rapists.
Some male people who work in retail/ engineering/ banks/ teaching etc etc are rapists.
Some male people who are or claim a transgender identity are rapists.

Some male people are rapists.

Some female people commit sex offences. Sure. But the frequency, range, persistency, etc etc are statistically nothing in the face of the pervasive nature of male sex offending. From flashing to voyeurism to CSA to grooming to illegal images on net to rape to sexually motivated murder.

So no. It's not any given group. It's males no matter how you group them.

Interestingly this point has resulted in a new direction on social media from those who advocate loudly for trans people.

The latest take is-

Cis men are the risk.
All women (TWAW) are vulnerable to this risk.
Women should protect and help other women (TWAW).
If someone who claims a trans ID commits a sex offence then obviously they were a cis man. Cis men are the problem. No TW would commit a sex offence by definition.

(How this fits with women do it too, I'm not sure. That would mean TW are much less likely to commit sex offences than 'other' women. On what basis. Some may ask but won't get an answer).

Oh and also the idea that a male would go to 'all the trouble' of accessing spaces by saying trans etc is hilarious. As no man would go to that trouble (what trouble?) and if a man wants to attack a woman or a girl then he will and nothing anyone can do about that.

Whole thread on OJ laughing about how stupid women are on this.

Laughing. Just abysmal.

Its more denial of science...Predators never stalk their prey, no of course not.

Plus all the sexual assault male prisoners now identifying as women clearly just saw the light and suddenly their desire to use and abuse women, and associated risks to women, just disappeared.

Cis men are the risk.
All women (TWAW) are vulnerable to this risk.
Women should protect and help other women (TWAW).
If someone who claims a trans ID commits a sex offence then obviously they were a cis man. Cis men are the problem. No TW would commit a sex offence by definition.

Ah - so presumably they now understand why self ID is such a bad idea? Bad for women, bad for genuine trans people. No?

@MargaritaPie

So "transwomen are rapists"?

No. Rapists are men or transwomen.

That doesn't mean men and transwomen are rapists.

It means that all rapists are either men or transwomen. It doesn't mean that all men and all transwomen are rapists.

Lesson 1 in logic.

Given the number of transwomen in the world, yes you could say "some transwomen are rapists". You could also say the same for just about any given group.

Are you still mangling logic Marg Given group = men.

As you have been told often before, rape needs a penis. Men have them!

Is the point here meant to be that a transwoman picked at random is more likely to be a rapist than a random non-transwoman?

Non transwomen? Women? Or other men?

Because yes. As all extant research, the proper stuff, shows, transwomen have the same offending patterns, behaviours, instances as any other man.

But you know that. You've been a few threads very recently where you have quibbled, cavilled, 'misunderstood' and misrepresented.

When someone tells you who he is believe him. Sick and tired of males coming here to tell us we are wrong when we object to rape culture. Other pp are absolutely right to say that no sacred caste should be immune from safeguarding checks and questions about their motives.

Pressuring someone into sex after they say no is rape!!
Jesus baby christ some ppl have no self awareness at all.
pressure, coersion or fear all negate consent. therefore all are rape.
I suppose you would call my rapist a sexual harrasser, because he didnt drag me down a dark alley with a knife to my throat. .god are we still here? really?
Nobody is saying all transwomen are rapists, just like nobody is saying all Pakistani taxi drivers or Turkish kebab shop owners are rapists. .but some are..and their victims deserve to be heard, believed and protected.
Not disbelieved, minimised, slandered and told to shut up because of some imagined special status of the rapist or the class they come from.
They're rapists. They dont get a pass or protection. Especially not to the detriment of their victims.
You wanna stand up and defend rapists??
thats on you but I'll warn you its really not a good look.
Thousands of working class girls were systemically raped up and down this country, its still happening, because the people who should have stopped it were scared of being called racist. boo fucking hoo. it wasn't a good enough excuse then and it still isnt now.
You wanna call somebody out and point the finger to people making transwomen look bad, point it at the rapists among them and the people making the same old desperate attempts to excuse appalling, degrading, life ruining behaviour.

@PanicPrevention

Pressuring someone into sex after they say no is rape!! Jesus baby christ some ppl have no self awareness at all. pressure, coersion or fear all negate consent. therefore all are rape. I suppose you would call my rapist a sexual harrasser, because he didnt drag me down a dark alley with a knife to my throat. .god are we still here? really? Nobody is saying all transwomen are rapists, just like nobody is saying all Pakistani taxi drivers or Turkish kebab shop owners are rapists. .but some are..and their victims deserve to be heard, believed and protected. Not disbelieved, minimised, slandered and told to shut up because of some imagined special status of the rapist or the class they come from. They're rapists. They dont get a pass or protection. Especially not to the detriment of their victims. You wanna stand up and defend rapists?? thats on you but I'll warn you its really not a good look. Thousands of working class girls were systemically raped up and down this country, its still happening, because the people who should have stopped it were scared of being called racist. boo fucking hoo. it wasn't a good enough excuse then and it still isnt now. You wanna call somebody out and point the finger to people making transwomen look bad, point it at the rapists among them and the people making the same old desperate attempts to excuse appalling, degrading, life ruining behaviour.

This 👆well said

If someone who claims a trans ID commits a sex offence then obviously they were a cis man. Cis men are the problem. No TW would commit a sex offence by definition.

Well, that makes a start on resolving the prisons issue. By their reasoning, all male sex offenders who are currently in women’s prisons are lying about being trans & can be moved back to the male estate. And the violent ones too?

50% of transwomen in prison are sex offenders. Only 18% of men in prison are sex offenders. That would seem to suggest that transwomen are more likely to be rapists than men are.
And you can’t wriggle out by saying they “weren’t really trans”. Stonewall insists on no exceptions- anyone who says they are trans, must be accepted as trans.
All rather inconvenient for the TRAs trying to force self ID through against the wishes of the vast majority of women.

*Pressuring someone into sex (and persisting after they say no) is certainly sexual harassment, but it's not actual rape unless they've gone ahead and committed a rape.

Straight out of the MRA handbook.

@Babdoc

50% of transwomen in prison are sex offenders. Only 18% of men in prison are sex offenders. That would seem to suggest that transwomen are more likely to be rapists than men are.

This really needs shouting about if correct. Do you have a source?

** I originally noticed the difference in offending stats but they come with a health warning I am not a statistician.
I don't know what is behind the difference. I have included the sources I used below.

The court heard that in 2019 there were 163 transgender prisoners in England and Waless, 81 of whom had been convicted of one or more sexual offences.** ( The Guardian)

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/society/2021/jul/02/trans-women-with-sex-offence-convictions-in-female-jails-lawful-rules-judge

This percentage of transgender prisoners convicted of sexual offenses can be compared to the general male prison population.

As at 31 March 2019 there were 13,359 prisoners serving sentences for sexual offences, which represented 18% of the sentenced prison population.
( offender management statistics bulletin)*

https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN04334/SN04334.pdf

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachmentdata/file/982382/OffenderrManagementStatisticssQuarterlyQ44_2020.pdf

[quote Kendodd]**@Babdoc

50% of transwomen in prison are sex offenders. Only 18% of men in prison are sex offenders. That would seem to suggest that transwomen are more likely to be rapists than men are.

This really needs shouting about if correct. Do you have a source?[/quote]
Of course there's available data from reputable sources. Unlike others we GC women are always held to account for every bloody word and opinion we utter.

We can't get away with all the lies, disinformation and crass defamation usually lobbed at us!