Karen

[littlebilliie]

I am so sick of this term being used to belittle women. I definitely this this is misogynistic hate speech.

Middle aged women and older who had an opinion were always respected and listen to, now if a women of any age speaks out she is ridiculed.

I think we should call the Karen term out for what it is.

@Chocaholic9 - thank you 😊. And yes to ignoring them!

I think it's just a name for women being incredibly unreasonable isn't it?

No.

Generally in the UK a male behaving in such a manner is called a wanker..this happened to me last Sunday ...I work in a place with limited on street parking ..we have a gateway into our courtyard..a Porsche pulled into the gateway , initially I thought they were just dropping passenger off but then the male driver got out , locked the car and started getting luggage from the front in a leisurely manner . I politely asked him not to block our gateway as cars come in and out all the time ...if he'd said sorry I'll only be a minute ( he lives opposite ) I'd have said ok be quick ..but no ..full on entitlement .. "Do you own the road ?do you own the road ?"..I said I just wanted him not to block our driveway ..as I walked away I may have said , louder than I should , "Porsche Wanker "....he stormed up to me and asked if I wanted a fight and how dare I call him a wanker..

this is the type of behaviour originally identified as a Karen ..rude entitled bullying , not for a genuine reasonable complaint of poor service etc ..
So 'Karen ' may now be seen as an ageist and mysoginistic slur , but it was originally a signifier of a woman being ..well ..a wanker .

It was “mardy cow” and “miserable git” in my day… but then I’m northern. I only know lovely people called Karen btw.

This repressive speech-policing... eh. Let's ban a few books for wrongthink while we're at all. As a writer, I flinch every time posts like this appear.

Stock characters have been used in comedy since the dawn of time (well... of theatre, anyway). Women make up 50% of the population and we are not above satire or being the butt of jokes. We are not and nor should we be. Karen has a male counterpart more or less in "gammon" (OK, he's more definitely white, admittedly). Rich out of touch toffs making bad decisions at the BBC are Tristans, someone friendless is Billy No-Mates... I could list these all night, but I am off out.

Where I will not dispute the bill or summon the manager. For I am not a Karen.

I also think it is awful. Feel sorry for all the Karen's out there.

My dd called me a Karen yesterday when I was explaining that waving your phone around making a tiktok in the front passenger seat so my vision is obscured is not acceptable.

I explained I was parenting her and it is not a nice term to use at any time. Got more verbal backlash but didnt call me a Karen again.

'Where I will not dispute the bill or summon the manager. For I am not a Karen.'

This is hilarious-

For I am not a Karen!

Bit overblown, almost a Shakespearean feel!

And I don't believe you. No matter what? Come off it!

IME men and women are equally as likely to be horrible customers. So...

Rose-

Room in back? She goes there.
She could have got bus/ walked etc? Let her.
Has she apologised?

Guessing a teen and I was a horrible one! Read her the riot act!

So anyone who disputes a bill, ever?? Is a Karen? Really? Even if the bill is wrong?

And summoning the manager? That’s Karen-esqe too? Even when that’s what the manager is there for?

So anyone who disputes a bill, ever?? Is a Karen? Really? Even if the bill is wrong?

Its absolutely ridiculous

There is no male version of Karen…

Karen has a male counterpart more or less in "gammon" (OK, he's more definitely white, admittedly)

Gammon? When did Gammon become a man's name. I've never met anyone called Gammon.

The only useful thing about "gammon" is that like "Karen" it's a handy indicator that the person using it lacks any imagination, is a little bit dim and it really isn't worth wasting time giving any consideration of their opinions on anything.

It's just a way for (mainly) men to insult women they don't approve of that isn't as blatant as the stuff they've always said.

Putting the boot into women who are middle aged+ and don't have the decency to try and be invisible has always been in fashion...

Or in fact women/ girls who are confident/ outspoken etc full stop. And if they aren't even sexy to look at, then well. They're the worst of the worst.

@NiceGerbil
Yes teen. We were on the way to meet family friends.

I couldnt pull over as in no stopping zone. But I made sure she didnt have her phone on the way home.

Kids went to their dad for the day today.
I went out in the car on my own to a NT place. Had a nice time with no phone waving and moody teens calling me a Karen etc

Livebythecoast

My name is Karen. I've said this before on another thread, one where a woman actually changed her name because of it..... My lovely mum (rip) gave me my name and loved it. It's upsetting it's used as a slur now, just one word 'Karen' and everyone knows what it means and represents. My younger colleagues joke at work about it and say 'but you're not a typical 'Karen' hmm. If I dare to have an opinion on something then of course I'm just living up to this ridiculous meme.
I agree with @chaosrabbitland, it's lazy, one word, job done. Very sad sad

Yep, this is me too. I've seriously been thinking of changing my name. I had to return something to a shop the other day, I was friendly and polite (always am), had to give my name, the lady behind the counter sniggered.

Good for you rose!

I've got the teen bit coming soon... 😕

@SusannaRowan

Livebythecoast

My name is Karen. I've said this before on another thread, one where a woman actually changed her name because of it..... My lovely mum (rip) gave me my name and loved it. It's upsetting it's used as a slur now, just one word 'Karen' and everyone knows what it means and represents. My younger colleagues joke at work about it and say 'but you're not a typical 'Karen' hmm. If I dare to have an opinion on something then of course I'm just living up to this ridiculous meme.
I agree with @chaosrabbitland, it's lazy, one word, job done. Very sad sad

Yep, this is me too. I've seriously been thinking of changing my name. I had to return something to a shop the other day, I was friendly and polite (always am), had to give my name, the lady behind the counter sniggered.

I won't change my name. I would feel like I was disrespecting my lovely Mum 😔. I do know how you feel though - I can't believe someone sniggered at you. I haven't encountered that by strangers but like I say, work colleagues 'joke' about it thinking they're hilarious. I have to give my name out a lot at work and feel judged which isn't a nice feeling.

I often would like to see the manager. Apparently that makes me a Karen. But I don’t want to see the manager to give the shop assistant a hard time, it is because I want a senior member of staff at the shop I am spending my money to be accountable for issues. Sadly nowadays lots of shops don’t have managers. For example our branch of McDonalds has huge queues all the time and long waits for food but it is the poor teenagers serving who have to deal with the complaints.

The term Karen represents a specific type of women in America and the male equivalent is indeed Ken and is used quite frequently.
In America. Customer service and servitude is a big thing as lots of job rely on tips. There’s a lot of these ‘get the manager’ types here and the original Karen/Ken meme depicts these people quite accurately if I’m honest. However now it’s being used against all women to silence or belittle them. Similarly to ‘woke’.

The PP was correct we have gammons, snow flakes, Beckys, Stacys, Susans, Chads, Brads, Kevins. They’re just pejorative slang that came about from meme culture and stereotypes.
They’re being used incorrectly yes and against women but that doesn’t amount to them being a slur.

@lazylinguist

There was a thread calling for MNHQ to auto-ban 'Karen', which is frankly ridiculous. You could write a list of a gazillion words which are sexist and insulting - and another list of words which are insilting to all kinds of other groups. We can't ban them all, or it would get silly. Personally I'm happy to let these words stand - they are a good way of spotting people whose opinions aren't worth consideration.

Shockingly lazy approach. So you're happy to label and perpetuate ageist and sexist sterotypes rather than recognise/evaluate/respond to individual actions? Your last sentance is one of the most blinkered views I've read on here.

Sorry...should be 'sentence'...typing too fast!

The term Karen represents a specific type of women in America and the male equivalent is indeed Ken and is used quite frequently.
In America. Customer service and servitude is a big thing as lots of job rely on tips. There’s a lot of these ‘get the manager’ types here and the original Karen/Ken meme depicts these people quite accurately if I’m honest.

See now, others are claiming that it is a name for racist woman. You’re claiming it’s a name for a “get the manager type” Some memes claim it’s a name for a woman with a specific hair style proof that it doesn’t actually have a definition.

@MargaritaPie

Chad isn't a male equivalent of Karen, it's basically refers to a stereotypical "alpha" man with muscles. There's a meme about it.

I think that Laura Bates mentions 'Chad' in her book Men Who Hate Women, where she looks at Incel culture. Chad was the Incel name for men who they perceive as more successful then them, in life, career, with women, etc and they were hated by the Incels almost as much as they hate women .

Chad fits more with your interpretation than it does with being a 'male Karen' name. Other than that book, I can't even think that I've seen or heard of Chad being used in the UK for either meaning.

I cannot stand these 'silencer' names being used, and Karen is by far the most prevalent. I volunteer and have heard it used most by fourteen year old girls, always aimed at older women, teachers they aren't happy with, their own mothers, etc.

I agree but what’s worse is it’s usually women using it to put other women down.

It did not start out as a term to use to dismiss women. It was about certain behaviours by white women (usually, but also men) with some status to browbeat and threaten black Americans out of doing their jobs or standing up for themselves.

If more people recognised the racist origins of this slur they would be less likely to use it.