My wife

[1990schild]

I'm worried about my wife. She seems very disorganised and happy to live in chaos, the latest issue which got to me was forgetting to bring nappies when we were out and about which caused me to get annoyed (I won't go into detail).
It could be just tiredness through lack of sleep but I have worries that something more long term is going on.
My wife never makes any time for herself including basics like having a shower, catching up with sleep or to sort messy house out. I don't really enjoy living with mountains of toys pilled up everywhere, food pushed to the back of couches and areas left dirty and untidy. We don't have free space to even put a cup of tea down, everything is just pilled up, everywhere. I've never lived like this in my life until now, it's clutter HQ.
It feels like I'm being forced to live in her chaotic ways. Feels a bit suffocating, frustrating and makes my brain feel foggy and my thinking is unclear.
She sometimes goes 3, 4, 5 days without having a shower, she says because it's always inconvenient (kids are tired or I'm stressing out). We sleep in separate beds, she has the youngest and I have my 4 year old son. Both kids slept on her causing her to miss out on sleep.
She seems to have the belief that as a parent if your not suffering then your doing it wrong. She won't accept any help like letting someone else take care of the kids to do important stuff like shower etc. To do things as a couple like go out together, just us, is totally out of the picture. Feels sometimes like our relationship has ended in a way.
She says she has separation issues and doesn't want to let the kids out of her sights.
As you can imagine seeing them go to childcare or nursery has been hard and emotional.
Her way to parenting is actually starting to have a negative impact on me. Feel pressured to always be there when I'm not at work.
I can't to anything alone, having a shower or going for a poo is not easy because my son wants to follow me everywhere.
Personally I need a tiny bit of 'me time' away from the kids as a reset from the strains of being a parent in demand. She gets stressed having two young children but is far too stubborn to admit it.

I thought that when a second child came along she would loosen her grip over her separation issues. That hasn't happened and finding time to be in relationship together, get stuff done, and time to relax is never planned or organised.
I feel like 'kids always come first' approach has been taken to an extreme and now our mental health is suffering a bit. I feel that issues from her past are now manifesting into a bigger mental health issue and are impacting on not just her but three other people's lives.

It's hard for me to approach this with her because she is very stubborn plus she is a very loving parent and wife. I don't want to break her or worse loose her.

*Oh so it's turn into a hatefest. I'll leave now.

A man who takes his wife's name, changes jobs to suit family life better, spends all his non-work time with his family, and no longer indulges in any of his interests is obviously a horrible man.*

What did you expect? You're saying the house is a shit hole yet you're not pulling your weight.

When your wife is doing 80% of the household work after working full time, what are you doing?
Why don't you start to tackle a room at a time to get rid of the clutter and then keep on top of the cleaning schedule? Why don't you take the children out? Why can't you start taking care of the things that bother you around the house when your wife is busy with the 80% of the household work and you are done with the remaining 20%?

And please don't have any more children till you can cope with the ones you have.

@1990schild

Oh so it's turn into a hatefest. I'll leave now.

A man who takes his wife's name, changes jobs to suit family life better, spends all his non-work time with his family, and no longer indulges in any of his interests is obviously a horrible man.

Well by your post, yes you do sound like a horrible man.

Maybe rather than have a tantrum, explore the idea that maybe your wife isn't the problem. You are.

Tell your wife to get on here and we'll give her some good advice about how to get her life and mental health sorted.

Was she untidy before children? Hoarding tendencies? Or is this purely since children?

I’m going to go against the flow here @1990schild and say you have to assert yourself for al your sakes. You can see that all is not well so you need to articulated very clearly your concern for her, the fact that the home is not a suitable environment for children, the stress it’s causing you and the need for change.

She is clearly unable to get a handle on it, so you must.

Just take care to be supportive of her personally at the same time as saying “this is the line, we need to meet this line for the children’s sake”.

@1990schild

Oh so it's turn into a hatefest. I'll leave now.

A man who takes his wife's name, changes jobs to suit family life better, spends all his non-work time with his family, and no longer indulges in any of his interests is obviously a horrible man.

Oh dear God. There are obviously issues in the relationship and parenting in your house but you need to grow a pair and realise that you are significantly contributing to the situation.

I have no idea why you think doing 20% of housework when you both work full time is acceptable or doing more than ‘most men’.

@1990schild

Oh so it's turn into a hatefest. I'll leave now.

A man who takes his wife's name, changes jobs to suit family life better, spends all his non-work time with his family, and no longer indulges in any of his interests is obviously a horrible man.

You didn't hear what you wanted to hear, did you? Diddums.

@1990schild

Oh so it's turn into a hatefest. I'll leave now.

A man who takes his wife's name, changes jobs to suit family life better, spends all his non-work time with his family, and no longer indulges in any of his interests is obviously a horrible man.

Isn't that what most men with a young family and both parents with full time jobs do? Name change isn't relevant.

Yeah what's the deal with mentioning the name change when women have been doing it for centuries? Slow clap for you OP.

Oh so it's turn into a hatefest. I'll leave now.

A man who takes his wife's name, changes jobs to suit family life better, spends all his non-work time with his family, and no longer indulges in any of his interests is obviously a horrible man.

Truth hurts does it? What was the point of ‘changing your job to suit family life better’ if you’re going to be of absolute no use to your family while home? As you you giving up your hobbies, if you’re not going to muck in with the housework and cooking, take up walking again but make yourself by taking the kids with you so that at least your DW can get a couple of hours peace whilst living out her life if drudgery.

To the people giving OP a kicking (and full disclosure, I divorced a hoarder, so I’ve either got insight or I’m projecting), does it not seem very, VERY odd that if one spouse is doing 80% of the housework and actively talking the other spouse out of doing more, that there is such extensively clutter that there is not space to put a mug down?

Does that not suggest the 80% she is doing isn’t actually housework? More like anti-housework. You have to put energy into generating extensive clutter.

So she may genuinely need help and OP may genuinely want to give it but be as perplexed and overwhelmed as he purports to be.

Sorry for all the grammatical errors, but you’ve got me fuming!

@theqentity

Yeah what's the deal with mentioning the name change when women have been doing it for centuries? Slow clap for you OP.

Oh for the love of fuck.

OP is accused of basically being a stereotypical sexist arse.

OP adduces brief bulletin point evidence that he isn’t in fact a stereotypical sexist arse. (Whether it should be or not, a man taking his wife’s name is still VANISHINGLY unusual and therefore noteworthy.)

You have a go anyway. Give a human being a break.

Maybe he is a self-deluding semi-sexist arse or maybe he’s a worried but decent human at the end of his tether.

Stop putting all the blame on your wife for your messy house. You both work fulltime so you are both equally responsible for housework. Tell her it’s bothering you and you’re going to change things so that the house stays in a less cluttered state.
Could you afford a cleaner for a couple of hours a week? - they could vacuum/mop and wipe down all kitchen/bathroom surfaces in that time. If you hire a cleaner you would need to spend a weekend sorting the house first. Cleaners don’t tidy, they clean. It would be an incentive every week to clear the floors and bench tops so that the cleaner can clean them.
Start teaching the kids to tidy up - start with putting their toys back in boxes. They can also learn to do things like put their clothes in the laundry basket. You can give them a toy broom or vacuum to ´help’ with while you actually clean. A dustpan and brush works well if you don’t want to buy specific toy cleaning equipment. You will need to tag team looking after the kids and cleaning the house at least the first time.
Have you got a dishwasher? If not, you need one. Could be your job to fill it and empty it every day. Some couples find it works well if they are each entirely responsible for different aspects of housekeeping - if your wife does the cooking then you could do all the washing up. Or if that drives you mad because she used too many pots and pans in your opinion then you should be in charge of the laundry and bins and getting the kids to tidy their bedroom floor every night. It doesn’t matter exactly how you divide things up as long as it’s fairly even and everything that’s important to you both gets done.
You could also start teaching the 4yr old to put there own plate, cup and cutlery in the dishwasher after dinner.
Start doing more days out with your wife and kids - it can be really simple, like a walk in the woods with a picnic, or a trip to a bigger more interesting park/playground and a takeaway coffee for you and your wife. Start doing those walks again, but just make them a child friendly length - takes snacks and either an all terrain buggy or a baby carrier for the youngest. It’s not the same as going out just the two of you, but it’s quality family time and it may well be something your wife really wants.

the latest issue which got to me was forgetting to bring nappies when we were out and about which caused me to get annoyed

I couldnt get past this. It is normal to forget things if you are juggling so many things (which it seems she is) where are you backing it up - also making sure that everything is there.

thoosa I think you'll find one partner is doing 100% of everything while the other one criticises and berates her and tries to get other women to give him ammunition to use against her.

@WoozieFloozie

Well, you got the 'child' part of your username correct anyway. When you finish your little tantrum maybe read the constructive advice if you actually do want to help your wife and family.

Don’t be even more of a prat than you already are. Go back and have a read of your own breakdown of work, housework and cooking and then take a long hard look at yourself.

Jesus Christ. I despair of women settling for inadequates like OP.

It's hard for me to approach this with her because she is very stubborn plus she is a very loving parent and wife. I don't want to break her or worse loose her.

That’s where you’ve gone wrong. You can’t let the whole family live in filth because you’re afraid to talk to her. You’re the only one who can help her.

I’m concerned you need help because she needs help and you haven’t got it from this thread.

Change your name, leave it a week, post again with MUCH more detail in the OP. What are the issues from the past? What happens if you just ignore her and try to get stuck in to clearing the mess? When did it start? What was she like before kids? Why is the dynamic that you can’t raise issues for fear of losing her?

Also describe exactly what the house is like and what you’ve tried already:

If you put the whole thing down in excruciating detail, and don’t leave room for it to possibly sound like you’re being a typical sexist twat, you will get a helpful response.

Maybe try the relationship board.

Good luck.

@beastlyslumber

thoosa I think you'll find one partner is doing 100% of everything while the other one criticises and berates her and tries to get other women to give him ammunition to use against her.

Maybe, maybe not.

If he’s genuinely trying to navigate something complicated, he needs support and whichever way there’s a woman in crisis behind this story.

Im inclined to think this is a reverse, but incase it isn't...

You say "She won't accept any help like letting someone else take care of the kids to do important stuff like shower etc. " When the bulk of everything is left to your DW the tendency will be to just want to do it all because it actually takes more time and energy to delegate, to explain what you need help with, set up the systems and trust it will be done. Sometimes it's easier to sleep with the child and get some precious rest than instigate sleep routines. When you're running on empty you just take the the least effort in the moment approach.

@Thoosa

It's hard for me to approach this with her because she is very stubborn plus she is a very loving parent and wife. I don't want to break her or worse loose her.

That’s where you’ve gone wrong. You can’t let the whole family live in filth because you’re afraid to talk to her. You’re the only one who can help her.

I’m concerned you need help because she needs help and you haven’t got it from this thread.

Change your name, leave it a week, post again with MUCH more detail in the OP. What are the issues from the past? What happens if you just ignore her and try to get stuck in to clearing the mess? When did it start? What was she like before kids? Why is the dynamic that you can’t raise issues for fear of losing her?

Also describe exactly what the house is like and what you’ve tried already:

If you put the whole thing down in excruciating detail, and don’t leave room for it to possibly sound like you’re being a typical sexist twat, you will get a helpful response.

Maybe try the relationship board.

Good luck.

His family are living in filth because he isn’t pulling his weight!

If he’s genuinely trying to navigate something complicated, he needs support and whichever way there’s a woman in crisis behind this story.

I think you are being extremely generous to this man who gets angry with his wife for forgetting nappies he could have remembered himself ("I won't go into detail" - wonder why?) and thinks that "me-time" for his wife should include cleaning the house.

If he genuinely wants to help his wife then he needs to start by cleaning the house. His self-reported 20% of domestic share is obviously not making a difference. Let him get to a genuine 50% before coming on here and complaining about his wife.

Well if you both work FT then you should be doing 50/50 of childcare, housework and cooking (adjusted for exact hours and commuting)

So start by fixing yourself. The mess you describe is 50% you. Write down everything that you think needs doing. Tell her what you will take over and start doing it.

You won’t be identifying anywhere near 50% of the work, but it’s a start. In 3 months time you can review with her.

She sounds depressed, and should she her GP, but if you start pulling your weight, your overall situation will improve and it will be easier to persuade her to get help.

You are letting your kids and wife down. Pull you finger out and do some work.

The reason I’m inclined to believe him @Duracellbunnywannabe is because he says;

It feels like I'm being forced to live in her chaotic ways. Feels a bit suffocating, frustrating and makes my brain feel foggy and my thinking is unclear.

That’s what living in someone else’s mess feels like. Something is amiss in that house if he’s feeling like that instead of just putting the hoover round. It must be more than either of them can cope with.

So that’s a man, a woman, and two children living in “chaos” with “no room to put a chopping board” to cook and food shoved to the back of the sofa”. Which is an emergency.

On the MH board of MN, I thought we were at the very least pro women, pro children and pro good mental health?

And I don’t actually give a shit if he’s made it worse. Blame doesn’t help.

He’s asked for help now and he’s got abuse.

So who else in that house will reach out for help anywhere this week?