I have a 7 week old baby and some suicudal thoughts. Is this just rational?

[splendide]

My DS is 7 weeks today and I don't think I can handle being a mum. The sleep deprevation is killing me, I'm feeding him constantly. He had a tongue tie which went undiagnosed until Wednesday just gone. He hasn't gained much weight and is only about 7lbs now. I was hoping things would be better after the tongue tie snip but they aren't.

Anyway I'm having some pretty dark thoughts and I know I should tell the HV or GP but what could they do? It's pretty rational to want out of this situation. Do meds really make any difference? I'll still be a mother who can't feed her child and still having no sleep and still in a situation where ive ruined my life. How are drugs or counselling going to change that?

This was me with dd. She had tongue tie which took nearly 12 weeks to fix.

It felt dark and lonely. I also felt guilty I couldn't feed my baby. And I was confused as nothing seemed to help.

I also remember feeling suicidal. But I have an older ds and knew that it would damage him as it did my mother when her mother died. So I kept going.

Looking back, I should have got help. But what I do was get out of the house every day, I used mumsnet to talk about the feeding problems and kept going.

I was reluctant to use formula - because my ds was intolerant to it but actually I should have gone to the gp and got some.

Talk to the HV, just about how things are. You don't have to tell them everything but just to get perspective.

And keep talking on here, take one day at a time. Also find a decent bf counsellor.

My dd is now 3 and an absolute joy she really is. I'm glad I am here to be with her.

Thanks all.

That's the terrible thing Extra, I don't have any choice or way out other than removing myself entirely from the situation. But I couldn't do that to DH really or my mum and dad.

'll see my GP tomorrow if I can and I have a lactation consultant coming to the house tomorrow lunchtime so maybe she can give some hope on the breastfeeding. I'd switch to formula right now if I thought it would make any difference. Maybe the HV can advise me. Poor DS has just been constantlu hungry so maybe I should.

Why wouldn't formula make a difference?

Hi splendide, I recognise you from the sleep threads as we both have non sleeping infants.
Firstly I'm so sorry you feel this way. At my most sleep deprived I too felt like I could not carry on as I was so tired although I wouldn't say I was suicidal, just knackered.
I was despairing at 7 weeks but DS is now 9weeks and honestly it is getting better. So you might be just around the corner from some improvement.
But please do speak to someone as they can help.

Good - because at every stage I have made/ continue to make really bad desicions and I'm sure adding formula would be one as well. He could be allergic or get reflux or he'll be impossible to settle. I'm terrified to stay as I am and terrified to make any changes.

Thanks Rainbow, I'd love to believe it'll get better but I can't see it im afraid.

Darling, please believe that help will make a difference. Please believe that PND is both horribly common - MN is packed with women who've had it - and also something you don't have to put up with. The professionals can help with medication and can help with the baby.

I know that at seven weeks I honestly couldn't see that things would ever get better. But they did.

Oh my God, sleep deprivation is the absolute worst. To be honest, my DS is 4 now and sleeps fine, but if I have a night or two of broken sleep through illness or what have you, I actually start to feel quite low!! It's amazing what it can do. It's used as a method of torture for a reason!

Medication helps, SO SO much!! You think clearer, the world slows down and it's not so much of the sudden highs and crashing, bone crunching lows. It evens it out so you can bloody think straight. People say they take a couple of weeks to build up; I noticed the difference literally straight away. I had a friend feel the same as well. Maybe placebo, but I'm not so sure.

You wouldn't put a sticking plaster over a broken hip. You'd go straight to hospital, no messing.

I know and I remember that feeling. For 21st century women it is suffocating to become effectively a slave. But you cannot remove yourself without creating a huge amount of pain for your ds, your dh and everyone who knows you, for the rest of their lives.

But the way out that you do have is to seek out all the help you can, professional and support from friends and family. As the poster said above, it isn't always easy to get help but push as much as you need to for ds' sake.

I also switched to formula after 3 weeks. The hormones with bf actually made me worse, and I think it can happen for some people. Give a bottle a try, perhaps.

I am very pro breastfeeding but I also found switching to mixed feeding with DD1 helped because it shifted the awful sense of being responsible for everything.

I'm sure adding formula would be one as well. He could be allergic or get reflux or he'll be impossible to settle. I'm terrified to stay as I am and terrified to make any changes.

Or he could be absolutely fine. Most babies are.

Remember Mumsnet threads give you a skewed view of feeding and how complicated it is. People post about problems, bf or ff. All the people for whom feeding is going well don't start threads although they may offer really good advice to people who are having issues.

This was me once Splendide. I thought I'd made a huge mistake.

Take each feed one at a time. It's horrible when your baby is still so.tiny but it will be ok. The lactation consultant should help a lot. With DS (my second) his TT was snipped at 5 days but we really had to go back to basics with breastfeeding and work at it. Formula is not poison and maybe one feed just to give you some more sleep will help. This is entirely your choice. For me personally giving up BF entirely would have made me feel worse but not everyone would feel that way.

Please please please ask for an urgent GP appointment tomorrow. You may find it useful to look at the BfN drugs in breast milk fact sheets on taking antidepressants - they helped me get what I needed from a GP who wouldn't prescribe while I was BF.

I know this feels it won't get better but it does, it really really does. I didn't feel like I loved my daughter for about 12 weeks, ADs were prescribed at 10 weeks, so probably not a coincidence. Please talk to your mum, sister, friend, GP, DH, anyone. This will get better.

My advice would be to formula feed as well. Happy mum = happy baby and you have done so well to get to this point.

DH can do a day or 2 of feeds (good bonding for them) while you sleep. I promise, you will wake up with the world a different place. Then you if you choose can mix feed. I did this after similar problems, and it was wonderful.

Formula also keeps them fuller for longer so a bigger gap between feeds.

I'm so sorry if this isn't what you wanted to hear, I fought against formula for so long and wish I hadn't. I lost those magical early days.

Ok, genuinely. Send DH out to buy some ready made formula bottles, Tesco express will have, I found aptamil to be the best. Heat it to room temp, and either cup or spoon feed baby.

You will be just fine

Just typed out a massive reply then lost it - aargh! The main gist of it was, do whatever you want regarding the feeding. If you want to breastfeed, then keep at it. It does honestly get better eventually, even though it doesn't seem like it now. The next feed your little one needs, feed him, then change his nappy and get your husband to take him out for a walk for an hour or so while you sleep. And I do mean sleep - put your phone on silent and turn off the wifi! Your baby won't starve in that time and you need some proper rest.

Some babies are little, it's as simple as that. My friend switched to formula for the exact reasons as you and he still didn't put weight on and she just had to accept that's how he is. And he's perfectly healthy and ahead for his age!

It doesn't seem like it now, but you're doing an excellent job, especially as you've had such difficulties with feeding that you've persisted through. Good luck, keep communicating and go get that sleep! X

Splendide, I felt like you do 6 years ago, after the birth of dc3. It was awful and I look back to that time with sheer horror.
Because I was at my wits end and felt so bad I could not see it getting better ever.
Looking back, I'm amazed I actually got in that dark place, I already had dc, I had bf both, I just fell into a hole.

You will get through. I remember looking back at that time with confusion as to what the hell had happened. Like everything was a shade darker, not just all my thoughts but everything I looked at. Even in the brightest sunshine I saw clouds.

Sleep deprivation turned me into a wreck. I was on medication for a year, it helped me to be able to talk about what's going on. Before I wouldn't even see anyone as I felt it was pointless anyway.

That time is now a distant memory, and I have a special eye on any new mum in my friendship group. There is struggling with new motherhood, and there is drowning in a sleep deprived hell. There is help.

People suggesting formula do so because then dh could do feeds and you could sleep.
Only you can decide if that would be ok for you. I was desperate to bf back then and I'm sure it made my life harder, but my mental recovery quicker. I would have felt I failed her as I've bf dc1&2 and my self esteem wasn't the best. I would decide differently now.

You have to tell your DH how you feel. Don't expect him to know what to do - mine certainly didn't and thought a back massage and cup of tea would fix it. You have to tell him to take time off work if he is still planning on going back next week. You need him there 24/7 for the next few weeks.

and ((hugs)) even though I'm not a hugger, I'm a rather tough cookie and a coper. The strongest people need help too sometimes.
What are your plans for xmas?

A lot of babies sleep better on formula. The milk takes longer to digest so they have a fuller tummy for longer.

Even if you had a break for a few days (you could hand express to keep supply up) then you might feel better.

Also remember babies often have a growth spurt around six weeks. So it could be this contributing to it? Though from the sounds of it he's always been like this??

1 in 7 women have PND.

The PND tells you there's no way out.
The PND tells you that you are failing.
The PND tells you that you are horrible and deserve death
The PND tells you nothing will help.
The PND tells you it's hopeless.
Then it really buggers you by telling you that maybe other women get better but not you.

This isn't you. It's PND. You can be you again. Please seek urgent medical treatment. Millions of us have been there. You can and will get better if you seek treatment.

And with the best will in the world to everyone advising formula, the feeding isn't causing suicidal thinking. PND is causing suicidal thinking. The PND needs to be dealt with far more urgently than the feeding.

Oh yes totally agree on that last bit. But the negative thoughts about "I am a bad mum" are partly around feeding issues.

Sorry I had to post quickly and didn't finish.
Yes do get some help be it HV or GP. Use mumsnet as a source of support and know you're not alone going through it. And I've been here 3 times and it does get better. This is the hardest it will be and you are surviving it. You'll look back and it will seem like such a short time of your life even though it feels like it will last forever now.
Keep going, keep surviving each day at a time.

This was me: Good - because at every stage I have made/ continue to make really bad desicions and I'm sure adding formula would be one as well. He could be allergic or get reflux or he'll be impossible to settle

But with hindsight I should have at least tried. I tied myself up in knots about formula and was so so stubborn about it. My friend had a baby with bad reflux and dairy intolerance - she went to the gp and got hypoallergenic formula instead. Which is exactly what I should have done but I didn't think straight.

You can mix feed. You can just try once. But at least you'll know.

Agree it really sounds like PND but reducing the pressure and increasing sleep along with seeking help would all be beneficial.

Having been there myself, the problem is that giving formula doesn't cure the thinking. You just transfer the 'I am a bad mum' onto formula. The depression causes you to interpret feeding difficulties as meaning you're a bad mum, rather than feeding difficulties causing the thoughts necessarily. I had very similar feeding difficulties with all three of my tongue tied baby but I only had PND with the second one. PND can take a beautiful sunset and make it seem like the dawn of the armageddon: treatment is what is needed at this point.