Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

5:2 Thread number 93: Drive in the fasting lane to goal !

974 replies

BigChocFrenzy · 22/10/2020 18:53

Welcome to the continuing thread for those following 5:2 or other forms of IF (Intermittent Fasting) such as 4:3, ADF, or daily 16:8 Smile

The 5:2 diet was introduced by Michael Mosely on BBC Horizon on August 2012:

Basically it is 2 very low cal days ("fasts") per week - which need not be consecutive - and eat "normally" to maintain on the other 5 days.

For those who have dieted or maybe overeaten for years, eating "normally"
means roughly the number of calories your body needs to maintain - NOT reduce - its weight (see TDEE calculator below).

IMPORTANT
If you have had past diagnosed Eating Disorders or serious MH problems you should NOT do 5:2 or any other kind of fasting

ACRONYMS

16:8 is a different type of fasting, which can be combined with 5:2.
Daily zero-cal fast for 16 hours and eat within an 8 hour window. To lose weight, this needs a weekly calorie deficit as well

4:3 = fast on 3 non-consecutive days per week

ADF (Alternate-Day Fasting) = fast every other day

b2b (optional) back-to-back / consecutive fast days, each with an increased allowance of 650 calories instead of 500

BMI (Body Mass Index) healthy range is 18.5 - 24.9 for Caucasians. Upper limit may be 22 for some of Asian origin.

FD = single Fast Day: aim for 500 calories (600 for men or 25% TDEE whichever is higher) or 1000 cals for BF
No alcohol or junk on FDs
Even if you exercise strenuously, do NOT increase FD cals to allow for exercise

MFP = My Fitness Pal, a useful App or website to track food & drink calories

miniFD = MiniFD, 850- 1000 calories, no alcohol or junk

NFD = Non-Fast Day, averages around TDEE

NSV / LSV = Non Scale Victory / LifeStyle (change) Victory, e.g. compliment, smaller waist, clothes size

SV = Scale Victory

TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, the average number of calories you burn in a day, is calculated (see calculators below) from your current weight, height, age, activity level.
Aim to average about this for NFDs.

WOE / WOL = Way Of Eating / Way Of Life. We say this instead of "diet", to emphasise that we must make a permanent change in how we eat, to mainitain our new healthy weight longterm.

HOW TO START

. Take initial measurements: weight, waist, hips
. Use TDEE calculator below if you need a rough guide to how much to eat on NFDs
. Choose any 2 days for FDs, non-consecutive is easier.
. Before each FD: plan, shop & calorie count ALL food & drink for the day

Useful Resources & Calculators

Calorie Counter: mfp
Rough Calories for NFD: Mosely TDEE Calc (exercisers: set activity level to one below what you think)
BMI: Calc
Body Frame Size: Calc
Goal Weight For BodyFrame
Calc
Body Fat: BFat Calc
Choose / Visualise Goal Weight:
3D BMI body types ripped to normal
Bod Vis Measurements & 3D rotate]]

Safe Alcohol Calc: Calc Units Cals

FD Recipes:
Mosely LowCarb , low carb Diet Doc
BBC Good Food 200-400 cal meals

BBC Good Food 500 cal meals ,
5:2 meal plans & recipes , Foodie Under 200 Cals
Vegetarian ,
FD Ready Meals & Fast Food

Any Day:
Meal Planner

FAQs / Tips

  • WATER: Start each day with a glass of water; and drink plenty during the day.
  • HOT DRINKS: No limits on tea or coffee, but on FDs count any milk / sugar calories.
  • SLEEP: Try to get enough sleep, or it may slow weight loss.
  • EXERCISE: is healthy & can help weight loss - BUT only if you do NOT eat back less than you burn. Fasted training can burn more fat.
HIIT and resistance training both work well with 5:2/IF.
  • FDs: If possible, choose days when you are busy, but not preparing meals for others.
Concentrate on protein & veg; avoid sugar or fruit juice. e.g. Stir-fries, soups & stews. Ready meals are OK.
  • BFers: start with 1000-cal FDs, optionally reduce to 700 cals gradually.
You can return to 1000 if growth spurts or sleep-deprivation require more fuel.
  • NFDs: No rules, but to improve health, try to cut down on added sugar & junk food, keep alcohol within safe limits. A few treats per week are fine.
  • Do NOT fast: if you've ever had EDs, or if pregnant, under 21, over-stressed, fever, stomach bug, even a bad cold.
  • CHECK with your Doctor: if you have diabetes, any other endocrine condition, any serious past or present medical condition, or if taking ANY prescribed medication (fasting may affect absorption rate)

Scientific Evidence for Fasting & Health

BBC article on the original Horizon program

Telegraph comments on 5:2 and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley, useful for newbies.

This InterviewPart1 and InterviewPart2 with leading ADF researcher Dr Varady explains why fasting helps you to lose weight AND improves some health markers.

Fasting boosts "autophagy" = recycling of old cells
Yoshinori Ohsumi won the 2016 Nobel prize for Medicine for research into autophagy
NOBEL Lecture “Autophagy – An Intracellular Recycling System”

Prof. R Taylor (Newcastle Uni) won the 2013 Diabetes UK Banting Prize for his Twin Cycle Hypothesis re the cause of type 2 diabetes: Twin Cycle Hypothesis T2
and showed a fasting diet could reverse T2

Dr Michelle Harvie (funded by cancer charities) showed possible benefits of intermittent fasting compared to standard daily calorie reduction in her trials (consecutive FDs) with women at high risk of breast cancer: ComparingDiets , EarlierResearch52

Dr Johnson showed intermittent fasting helped Asthma

HORMESIS & Why Intermittent Fasting Works: Mattson , BlackSwan and Hormesis

Molecular Mechanisms and Clinical Applications: J CellMetabolism
Recent research into the health benefits of fasting: e.g. by world-respected neuroscientist Dr MarkMattson (Mosely referred to his research) showed:

. Improved glucose regulation
. Loss of abdominal fat with maintenance of muscle mass
. Reduced blood pressure and heart rate
. Improved learning and memory and motor function
. Protection of neurons in the brain against dysfunction and degeneration in animal models of Alzheimer’s disease, Parkinson’s disease, stroke and Huntington’s disease.

Brain metabolism in health, aging, andneurodegeneration :
"lifestyles that include intermittent bioenergetic challenges, most notably exercise and dietary energy restriction, can increase the likelihood that the brain will function optimally and in the absence of disease throughout life"

He compared 5:2 to ordinary daily diets on overweight women with family history of breast cancer.
Fasting group lost more belly fat, retained more muscle & had slightly better blood sugar regulation.

More of his research is in HealthyAging , Health , AvoidParkinsonsDisease

His article in J Aging Mech Disease 2015 explains the health benefits of intermittent fasting in great scientific detail.

Why intermittent fasting and stopping snacking can lower your risk of serious diseases:
Meal frequency and timing in health and disease

Fasting can help maintain brain health during aging:
emboj.embopress.org/content/36/11/1474
"lifestyles that include intermittent bioenergetic challenges, most notably exercise and dietary energy restriction, can increase the likelihood that the brain will function optimally and in the absence of disease throughout life"

This interview with leading researchers into fasting in combination with standard cancer treatment: ScientificDiscussion MoselyMattsonLongo and a LongoInterview

NY Times Fasting Overview

Research by other US and European scientists in this DailyTelegraph Article about the medicinal uses of fasting, for many serious conditions & diseases.

Recent trials with Type 2 diabetics and those at risk of having it used a form of daily fasting - skipping supper.
Their conclusions: eating 1-2 meals per day is better than several small meals for losing weight and controlling insulin levels, see Type2Paper

OP posts:
Thread gallery
6
MazDazzle · 26/11/2020 09:57

Good luck gin!

I’ve given myself a mini target. Going to try to lose 5lb before Christmas.🤞🏻

KylieKoKo · 26/11/2020 10:04

Today is a fast day and I have woken up pre-menstrual and starving!

I will do my best and have my 500 calories planned out but I might need to go over today. If I do I will make sure it is with heathy food rather than the chips I really want.

I have had a black coffee and water so far and am about to make myself a ginger tree to see if that helps.

ginsparkles · 26/11/2020 11:26

Thanks @MazDazzle ... happy to say the scales were kind this morning!!! Your mini goal sounds sensible. I'd like that much too.

@KylieKoKo good luck with your FD today! Smile

harriethoyle · 26/11/2020 12:43

@KylieKoKo I'm fasting too. Solidarity fist bump for the chips craving! Lidl triple fried beef dripping chips are AMAZING

KateMAB · 26/11/2020 17:17

FD here, feeling grazey today, I've opened the fridge and food cupboard about a dozen times since I got home, but have stayed empty handed so yeah me. Dinner is in 1 hr then I'm off for a long soak in the bath and an early night.

MazDazzle · 26/11/2020 17:28

Not long now Kate, hang in there.

So far I’ve only used 450 cals today for lunch. Got to do a fair bit of rushing around taxiing the kids to their various activities, then it’s home for dinner. There’s a pan of soup waiting on the hob. A nice mini-FD.

Hope your FDs are going well Harriet and Kylie.

harriethoyle · 26/11/2020 18:00

Kitchen closing on 574. Today has been HARD! Hardest one for ages...

KylieKoKo · 26/11/2020 18:29

I've had my main meal of garlic seabass and steamed vegetables. It was nice I am still craving chips! I have enough calories left for a plum and a boiled egg but I want to hold out til later so I go to bed not feeling hungry.

The fast day before my period is always so hard AND I never lose weight this week as I retain water.

harriethoyle · 26/11/2020 19:14

Yes @KylieKoKo my weight always stays stable on the fast week when my period is due. SO ANNOYING!

ginsparkles · 26/11/2020 19:25

Well done @KylieKoKo and @harriethoyle !!

Keep going @KateMAB !

KateMAB · 26/11/2020 19:27

Typing from my bath, first time I've been properly warm all day.
I managed to hold out to dinner and am full of vegetables and fish (DH and the kids had salad potatoes with theirs). Hot water bottles are in bed ready and pj's are on the radiator.

KateMAB · 26/11/2020 19:28

Well done everyone for making it through today

KylieKoKo · 26/11/2020 19:38

@harriethoyle I do generally get a slightly bigger loss the following week so I'm thinking of that to stop me ordering a takeaway

KateMAB · 27/11/2020 06:49

Another kg down this morning, very happy, pretty sure logging all my non fast days is really helping too, when you start really looking at calories of things it's really obvious where the extra sneaks in.

ListeningQuietly · 27/11/2020 09:18

Kate
Calorie counting is boring
but its the only proven method for tracking and thus controlling

I had a Thanksgiving dinner or turkey and bean enchilladas last night.
Pizza tonight
so small lunch of fruit and lots of jumping around to stay warm Smile

Bottl · 27/11/2020 14:05

Hello everyone.
Who's on the fast train today? So far, I've just had a few sips of water and pondering what to have when I get home in an hour.

Bottl · 27/11/2020 14:05

Well done @KateMAB on your SV!!

harriethoyle · 27/11/2020 14:27

@Bottl I'm very impressed by your Friday fasting!

Bottl · 27/11/2020 17:43

Harriet - don't be impressed, I usually crumble half way through the day! Fridays are easier for me to fast because I'm off every other week and I find there are fewer temptations when I'm not working.

MazDazzle · 27/11/2020 18:36

Well done Kate! That’s. Cracking SV.

Good luck Bottl. Hang in there.

Had a PT session this morning. Skipped breakfast and lunch then had a small bowl of stew and a mini gingerbread man made by my DC. Now I just need to resist the wine and all of the other gingerbread people! Hoping that because I had a relatively low cal day today I can relax a bit more over Sat/Sun.

ginsparkles · 27/11/2020 20:08

Well done @Kate !!

Hope your FD has gone well @Bottl

Non FD here today, forgot to track calories but have been fairly sensible. Will track again tomorrow. Planning to do Tuesday and Friday next week. Back to work on Tuesday, and Thursday is my birthday!

Darker · 28/11/2020 07:56

Woken up a bit peckish after a good fast day yesterday, and just over 10000 steps. Had a lovely evening walk by the river (although we had to dodge several groups of young people gathering around the benches for a Friday drink).

Coffeeandcookies · 28/11/2020 14:35

What's everyone's thoughts about Christmas? Anyone planning strategies to avoid too much excess during the feasting season?

I'm thinking of trying to do 3 weeks of REALLY strict calorie counting and FDs with an increase in exercise in the hope that I lose a little more weight so that I can relax for a few days over Christmas and not calorie count but stay on track overall.

I think if I have a bit of a 'cushion' it will actually help me not go overboard during Christmas as I'll not want to undo the good work I've done beforehand if that makes sense?

Coffeeandcookies · 28/11/2020 14:36

Am on the exercise bike now as part of my committment to an increase in exercise! 😂

Darker · 28/11/2020 16:00

I'm not sure about Christmas. At least there are no boozy Christmas parties this year or jumbo boxes of chocolates and twiglets in the office....