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Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

Blood sugar diet and fast800 thread 19

999 replies

thenewaveragebear1983 · 10/05/2020 22:25

Here’s the new thread for the BSD followers, plus those following the Fast800 plan. Everyone is welcome to join us. Here’s a quick recap!

The BSD/fast 800 is a low carb, Mediterranean style way of eating, with the primary aim of stabilising your insulin response when you eat. You achieve this by: eating fewer carbs, cutting out sugar and sweet tasting foods including most fruit, and by following a low calorie plan that reduces your visceral fat meaning that everything functions more effectively. Less insulin means less fat storage (in a nutshell, although more info can be found on this online). The diet was designed to reduce T2 diabetes symptoms (or even reverse it entirely) but can also be used for weightloss.

Eat:
Meats and fish
Oils
Eggs
Full fat dairy products
Nuts, seeds
Pulses/ beans
Veg that grows above ground
Limit fruit: apples, pears, berries- in moderation, with meals, with fats

Occasional alcoholic drinks allowed (spirits, red wine are preferable to beer, lager, etc)
Tea and coffee, herbal tea etc.
And water- drink lots of water!

Avoid
sugar, sweets, and ‘naturally occurring sugars’ such as fructose, maltose, honey, agave, puréed dates etc....

Potatoes of any variety
Pasta
Rice
Breakfast cereals (occasional steel cut oats are ok)
Breads/ flour based products

Exercise:
Michael Moseley recommends HIIT workouts to increase calorie burn and help to tone up, and recommends walking more (increasing your steps weekly until you hit around 10000 a day)

Mindfulness
MM also suggests a programme of mindfulness, meditation, practised for a few minutes each day.

How to follow the plan:
Fast800: follow the plan above, sticking to 800 calories every day for 2 weeks. Ideal to give your weightloss a real kick start, plus improve your insulin function and reduce your sugar cravings.
8 weeks BSD- 8 weeks, follow the guidelines above- 800 calories a day. You don’t need to count carbs grams because the diet is naturally self limiting.
BSD 5:2- for a more leisurely weightloss journey, or as maintenance, or once you’ve done an 8 week stint or 2 weeks of Fast800, you can play around with a combination of increased calorie count, ‘free eating’ and fasting days (800 cals) until you achieve your goals. Many of our long standing members now follow this approach.

You can stop 800 calorie days at any time once you achieve your goal. It’s advised to limit yourself to 12 weeks maximum at 800 calorie days, but you should get excellent results in 8 weeks. Depending on your weightloss goals, you can do further ‘rounds’ of either the 8 week BSD or the Fast800.

Time restricted eating/TRE :
In addition to the fast800/ BSD plan you can incorporate a strategy of time restricted eating. Put simply, this means only eating between certain times each day to maximise your fasting time. TRE has shown to have positive results for weightloss, even if there is no calorie restriction, and increases insulin sensitivity/reduces insulin resistance. At first, try for a clear 12 hours without food each 24 hours, increasing to 16:8 as you get more adept at fasting.

Some useful links

Meal planning ideas thread
Blood sugar diet recipe thread and menu planner meal planning thread

<a class="break-all" href="http://go.mumsnet.com/?xs=1&id=470X1554755&url=healthyeater.com/important-tool-weight-loss" target="_blank">TDEE calculator to calculate your daily calorie requirement

information about the ‘whoosh’ phenomenon

OP posts:
Thread gallery
35
PhoenixMama · 20/06/2020 13:55

Hello all! Had a high fat low carb day yesterday but crumbled and had wine. But I had a super emotional day, still feel wobbly today.

Apparently up 5lbs today 🙄 I know it's just water but still!

Trying to do a low carb day but starving! I find emotional days just make me want sugar and carbs - what's up with that?

Cocobox · 20/06/2020 14:00

Hi everyone, I went a bit mad last night, too much wine led to crisps, bread and dips. Bit hungover this morning so had a big breakfast. Feel much better now. Weighed and I am back up to 10 st.

B: Toast, eggs, coffee
L: Can of coke
D: Chicken salad

Justasecondnow · 20/06/2020 16:44

Hi all, bestbees and phoenixmama hope you’re both feeling better. I find I go up and down with it all... diets and lockdown. And coco box you are not the only one.... my halo needs polishing after yesterday. I think there is something about Friday’s... yesterday I had:

Halloumi kebabs
Steak w carrot and courgette
Red wine x 3
Chocolate buttons

Total cals: 1300 & carbs 40. Although I don’t know if red wine has carbs... probably, as all the things I like do!! I was planning about a 1000 cal day but had 3 glasses of wine instead of 1 and then the chocolate buttons made an appearance. Shocking how easy it is to go from 800 - 1300! Something to remember for maintenance. Also eating later last night def didn’t help. Still 10k ran today. And been on plan since. Will prob have another 1200/1300 day tomos due to Father’s Day stuff. But can live with that as am on it today and will be on it next week!

bluepixie · 20/06/2020 17:33

Right I survived! So I ended up doing
30mls milk
Half fish finger (unplanned!)
3 egg omlete huge salad and a slice of whole meal bread.

Ended up on 647 and 50g carbs which is an estimate as bread was home made and I didn’t weigh the salad bits but estimated it all....I was hungry at 4 but I wasn’t as bad as I thought I would be. But I’m feeling tired and could sleep right now!

Bestbees · 20/06/2020 19:56

Well done cream!
I have had a good day, but going to mindfully enjoy some champagne truffles this evening!

bluepixie · 20/06/2020 20:20

Oh lovely @bestbees! I’m actually really watching chocolate? Why I
Managed to not eat all day. Now I’m relaxing / bored / watching tv I want to eat crap
No no no no! I can’t trust myself to be mindful with it I’ll eat a whole box!

bluepixie · 20/06/2020 20:21

Wanting not watching!

collywobble · 20/06/2020 21:28

Good day here, had lunch at 2pm and dinner at 7.30. I went for a long walk with Ds1&Ds2. They had fish and chips on the canal bank which smelt heavenly but I kept strong and had lamb meatballs when we got home with kale and cauliflower rice. I've polished off a bottle of no alcohol red wine which is 17 cals a glass and as close to the real thing as possible.I haven't had time to feel hungry today and that is definitely the key to a successful day for me. Why can't every day be like this?

Clevererthanyou · 20/06/2020 21:28

May I join please? I’m 5’9/5’10 and 24st so I have a very big amount to lose. I started on the low blood sugar a week ago but given that I am T2 I want to try fasting now to ensure I don’t cave and binge on sugar so early on.
I don’t really care about savoury food per se but I’ve had a lifelong problem with chocolate and cake. I kicked my alcohol problem (4 years sober) and the fags (4 years fag free) and now I want to ditch the cake and hopefully the T2 with it. I’ve never lasted a week on a diet so I’m immensely proud of myself and I have a goal in mind to keep me on track. Does anyone have any specific advice for a morbidly obese noob please?

Kimlek · 20/06/2020 22:40

Hello clevererthanyou and welcome. Quitting smoking and alcohol is pretty impressive! I’m struggling to find nice alcohol substitutes.
I’ve had a disastrous eating day...
Had scoffed several of DD1s ginger biscuits by noon so morning fast out there window albeit had a couple of coffees with milk. I don’t really like black coffee so not sure how am fasts will work.
I avoided pizza lunch but not long after the ginger biscuits were screaming ‘eat me’. And I did. I’ve also had quite a bit of diet lemonade so must be craving sugar. The pulled pork didn’t really work in the pizza oven so I didn’t eat much if that and then the veggies were even odd so all in all not a very nutritious day! But was booze free! Did try a non alcoholic rose but a tadge reminiscent of cider vinegar. ☹️
Oh and because the pulled pork wasn’t ready til 8pm I had a couple of handfuls of crisps! Which I NEVER eat.
Tomorrow is another day! Except it’s Father’s Day and we’ve ordered an Italian take away.

Justasecondnow · 21/06/2020 07:26

Post I thought I put on last night... but I can’t seem to find...

Today’s efforts.. (Yesterday’s now!)

Scrambled eggs and sausages
Chicken in Parma ham w/ asparagus and green beans
Milk for tea

= 910 cals & 35 carb

But + 250 for small amount of porridge w/jam. I don’t count that as this gets me out for my 10k and I just can’t do it without some carbs. It’s the only time I eat any of my exercise cals and reckon it’s a net positive on the whole. Extra calories eaten - bad, but more than eaten used up - good & exercise is good for body and mind.

Father’s Day BBQ tomos. Will be over calories wise. Not more than 1300 is what I’m aiming for. Good luck everyone - it’s a tricky day for dieters everywhere!

Oh and Clevererthanyou my standard bit of advice is take measurements. Really motivating to lose inches as well as lbs!

thenewaveragebear1983 · 21/06/2020 07:34

Morning everyone

Welcome @clevererthanyou. Do you have the fast800 or blood sugar diet book? My advice would be to read them thoroughly, and plan your next few days/next weeks food. It's totally doable and if you stick to the plan you will lose weight. Get plenty of fat into your menu. If you are cutting carbs for the first time it can help to do a few days detox first, cut the carbs right back, but not calorie count until you've got to grips with the low carb foods and have had a few days to overcome the withdrawals from sugar. Drink loads of water, eat a little bit of salt. Feel free to post on here as much as you want, any questions etc.

OP posts:
bluepixie · 21/06/2020 07:40

Not lost anything. Sigh! Prob too many carbs yest. And today pizza. Then bday.
Sighjh

thenewaveragebear1983 · 21/06/2020 07:42

I've weighed in today at 10.12, again which I'm a bit pissed off with as I did 25,000 steps yesterday and didn't drink last night. And it's got me Thinking over my plans for next week. I'm finding it very hard at the moment, having a few good days and a few terrible days and basically maintaining at 7lbs higher than I want to be.

I've planned my menu this week but I've planned to 1000-1200 cals each day rather than 800 because I'm just clearly not managing to get low enough. 1200 is still less than half my daily tdee. I'm going to try and get those carbs down low though, maybe 25g a day as a target/limit, to try and give myself a little boost to get over this hump. It's going to be hot this week so lots of salad, bbq and grilled meat on the menu!

OP posts:
bluepixie · 21/06/2020 08:06

@thenewaveragebear1983 that sounds like a good plan. U will still loose and be less frustrated at urself. 800 is though....my plan today is to have a light low carb lunch (maybe 2 eggs) And half the pizza with a huge salad on side.
Tmrw the plan is cake Prosecco wine cake chocolates and more. I’ll just have to get back on the scales on Tuesday and deal with it.

thenewaveragebear1983 · 21/06/2020 08:09

@Cream123 thanks. I know you're struggling like me at the moment. It just seems to be something new every day doesn't it?
Hope you have a lovely day today, and tomorrow is your birthday, yes??

OP posts:
bluepixie · 21/06/2020 08:27

I’ve been struggling for a while! Up and down...yes always something but for me always an excuse ! Anyways it’s not like I’m rushing for anything. More just irritated at myself. So yes bday - it’s tmrw and Friday I have friends over for drinks in garden (only 2 and socially distant) - so I can be on plan tues wed thurs (which is prob how long it will take to loose anything I put on today and tmrw) then Friday down the pan again!
But then I have nothing at all on till 11th July my anniversary (10 years) so I have a full 2 weeks and I really really really really really must just focus and make loosing 3/4 pounds my priority.

Bestbees · 21/06/2020 08:48

Morning all.

Welcome @Clevererthanyou you will find this very supportive. My tips? Plan everything, prep allowed snacks (boiled eggs, portions of cheese/olives/nuts) for those desperate moments. Drink lots of water and have a good, clean fasting window- though you can build up to this. Perhaps do a week cutting carbs not counting, then a week with 16:8 and 1000 cals and then the 800. ease your self in? Or just jump in, grit your teeth for a week and get the hardest bit over with.

@thenewaveragebear1983 that sounds like a good plan. Reading your posts it seems like you plan the 800 and then feel like you 'fail'. Giving yourself achievable parameters might help you to feel better, and then avoid falling into the cake.

Despite my two days over I have only put on half a pound. Pretty pleased! Both days I fasted until 12 so maybe that helped?
Plan for today
Lunch cottage cheese salad
Dinner sausages and roasted veg.

Good luck!

ilovemydogandmrobama2 · 21/06/2020 09:56

Any tips?

I've hit a brick wall - stuck at 10st 0lb.

Have tried:

fasting all day - water only
having just a mid day meal
having just an evening meal

Long walk

Just to be clear, I am not consuming:

Alcohol
Any carbs
Dairy
veg below ground
Pork, beef - any processed meats

Have been at 10st for about a week Hmm

thenewaveragebear1983 · 21/06/2020 10:13

@ilovemydogandmrobama2 are you tracking your cals? Do you reckon you are eating enough? I say that because if you have cut out dairy and red meat you may not be getting enough fat? I really struggled to keto my fat intake high enough when I was 100% dairy free (plus dairy subs are high carb I find, eg the cheese often had potato starch in it etc, not sure if you are using those?)

@Bestbees I think you're right. 800 is too low really for me given I don't have a huge amount of body fat and I do exercise a lot. I think I've maybe screwed up my metabolism a little bit because I shouldn't really be gaining/losing the same 5lbs every week. I've just done a run which Fitbit reckons is 750 cals so 800 isn't really feasible is it?!

OP posts:
Bestbees · 21/06/2020 13:34

@thenewaveragebear1983 if I was you I would:
Take a week of counting, or allow up to 1500 a day. Focus on bsd foods. Focus on nourishing yourself with delicious food.
Then think about what you want for the week after. I might say Mon and wed 800, Tues, Thurs 1200. Friday-sat unrestricted. Basically 5:2. Then after another week reassess.
How does thatsound?

PhoenixMama · 21/06/2020 14:35

Hello all!

Welcome @Clevererthanyou! My tips would be min 3L of water every day and add lots of salt to your food to start - It really helped me in the beginning. Also - if you stick with it for the first 2 weeks (just focus on the two weeks to start) you'll be so inspired you'll want to keep going!

@ilovemydogandmrobama2 Can you share your macros? I agree with Bear that you might not be getting enough, but also a couple of questions: how much more do you have to lose & how much have you lost? Both will help us get a feel for what's going on. Also a reality check - a 1 week plateau isn't much, some of us have plateau'd for almost a month. Are you taking measurements - often that makes a bigger change than the scale.

After a week of serious up and down I think something was wrong with my scale. Today I weighed 5 times in different places - in my normal place I was 185, then 185 then in another 3 places I was 180 so I'm going to take the 180 which makes sense. Not a big loss but... I've started doing weights and my shape is really changing quickly only week 2 but my arms are showing definition, my hips & waist are slimmer. I'll take that while the scale isn't changing much.

Totally over on carbs today - mostly down to bad planning and not having any protein in the house but also my weight workouts make me hungrier than running!

Goal for the week is no booze, and keeping carbs below 45g (my weak spot!) Also going to try and enter as many food items as possible into MFP in advance so I get a better feel for where I am when I'm hungry!

@thenewaveragebear1983 I know we've talked about this before but how realistic is your goal. Your body has totally changed since you started and you have to remember that. Also if you have low body fat your body is going to been needing enough fat to function. I know you hate losing and gaining the same 5lbs every week but that's just water weight and how much you fluctuate. How is the rest of your body functioning? What does your body need to run like you do? Maybe being a bit higher (1200-1500) will actually help you?

thenewaveragebear1983 · 21/06/2020 19:05

@PhoenixMama I know, although currently I'm up half a stone from my lowest and even that was higher than I really wanted to be. I think deep down I know that if I really want the results then a few things have to change. I need to count and track every day for a start (even if I have different cal limits on different days) and I have got to get the carbs low (which means I've got to stop mindlessly, or even mindfully!, putting things in my mouth.
I'm going to stick with my plan for the week; increase the cals up to 1200 but really work at getting the carbs as low as possible. That way, my carb percentage will be even lower.

Tomorrow: run in the morning. I'm going to do yoga every day this week too (developing a sore heel/plantar from wearing bare feet all the time and not stretching my calves). My menu is planned so there's no excuse really for not having a reasonable week.
Lunch: smoked salmon and egg and avocado
Dinner:

Plenty of water, try not to snack between or after meals. Easy huh? Grin

OP posts:
Justasecondnow · 21/06/2020 20:50

Just re-read this... sorry it’s mega long. Feel free to skip! Just helps me to write and post.

... Oh dear Father’s Day got me. Had a lovely BBQ. But must be on about 2000cals and carbs I dread to think. Oh well. Done now. I can maybe pull it back and if not will aim for a stay the same. I’m not pleased I didn’t manage a relaxed day better.. a sniff of treats and I was off... but I feel good I don’t have an urge to wallow in self loathing... uh... so yay I guess!

On the topic of trying to pull it back I’ve worked out - My TDEE set in lightly active is: 1844 - over a week that’s 12908. And apparently you need a 3500 cal deficit to lose a lb.

What I manage on this diet is roughly:

5 900 cal days = 4500
2 1300 cal days = 2600 (flipping weekends!)
= 7100

Cal deficit = 5808

Which would equate to losing about a 1b and a half a week. I’ve generally managed to lose 2lb most weeks apart from a stay the same one week. I think that’s prob due a bit of extra exercise just about making up the deficit? And maybe being closer to 800 and weekends not always being that bad... and thus far my body’s been mostly willing to play ball without massive plateaus... not taking that for granted.

So this week.... 1300 Friday, 1160 Saturday , 2000 Sunday, Mon - Fri 900 x 4 = 3600= 8060

So my TDEE 12908 - 8060 (what I hope to end up this week cal wise)= 4848 cal deficit from TDEE.

So I could still be in with a chance of shifting a lb.....there are a lot of assumptions and so on that could be off. But this makes me feel a bit in control and that all is not lost. Also makes me realise how hard losing weight is. You can restrict yourself so much from your usual but if you’re not creating that necessary deficit. No dice! Having said all that I know it is more complicated a lot of the time with water weight, varying impact of exercise and plateaus and wooshes and so on. Time will tell w/Friday’s weigh in I guess.

Kimlek · 21/06/2020 23:01

Sounds like a plan bear. Get some new scales pheonix I love my Renpho ones (£30 amazon) that tell me all sorts of extra info on the app. Your weight lifting sounds amazing. You doing that at home?

I’ve loved today!
Black coffee no milk for bfast and fasted til midday ish; when I had a few quorn pepperoni slices as knew dinner was going to be rather obscene. DD1 asked me to join her on her dog walk 🤗 5k (8000 steps) and chatted about nothing in particular. Picked up the Italian takeaway of calamari starter; seafood linguine & tirimusu. I know, I know!! And you’re worried about half a pizza cream! In fairness I ate only a few strands of linguine and only a few mouthfuls of tirimusu but I did have a lot of the breaded calamari. DH had wine but the rest of us had nosecco. All sat around the table with candles and laughed! DD3 playing waitress. So lovely! Followed by a movie. All of us. Which we haven’t done for... I can’t remember when. They had cheese & biscuits, popcorn etc but I just enjoyed us being together. It’s the best day I’ve had in 6 months. I’ve missed us. And if I’ve put on a pound or so it’s been worth it. Hope you all enjoyed Fathers Day too!
This is total guesswork but around 1000 cals and a whopping 100g carbs.

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