5:2 Thread number 84: Exercise hack - Fartlek = interval training with non-regular intervals; Fartleg = lie sideways watching TV and gently raise a leg to break wind

[BigChocFrenzy]

Welcome to the continuing thread for those following 5:2 or other forms of IF (Intermittent Fasting) such as 4:3, ADF, or daily 16:8

The 5:2 diet was introduced by Michael Mosely on BBC Horizon on August 2012:

Basically it is 2 very low cal days ("fasts") per week - which need not be consecutive - and eat "normally" to maintain on the other 5 days.

For those who have dieted or maybe overeaten for years, eating "normally"
means roughly the number of calories your body needs to maintain - NOT reduce - its weight (see TDEE calculator below).

IMPORTANT
If you have had Eating Disorders you should NOT do 5:2 or any other kind of fasting

ACRONYMS

16:8 is a different type of fasting, which can be combined with 5:2.
Daily zero-cal fast for 16 hours and eat within an 8 hour window. To lose weight, this needs a weekly calorie deficit as well

4:3 = fast on 3 non-consecutive days per week

ADF (Alternate-Day Fasting) = fast every other day

b2b (optional) back-to-back / consecutive fast days, each with an increased allowance of 650 calories instead of 500

BMI (Body Mass Index) healthy range is 18.5 - 24.9 for Caucasians. Upper limit may be 22 for some of Asian origin.

FD = single Fast Day: aim for 500 calories (600 for men or 25% TDEE whichever is higher) or 1000 cals for BF
No alcohol or junk on FDs
Even if you exercise strenuously, do NOT increase FD cals to allow for exercise

MFP = My Fitness Pal, a useful App or website to track food & drink calories

miniFD = MiniFD, 850- 1000 calories, no alcohol or junk

NFD = Non-Fast Day, averages around TDEE

NSV / LSV = Non Scale Victory / LifeStyle (change) Victory, e.g. compliment, smaller waist, clothes size

SV = Scale Victory

TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, the average number of calories you burn in a day, is calculated (see calculators below) from your current weight, height, age, activity level.
Aim to average about this for NFDs.

WOE / WOL = Way Of Eating / Way Of Life. We say this instead of "diet", to emphasise that we must make a permanent change in how we eat, to mainitain our new healthy weight longterm.

HOW TO START

. Take initial measurements: weight, waist, hips
. Use TDEE calculator below if you need a rough guide to how much to eat on NFDs
. Choose any 2 days for FDs, non-consecutive is easier.
. Before each FD: plan, shop & calorie count ALL food & drink for the day

Useful Resources & Calculators

Mosely's TDEE Calc - Exercisers:Use 1 activity level below what you think
Calorie Counter: mfp
Rough Calories for NFD: TDEE Calc (exercisers: set activity level to one below what you think)
BMI: Calc
Body Frame Size: Calc
Calc Ideal Weight Range
Body Fat: BF Calc
Choose / Visualise Goal Weight:
3D BMI body ripped to normal
Bod Vis Measurements & 3D rotate]]

Safe Alcohol Calc: Calc Daily UnitsCalories , Calc Weekly Units
Are You Addicted to Carbs Mosely’s Quiz

FD Recipes: BBC Good Food 52 , Mosely LowCarb , BBC Good Food 500 cal meals ,
Good2Know , Vegetarian ,
Foodie Under 200 Cals
Any Day: Meal Planner
FD Ready Meals, Takeaways, Restaurant: Mirror , Indie

FAQs / Tips

• WATER: Start each day with a glass of water; and drink plenty during the day.
• HOT DRINKS: No limits on tea or coffee, but on FDs count any milk / sugar calories.
• SLEEP: Try to get enough sleep, or it may slow weight loss.
• EXERCISE: is healthy & can help weight loss - BUT only if you do NOT eat back less than you burn. Fasted training can burn more fat.

HIIT and resistance training both work well with 5:2/IF.

• FDs: If possible, choose days when you are busy, but not preparing meals for others.

Concentrate on protein & veg; avoid sugar or fruit juice. e.g. Stir-fries, soups & stews. Ready meals are OK.

• BFers: start with 1000-cal FDs, optionally reduce to 700 cals gradually.

You can return to 1000 if growth spurts or sleep-deprivation require more fuel.

• NFDs: No rules, but to improve health, try to cut down on added sugar & junk food, keep alcohol within safe limits. A few treats per week are fine.

• Do NOT fast: if you've ever had EDs, or if pregnant, under 21, over-stressed, fever, stomach bug, even a bad cold.

• CHECK with your Doctor: if you have diabetes, any other endocrine condition, any serious past or present medical condition, or if taking ANY prescribed medication (fasting may affect absorption rate)

Scientific Evidence for Fasting & Health

BBC article on the original Horizon program

Telegraph comments on 5:2 and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley, useful for newbies.

This InterviewPart1 and InterviewPart2 with leading ADF researcher Dr Varady explains why fasting helps you to lose weight AND improves some health markers.

Fasting boosts "autophagy" = recycling of old cells
Yoshinori Ohsumi won the 2016 Nobel prize for Medicine for research into autophagy
NOBEL Lecture “Autophagy – An Intracellular Recycling System”

Prof. R Taylor (Newcastle Uni) won the 2013 Diabetes UK Banting Prize for his Twin Cycle Hypothesis re the cause of type 2 diabetes: Twin Cycle Hypothesis T2
and showed a fasting diet could reverse T2

Dr Michelle Harvie (funded by cancer charities) showed possible benefits of intermittent fasting compared to standard daily calorie reduction in her trials (consecutive FDs) with women at high risk of breast cancer: ComparingDiets , EarlierResearch52

Dr Johnson showed intermittent fasting helped Asthma

HORMESIS & Why Intermittent Fasting Works: Mattson , BlackSwan and Hormesis

Molecular Mechanisms and Clinical Applications: J CellMetabolism
Recent research into the health benefits of fasting: e.g. by world-respected neuroscientist Dr MarkMattson (Mosely referred to his research) showed:

. Improved glucose regulation
. Loss of abdominal fat with maintenance of muscle mass
. Reduced blood pressure and heart rate
. Improved learning and memory and motor function
. Protection of neurons in the brain against dysfunction and degeneration in animal models of Alzheimer’s disease, Parkinson’s disease, stroke and Huntington’s disease.

Brain metabolism in health, aging, andneurodegeneration :
"lifestyles that include intermittent bioenergetic challenges, most notably exercise and dietary energy restriction, can increase the likelihood that the brain will function optimally and in the absence of disease throughout life"

He compared 5:2 to ordinary daily diets on overweight women with family history of breast cancer.
Fasting group lost more belly fat, retained more muscle & had slightly better blood sugar regulation.

More of his research is in HealthyAging , Health , AvoidParkinsonsDisease

His article in J Aging Mech Disease 2015 explains the health benefits of intermittent fasting in great scientific detail.

Why intermittent fasting and stopping snacking can lower your risk of serious diseases:
Meal frequency and timing in health and disease

Fasting can help maintain brain health during aging:
emboj.embopress.org/content/36/11/1474
"lifestyles that include intermittent bioenergetic challenges, most notably exercise and dietary energy restriction, can increase the likelihood that the brain will function optimally and in the absence of disease throughout life"

This interview with leading researchers into fasting in combination with standard cancer treatment: ScientificDiscussion MoselyMattsonLongo and a LongoInterview

NY Times Fasting Overview

Research by other US and European scientists in this DailyTelegraph Article about the medicinal uses of fasting, for many serious conditions & diseases.

Recent trials with Type 2 diabetics and those at risk of having it used a form of daily fasting - skipping supper.
Their conclusions: eating 1-2 meals per day is better than several small meals for losing weight and controlling insulin levels, see Type2Paper

FD done, approx 750 cals.
Well done other Tuesday fasters
Had a big blowout weekend away with the girls so not expecting much loss this week. But as others have said, my weight loss graph is a zig zag with an overall downward trend, rather than a smooth curve.... And Moseley says the odd blip is fine as long as you get back on the horse straight away

Fantastic news blossom, so pleased you are well on the mend .

Amazing progress on this thread ⭐️.

I had to check back to see when I weighed myself, it was only on Saturday I am another 0.5kg down today. So have decided to up my calories to 800 on fast days as the weight is falling off. Combination of fasting, divorce and walking four miles a day with an average of 75 minutes of active exercise.

I want to lose weight but not too quickly - can I ask what you think I should do BCF?

Well done, MrD, Blody

Welcome back, Maz
Night work is always stressful and is known to make weight gain more likely

Suggestions, in priority order:

1. ) Get 8 hours sleep per day

• plan your time over the 24 hours - work, meals, exercise, freetime, sleep - to ensure this
• No screens in the hour before bed, because the blue light hinders sleep
• Junk & booze also disturb sleep patterns

2. No snacking EVER

• plan 3-4 nutritious, filling meals per day, so you can last the 4+ hours between meals Have any junky treats only as part of a meal

3. Replace crap with nutritious food

• Try to reduce junk food, whether as whole or part of a meal So boost healthy protein, veg, peas / lentils / beans and cut right down on takeaways, fast food, deep-fried, pies Try to 2:5 junky treats i.e. 1 sensible portion on only 2 day sper week

4. Keep nhs alcohol guidelines

• even on days off

5. Drink more water

• Start each day with a full glass and keep plenty of water with you at work. AIm for 1,5 l of water alone
• iirc you reach for fizzy crap - try to cut this out / seriously reduce Mosely quotes extensive research showing that sweeteners can spike insulin and change gut flora, both of which can increase fat storage
• also cut out fruit juice or dried fruit except as occasional treat - eat whole fruit instead

6. Exercise

• Try to have a daily walk or jog outside in daylight if your schedule allows

Congratulations on your SV and your progress, box
If the weight is falling off and you feel hungry, then it's fine to increase to 800 FDs

It's also fine to lose the first couple of stone v quickly - people do this on Fast800 / BSD

However, after that stage, you might want to slow down, since occasionally people find that losing several stone quickly - on any diet, not just via fasting - can cause gall bladder issues.

Alterbateively, if you have more than 2 FDs per week, or have an additional mini, you could cut back to 5:2

congrats blody and box on the SVs!

Box- I can't remember if you have lots to lose or not? If you do - its perfectly normal to lose a reasonable amount for a little while.

Thank you BCF and MrD.

I would like to lose a couple of stone so I probably shouldn't worry.

The last time I had a major life stress event the weight fell off me and I ended up going to the doctors because I couldn't keep weight on - I remember how poorly I felt and so am slightly wary.

Morning all! Second FD of the week for me. I broke into the Brexit chocolate stash last night (some lovely European Milka ) so feel as if a bit of a fast might be needed today!

Good luck, Maud and any other Wednesday fasters

Box many folk with quite a few stone to lose, do so at the rate of 3-4 lb weekly for about the first couple of stone

Others lose 1lb weekly, e.g. women who are short, with certain meds, post-meno etc
A couple of people, with high BP due to retained water, lost a stone within the first 2 weeks ! - because fasting releases excess water

It's completely up to the individual what suits you best
With a lot to go, the most important thing is that the WOE is sustainable longtem

Oh Maz that’s so difficult your now working nights. It’s really tricky when the snacking sets in, it’s a bugger to break the cycle. can you get rid of all the snacky bits?

I found it really difficult to get back into it again, stopped posting and buried my head in the sand. I find I need to be in the right mindset. It wasn’t until I noticed my jeans were hurting actually rubbing at the seams that I thought time to sort it out otherwise I will have to go out and buy the next size up. Im not looking at the whole amount but I’ve set myself small achievable targets as I work well to targets as long as they are realistic. Also I’ve got my carrot on a stick in terms of goals = gifts to myself.

Earslaps - That sounds Awsome fun. I love the trampoline park too. There is no way in hell at my biggest I would of gone on but I no longer give a flying fig and love it.

Well done on your FD Darcy.

Also well done Blody on your FD. it’s absolutely normal to have a zigzag graph with a downward trend. I find too much salt of a drink in the night makes me fluctuate all over the place.

Box - Wow that’s incredible that your now wanting to slow it down. I’d say try 800 if it’s what you want and see how it goes it’s amazing how much more you can have for 300 cals. But if you decide it’s going too slow you can always step back down to 500.

Maud I hope your FD went well.

I’ve had a impromptu FD today, debating wether to do a back 2 back tomorrow I will see how it goes as it’s been over a year since I’ve done that.

Thanks BCF. I will see how it goes then. I went back to the gym at my tennis club today and felt great! No fasting today though, DD & I went for 'mini fish and chips' on the way home.

'mini fish and chips' was too much food for both of us!

morning everyone, I can't believe I haven't had the time to read / post as I've been off with DS for 2 days plus getting new kitchen so lots of people to meet with and get quotes from, I've literally been rushed off my feet! Good to see so many successful FDs, SVs and NSVs.

Well done on your losses earslaps and box
Fab NSV mrd, I've always been very grateful that I have a FF bust as even at my biggest they have still been bigger

maz your work patterns sound tough, just try focusing on one FD at a time and you'll soon get back on track. Good luck

quacking isn't it just! luckily DH is off with him for the rest of the hols so I should be okay back at work. Well done on your FD

Day 1 of B2B, i'll need to post lots to get me though this as I think this is only the 3rd or 4th time I've attempted a B2B. A rare night out with DH on Saturday for our wedding anniversary is the motivation, a lovely slap up meal and some fizz to look forward to plus the dress I want to wear is zipping straight up at the moment and I want it to stay that way!!!

Good luck thurs fasters,

oh just saw you might be b2b-ing today quacking good luck!!!

Second FD nearly done (Thursday evening here). I had 2 eggs for breakfast and coffee with a small dash of almond milk. Someone bought me a full fat coffee at lunch which I drank because I can’t turn down coffee . I’ve just had some chicken casserole but a tiny amount of chicken, some vege and some beans with 100cal worth of brown rice. My food is definitely about 500 cal, so without the coffee it would have been by best FD thus far.

Good luck to the fasters still going.

We have 3 cats and one isn’t home, he’s done this before but I’m still worried and that’s taking my mind off food. He’s normally in at night but wasn’t last night and hasn’t been seen all day. He’s neutered but still has form for the occasional adventure.

Good luck, 43, surprised and any other Thursday fasters

Oh, I do hope SurpisedCat has returned home , surprised
He sounds a little scamp

Well done on returning to the gym, box
That will soon build up your fitness and help tone up any flabby bits

Just do what feels sustainable for your, duck whether single FDs or b2b
Return to the 5:2 healthy habits too on NFDs and then you'll soon be back in your old fasting swing

NFD here

43 - you made me laugh! Unfortunately I'm a G But visibly smaller now even with my rubbish posture! You will rock your b2b, keep posting! I'll look in for any posts later

Work has been so crazy this week - doing all the hours under the sun and snoozing when I can! Glad I didn't have this week with the kids home. They are with their dad and I have next week off for some much needed fun and relaxation times!

Suprised - hope your cat comes home very soon!

FD tomorrow before my babies are back, I've bloody missed them this week - no doubt they will be driving me mad again before Sunday but I wouldn't have it any other way!

The cat is back! It’d been 24 hours and I was getting worried and was outside calling him. His brother left my daughter’s bed and went outside and came back with the missing cat in tow. He’s eating and then will be shut inside. My older two are still up watching Australian swimming champs and he’s being treated like a rock star.

I’ve never done a B2B, 43. I don’t think I could. I’ve never even managed a 500 cal FD, they’re all mainly under 700. I’m always in awe of the, “kitchen closed at 450 cal, considered a snack but wasn’t hungry” posters. I’m off to bed but I’m looking forward to breakfast already.

phew glad the cat is back nolonger little scamp indeed enjoy your breakfast. I know what you mean about B2B but don't forget you get 650cals each day so you might surprise yourself...

mrd sounds like you'll have a lovely week next week with the kids, hopefully the sunshine will continue

Lunch finished, I had a subway chicken salad, sugar free jelly and 2 tiny satsumas so feeling pretty good, no idea what to have later but I've got about 300cals to play with so should manage just fine

Phw, that's a relief he's back safely, surprised

Under 700 is fine; we all develop our own system
The important thing is that it be sustainable longterm for the individual

Most people can't do a b2b - I can't unless they are miniFDs !

Well done, 43
A good healthy menu

You can plan some lovely walks together for next week, MrD

43 - Ooh new kitchen coming that’s so great. Hope day 1 of your B2B went well. I really think it’s a mind over matter thing. I was kind of dreading mine but I’ve said through today no problem at all. If anything it’s get it over and done with quicker. Enjoy your anniversary dinner, hope you’ve got a new outfit.

NoLonger - Well done on your FD, Im so pleased your cat has made a safe return.

BCF - Yeah definitely back to healthy habits now, I think sometimes I just need to press that reset button and go back to basics.
Actually I’ve been meaning to ask, your into your weights. We have free weights at home a big bar and 2 small ones (handheld) and all the weights are compatable with big / small bar (excuse my rather dodgy terminology) is there anything I can do with said free weights to target the legs?

Darcy- Good luck for your FD tomorrow.

Day 1 of b2b done at 650 cals, was planning to save 100 for extra tomorrow but ended up having some Greek yog after dinner. Just having a cuppa then it's an early night. How has everyone else got on?

We were posting at the same time.... well done quacking on nailing your b2b, you sound like you are firmly back in the 5:2 zone

Yes I am v v excited about the prospect of a new kitchen

Not a new outfit but my favourite dress which was made to measure about 7 years ago and now fits perfectly again....

Yes i think we cross posted there.
That's even better than a new outfit your going to look cracking.

Just weighed after second FD and I’m down 800g to 66.1 which is nice as for the 4 weeks prior I’d only lost 400g in total. I’m expecting not to lose much for the next few weeks but 64 is my goal so there’s no hurry.

I’ll have to work out what to do when I’m an maintenance, I really am eating normally on NFD (part of decreasing snacking) and given that my FDs are already 700cal aiming for 800cal may still result in weight loss. Is just one FD enough to maintain?

That should read apart from decreasing snacking. Silly phone

Fab sv nolonger so close....
Others on here know much more about maintenance than I do I'm yet to get there but frim what I've read maintenance is 1 fd a week but a bit of fiddling might be required depending on the person. Good luck!!

Day 2 of b2b and I'm just going to eat exactly what I ate yesterday as I was happy with that. mrd are you my fasting buddy today? Anyone else?