Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

5:2 Thread number 84: Exercise hack - Fartlek = interval training with non-regular intervals; Fartleg = lie sideways watching TV and gently raise a leg to break wind

973 replies

BigChocFrenzy · 01/03/2019 02:54

Welcome to the continuing thread for those following 5:2 or other forms of IF (Intermittent Fasting) such as 4:3, ADF, or daily 16:8 Smile

The 5:2 diet was introduced by Michael Mosely on BBC Horizon on August 2012:

Basically it is 2 very low cal days ("fasts") per week - which need not be consecutive - and eat "normally" to maintain on the other 5 days.

For those who have dieted or maybe overeaten for years, eating "normally"
means roughly the number of calories your body needs to maintain - NOT reduce - its weight (see TDEE calculator below).

IMPORTANT
If you have had Eating Disorders you should NOT do 5:2 or any other kind of fasting

ACRONYMS

16:8 is a different type of fasting, which can be combined with 5:2.
Daily zero-cal fast for 16 hours and eat within an 8 hour window. To lose weight, this needs a weekly calorie deficit as well

4:3 = fast on 3 non-consecutive days per week

ADF (Alternate-Day Fasting) = fast every other day

b2b (optional) back-to-back / consecutive fast days, each with an increased allowance of 650 calories instead of 500

BMI (Body Mass Index) healthy range is 18.5 - 24.9 for Caucasians. Upper limit may be 22 for some of Asian origin.

FD = single Fast Day: aim for 500 calories (600 for men or 25% TDEE whichever is higher) or 1000 cals for BF
No alcohol or junk on FDs
Even if you exercise strenuously, do NOT increase FD cals to allow for exercise

MFP = My Fitness Pal, a useful App or website to track food & drink calories

miniFD = MiniFD, 850- 1000 calories, no alcohol or junk

NFD = Non-Fast Day, averages around TDEE

NSV / LSV = Non Scale Victory / LifeStyle (change) Victory, e.g. compliment, smaller waist, clothes size

SV = Scale Victory

TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, the average number of calories you burn in a day, is calculated (see calculators below) from your current weight, height, age, activity level.
Aim to average about this for NFDs.

WOE / WOL = Way Of Eating / Way Of Life. We say this instead of "diet", to emphasise that we must make a permanent change in how we eat, to mainitain our new healthy weight longterm.

HOW TO START

. Take initial measurements: weight, waist, hips
. Use TDEE calculator below if you need a rough guide to how much to eat on NFDs
. Choose any 2 days for FDs, non-consecutive is easier.
. Before each FD: plan, shop & calorie count ALL food & drink for the day

Useful Resources & Calculators

Mosely's TDEE Calc - Exercisers:Use 1 activity level below what you think
Calorie Counter: mfp
Rough Calories for NFD: TDEE Calc (exercisers: set activity level to one below what you think)
BMI: Calc
Body Frame Size: Calc
Calc Ideal Weight Range
Body Fat: BF Calc
Choose / Visualise Goal Weight:
3D BMI body ripped to normal
Bod Vis Measurements & 3D rotate]]

Safe Alcohol Calc: Calc Daily UnitsCalories , Calc Weekly Units
Are You Addicted to Carbs Mosely’s Quiz

FD Recipes: BBC Good Food 52 , Mosely LowCarb , BBC Good Food 500 cal meals ,
Good2Know , Vegetarian ,
Foodie Under 200 Cals
Any Day: Meal Planner
FD Ready Meals, Takeaways, Restaurant: Mirror , Indie

FAQs / Tips

  • WATER: Start each day with a glass of water; and drink plenty during the day.
  • HOT DRINKS: No limits on tea or coffee, but on FDs count any milk / sugar calories.
  • SLEEP: Try to get enough sleep, or it may slow weight loss.
  • EXERCISE: is healthy & can help weight loss - BUT only if you do NOT eat back less than you burn. Fasted training can burn more fat.
HIIT and resistance training both work well with 5:2/IF.
  • FDs: If possible, choose days when you are busy, but not preparing meals for others.
Concentrate on protein & veg; avoid sugar or fruit juice. e.g. Stir-fries, soups & stews. Ready meals are OK.
  • BFers: start with 1000-cal FDs, optionally reduce to 700 cals gradually.
You can return to 1000 if growth spurts or sleep-deprivation require more fuel.
  • NFDs: No rules, but to improve health, try to cut down on added sugar & junk food, keep alcohol within safe limits. A few treats per week are fine.
  • Do NOT fast: if you've ever had EDs, or if pregnant, under 21, over-stressed, fever, stomach bug, even a bad cold.
  • CHECK with your Doctor: if you have diabetes, any other endocrine condition, any serious past or present medical condition, or if taking ANY prescribed medication (fasting may affect absorption rate)

Scientific Evidence for Fasting & Health

BBC article on the original Horizon program

Telegraph comments on 5:2 and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley, useful for newbies.

This InterviewPart1 and InterviewPart2 with leading ADF researcher Dr Varady explains why fasting helps you to lose weight AND improves some health markers.

Fasting boosts "autophagy" = recycling of old cells
Yoshinori Ohsumi won the 2016 Nobel prize for Medicine for research into autophagy
NOBEL Lecture “Autophagy – An Intracellular Recycling System”

Prof. R Taylor (Newcastle Uni) won the 2013 Diabetes UK Banting Prize for his Twin Cycle Hypothesis re the cause of type 2 diabetes: Twin Cycle Hypothesis T2
and showed a fasting diet could reverse T2

Dr Michelle Harvie (funded by cancer charities) showed possible benefits of intermittent fasting compared to standard daily calorie reduction in her trials (consecutive FDs) with women at high risk of breast cancer: ComparingDiets , EarlierResearch52

Dr Johnson showed intermittent fasting helped Asthma

HORMESIS & Why Intermittent Fasting Works: Mattson , BlackSwan and Hormesis

Molecular Mechanisms and Clinical Applications: J CellMetabolism
Recent research into the health benefits of fasting: e.g. by world-respected neuroscientist Dr MarkMattson (Mosely referred to his research) showed:

. Improved glucose regulation
. Loss of abdominal fat with maintenance of muscle mass
. Reduced blood pressure and heart rate
. Improved learning and memory and motor function
. Protection of neurons in the brain against dysfunction and degeneration in animal models of Alzheimer’s disease, Parkinson’s disease, stroke and Huntington’s disease.

Brain metabolism in health, aging, andneurodegeneration :
"lifestyles that include intermittent bioenergetic challenges, most notably exercise and dietary energy restriction, can increase the likelihood that the brain will function optimally and in the absence of disease throughout life"

He compared 5:2 to ordinary daily diets on overweight women with family history of breast cancer.
Fasting group lost more belly fat, retained more muscle & had slightly better blood sugar regulation.

More of his research is in HealthyAging , Health , AvoidParkinsonsDisease

His article in J Aging Mech Disease 2015 explains the health benefits of intermittent fasting in great scientific detail.

Why intermittent fasting and stopping snacking can lower your risk of serious diseases:
Meal frequency and timing in health and disease

Fasting can help maintain brain health during aging:
emboj.embopress.org/content/36/11/1474
"lifestyles that include intermittent bioenergetic challenges, most notably exercise and dietary energy restriction, can increase the likelihood that the brain will function optimally and in the absence of disease throughout life"

This interview with leading researchers into fasting in combination with standard cancer treatment: ScientificDiscussion MoselyMattsonLongo and a LongoInterview

NY Times Fasting Overview

Research by other US and European scientists in this DailyTelegraph Article about the medicinal uses of fasting, for many serious conditions & diseases.

Recent trials with Type 2 diabetics and those at risk of having it used a form of daily fasting - skipping supper.
Their conclusions: eating 1-2 meals per day is better than several small meals for losing weight and controlling insulin levels, see Type2Paper

OP posts:
Thread gallery
12
OohMrDarcy · 02/04/2019 10:49

The weather annoys me when it goes like this - its been so lovely, just bloody last a few weeks!

Hope you are hanging on in there 43, hour by hour if needs be!

nolongersurprised · 02/04/2019 11:13

It rained here in Australia too, I’ve just finished a FD, I ate about 450 but had 3 coffees (with skim milk though) because today was hard work.

43 at 2pm I was hungry and grouchy and couldn’t see myself lasting but a coffee helped and once I’d picked up the kids and was back in the usual routine of feeding them, homework, stories etc I forgot I was hungry. I ate a salad with lettuce, cucumber and carrot, a small amount of brown rice and some chicken. I didn’t eat even a single Easter egg that 3/4 of my children were packing into bags to give to friends at school.

If you’re already a few hours into it you might as well keep going, otherwise you’ll have to do it all over again later this week.

Fortythreeandfatasfuck · 02/04/2019 13:17

Thanks for the support mrd and nolonger

Well done nolonger on getting through your FD and resisting the easter eggs Smile I've made it to lunch (chicken subway salad and sugar free jelly) and so far so good, no idea yet for dinner, possibly soup as its so miserable, but another early night I reckon as feeling pooh

Earslaps · 02/04/2019 13:21

Tuesday FD here too- we shifted around as DH had a work lunch yesterday, plus I had an evening meeting so it worked well for both of us.

Nothing but green tea so far, but planning to have some stir fried beansprouts for lunch (they'll only go off otherwise), then some baked salmon and veg for dinner.

BigChocFrenzy · 02/04/2019 13:37

Well done on your FD, surprised
Excellent discipline while packing up the DC Easter eggs

Good luck, spotty, 43, MrD, earlslaps and any other Tuesday fasters

It's 20C again here, but with a brisk wind
So I've a thick fleece on & trousers, for my Rhine walk
Killer abs class tonight, then my toughest gym day is tomorrow

OP posts:
heroineinahalfshell · 02/04/2019 13:43

Hello tuesday fasters! I'm normally mon/weds FDs but changed it this week to Tues/Thurs as DH was going to see MIL yesterday - good thing too as he got caught up in M62 closure so we didn't eat til 9pm!

Last week was a good week, I started Couch to 5K and scales hit my first stone lost since starting healthy living in Jan. However, totally fell off wagon at weekend due to a bottomless brunch Saturday and hangover eating Sunday. Back on it now tho and even going to my usual Zumba class tonight (I don't usually exercise on FDs).

Today was also my first time not eating breakfast on a FD - forgot to buy eggs so fasted all morning (other than 2 cups normal/1 cup redbush tea), and have just eaten lunch of tomato soup with some toasted pumpkin seeds. Dinner tonight is Venison steak, cavolo nero & 100g new potatoes. I might have a small yoghurt before Zumba but that will push me to 530 cals for the day so will try not to.

Also first time fasting on a work from home day, so we'll see if i can avoid all the normal temptations! Going OK so far tho.

43, i'm also in Manchester - sending good fasting thoughts your way!

OohMrDarcy · 02/04/2019 14:45

I'm all fooded out for the day - Happy with my bottle of water and maybe a cup of tea with a splash of milk tonight. Feeling good.

How you doing 43?

Well done to everyone else fasting too

Fortythreeandfatasfuck · 02/04/2019 15:55

every one of your exercise days sounds tough bcf what makes tomorrow's one so hard??

waves across the city at heroine.... sun finally came out here eh?? practically cracking the flags now Grin well done on your stone SV and exercise NSV and good luck fasting from home

Doing good mrd thanks, just have to brave the commute home and i'll be fine!!! Will log back on later. Hope everyone else fasting today is doing well Smile

heroineinahalfshell · 02/04/2019 16:21

43 its sunshiney here but keeps hailing off and on!

I spoke too soon. 3 hours since lunch, 2.5 hours til dinner, and I am RAVENOUS. Just brewing up a cup of tea in hopes it fills the void.

Fortythreeandfatasfuck · 02/04/2019 18:43

Hang in there heroine you are nearly there.... I got caught in a hailstorm too.... brrrrr

Fd done slightly over at around 590, but I'll take that. Just weak squash and a cuppa later.

Having my Xmas present tomorrow, my new tattoo.... going to have a coffee and a cake afterwards Grin

Thanks for the extra support today you guys, you are an awesome lot Flowers

blodynmawr · 02/04/2019 20:14

FD done, approx 700 cals. Been busy at work and drank loads of black coffee and weak squash so haven't felt particularly hungry. Also, unlike last week, glad not to be craving porridge or other random food by this point in the day Smile.

heroineinahalfshell · 02/04/2019 20:27

Thanks 43! Well done you for getting through it. I was OK in the end - brew did the trick, and zumba was great. Finished the day at approx 570 b/c DH talked me into a small glass of red wine with our venison - but i gave him the rest of the glass after 3 sips so hopefully overestimating there!

Earslaps · 02/04/2019 21:08

FD Dinner was delicious- soy and mirin glazed salmon fillet with stir fried cabbage, broccoli, pepper and carrot with a splash of sweet chilli sauce. Finished off with an apple and a small square of dark chocolate.

Have already packed tomorrow's NFD lunch of smoked salmon on rye bread with a huge salad, and my usual yogurt with homemade granola for breakfast. Paella for dinner.

Borris · 02/04/2019 21:11

Earslaps that sounds yummy
I've done a FD yesterday and then a mini at around 900 today and another 900 tomorrow. I'm hoping that's nearly as good as my usual b2b

Going skiing in a couple of weeks. Not planning any FD away but hoping that the exercise will cancel out the cheese, wine and croissants. Or at least make a dent in it!!!

BigChocFrenzy · 02/04/2019 22:22

Congratulations on your 1st stone milestone, heroine
and on starting C25K

Now you know weekends are a danger area, you can plan next weekend to avoid triggers,
e.g. sticking to NHS alcohol limits and avoiding Saturday brunch turning into grazing

Well done on your FD, MrD, 43, Blody, heroine, earslaps

borris That sounds fine - the 2 miniFDs would more than replace an FD
Enjoy your skiiing vacation later,
but before you go, note down the date of your 1st FD back - it helps stop the break drifting into weeks & months ....

43 Wednesdays are tough because I train twice:
a morning flexibilty class and evening advanced lifting
while of course fitting in Rhine walk and my usual weekday bicycle commutes

Why not show off your new tattoo here, tomorrow evening, to be suitably admired ?

OP posts:
BigChocFrenzy · 03/04/2019 11:24

Good luck to the Wednesday fasters !

Cold & rainy here, so no Rhine walk today

OP posts:
OohMrDarcy · 03/04/2019 16:13

Quiet on here today! NFD for me

Hailing here today and car was frozen over this morning!!

43, do show us your tattoo!

BigChocFrenzy · 03/04/2019 17:12

Crikey, MrD and I was grumbling about a rainy 11C today, after several sunny days 18-20C

i wondered if everyone was out in the sun, as it is spookily quiet on the thread today

OP posts:
OohMrDarcy · 03/04/2019 19:13

I know bigchoc, crazy. Heard hints of snow briefly not far from me too Confused

Come on out to play everyone!!

EssentialHummus · 03/04/2019 20:27

Hello everyone! NFD for me today - leftover lasagne and salad from yesterday’s event, which went well - and I’ll be fasting tomorrow. I’m really just here for the tattoo pic 43 Grin.

BigChocFrenzy · 03/04/2019 23:56

Good luck tomorrow, Hummus

... and maybe 43 will give us a quick flash of her new pash

OP posts:
Fortythreeandfatasfuck · 04/04/2019 07:18

Morning everyone, I will post a pic but it's got a film over it that I have to keep on for a couple of days so will post pic once that's off Grin it really bloody hurt this time though, this is tattoo number 6 and they've never hurt before, was inside bicep so maybe that's why.

Anyway ended up having a couple of drinks to get over it but only had 1 meal yesterday as it took 4.5 hours to finish.

Blimey bcf your exercise regime sounds hardcore!!

Well done weds fasters and good luck for those fasting today.

Nfd for me then fd #2 tomorrow

BigChocFrenzy · 04/04/2019 09:04

Ouch, 43 Take care
We're all panting to see the tat when you can unveil

I'm fasting today
Anyone else ?

OP posts:
EssentialHummus · 04/04/2019 10:11

Me bigchoc, planning one main lunchtime meal of chicken and veg. Good luck today to us and any other Thursday fasters!

Earslaps · 04/04/2019 10:35

Another faster here! Planning on green tea all day, then prawns in chilli and garlic with black bean spaghetti, courgetti and lots of rocket for dinner- quick and delicious!

Got a quick run in today, which I really needed after a couple of days off exercise! Feel much happier now (despite the wet and cold weather), plus got another PB! 25.38min 5km according to Strava- must be because I was desperate to get out of the rain! Blaze and football tomorrow morning to set me up before a weekend of solo parenting Confused

Can't wait to see tattoo pics 43! I keep thinking I'd like a tattoo but I can never decide what I'd want as I change my mind all the time. Probably best to leave it then!

Good luck to BigChoc and any other Thursday fasters.

Swipe left for the next trending thread