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Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

The 5:2 thread number 32 - We can eat it tomorrow: toffees, toffee sponge or even toffee sausages!

999 replies

TurkeyAtYuleHoHo · 04/12/2013 09:32

The continuing thread for those of us following the 5:2 fast or other forms of fasting such as 4:3, ADF, or daily 16:8.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012 and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat normally - or approximately your Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE - see explanation below). 4:3 is the same except you fast on 3 days in the week. Alternate-day fasting (ADF) is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. 16:8 is another form where you stick to only eating in an 8 hour window each day, therefore fasting for 16 hours each day.

By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average for a woman, 600 for a man, on those days.

You'll find on these threads we use a number of acronyms. If you're new to the threads, or Mumsnet in general, they might not make much sense.

WOE/WOL = Way Of Eating/Way Of Life. We use this term instead of "diet" as many of us see this as something to do in the long term.

MFP = My Fitness Pal, a website or app many use for keeping track of the number of calories they're eating.

TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.

NFD = Non fast day

NSV = Non scale victory

Michael Mosley has a website to accompany his book on the subject. Please go check it out, as he's the whole reason most of us are here!

Lurkers and new starters: please just jump in and post - you'll find a lot of support here and we’re a friendly bunch.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

All our previous threads can be found by browsing through the fasting section of the site.

Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the tips and links that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!

eatriskier’s thread has some lovely inspiring stories which are worth checking out if you want some motivation to get started or keep going through a plateau. Please add your own too.

frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

If you've been at this a while and are moving on to maintaining your goal weight, there is a thread here to discuss that.

Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon.

There's a link to the aforementioned Horizon programme here.

A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

This link nicely demonstrates that there are many body ‘right’ body shapes and types, because what we are actually aiming for is low body fat for fitness and health.

A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley himself, very informative if you're just starting. (I highly recommend this for an overview)

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Something to consider if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI.

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful.

A HUGE THANK YOU to Greeneggsandnicht for putting together all this info and resources into one concise OP text, much appreciated by so many 5:2ers!

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this diet!

OP posts:
FunnyFestiveTableRunner · 06/12/2013 12:18
Umlauf · 06/12/2013 12:22

Hi!

I've been lurking for a while but haven't been keen to post up until now in case the diet didn't work and I felt like a massive flop, but it is working, so here I am!

I gave birth in September and of the 3 and a half stone I put on during pregnancy, lost 2 and a bit almost immediately. Since then I've been doing the 5:2 with my husband, with a goal of getting into my normal clothes by Christmas time really, anything else a bonus.

Height 5ft6
SW 11st3
CW 10st
GW9st 8

I don't have a tape measure but at the start of the WOE I cut two lengths of ribbon, one for my waist and one for my hips, and They are now about an inch longer each, so not loads, but I do already fit into my old jeans (hurrah!) so possibly a lot of the extra lbs are breastmilk?! I'm struggling to find the motivation at the moment due to having reached the goal, but keeping to about 600/700 cals on FDs (due to BFing) and no more than 2000 on NFDs.

My DH on the other hand, having been doing the same thing for the same amount of time, has completely plateaued and is not feeling happy about it! He lost half a stone and then no more at all. He doesn't tend to eat lunch ever though, just bread and jam at breakfast and a casserole/curry for dinner. Any ideas for how to help him?!?

ToffeeOwnsTheSausage · 06/12/2013 12:29

Baloosticka - Flowers for asking after me Grin.

MrsF - talk to him, please! He will carry on doing these selfish acts until you tell him to pack it in!

My appetite has definitely shrunk. Just made a tuna and mayo sandwich with 2 slices of bread and after one slice I am satisfied Shock.

No "letting" you go out, either MrsF. He isn't your boss. And you don't sound whiney or bitter. Just fed up and so would everyone else.

MrsFlorrick · 06/12/2013 12:39

Toffeesausage.

Your scales are most likely wrong! My scales work except for the body fat monitor part. It has stubbornly been telling me that my body fat is 45%. It was telling me that when I was over 200lbs after having DS. It's still telling me that.

I know its not correct due to having dropped dress sizes through exercise without losing weight (ie swapping muscle for fat-makes it sound so easy...)

Bigchocfrenzy had a link on a previous thread to an online body fat monitor (something US marines are measured by ?). I
You input your weight height waist measurement neck measurement and hips and you get a body fat % and apparently this one is within 2% accurate.

That one has me at about 26% so clearly my scales body fat thingy is bust. And I think yours could be too.

ToffeeOwnsTheSausage · 06/12/2013 12:47

TBH I am not unduly worried about what the scales say for fat and water %s as I understand weights better.

annielewis · 06/12/2013 13:07

MrsF your H is pissing me off just hearing about it so I can imagine how you feel! Try and get through Christmas in one piece and don't let the chocs and other 'goodies' fool you - you know you will feel better in control and maintaining your current weight - and staying on track.

Who's up for a 5:2 night out - for me that is the shittest thing about being a SAHM - no frigging boozy xmas parties! My H works for himself so can't even gatecrash his work 'do'!

Talkinpeace · 06/12/2013 13:35

Mariarossa : Welcome - and well done.
Taking control without scales is actually better than those of us who are numbers obsessed because it proves you have internalised your control methods.
Clothes : I can totally recommend checking out Charity shops - nice jeans and tops and jumpers for a couple of pounds an item
and when you shrink again, donate and replace.

Umlauf : Welcome and well done
Your DH's plateau - it largely depends on how much he has to lose as men seem to react very differently to the women (there are several men on these threads so they may have wise words)
Bit it may be better if he avoids sugar in the mornings - Jam is 60% sugar

Today is my normal weigh in day and I chose not to. I want to see how much I have internalised the mesages and see if I can hold steady without seeing a number ....

PARTY FROCK PHOTOS I'll do mine next week buy everybody has to have them up by Christmas Eve (especially the men) Xmas Wink

Talkinpeace · 06/12/2013 13:37

Bigchocfrenzy
Could you pop the link to that Nature paper over on the Tips and Hints thread so it does not get lost?

I'm nearer 50 than 40, but logically the high mortality for older underweight people will be linked to chronic disease - the data would need checking.
I'm not planning to budge for 21 for as long as I can.

TurkeyAtYuleHoHo · 06/12/2013 14:24

Hello

Being really cheeky! Haven't had chance to catch up with thread yet and can see new faces, but could I just quickly ask a question before I go back and read it all.......

Hula Hoops.... Nobbly bits or Smooth???

Finally ordering one and am not sure which to go for.

I'm guessing the nobbly might hurt more to begin, but if it is going to achieve better results in the long run - ie I might want to upgrade at some point, then I'd rather just go for it now. Can't really find any proper explanation of the difference and am in bit of hurry.

Oh and if you can all please get back to me asap as Amazon says if I order in the next 3 hours I can get it tomorrow Xmas Grin

My big fat flabby waist is waiting to be punished and I have been so pathetic with no exercise attempts so far that I am destined to be an empty saggy-skinned mess - with BigChoc no doubt laughing at me from high upon her mound of dead/exhausted gym Thors.

Any help much appreciated Thanks

Will go back and catch up 5 pages of thread!!!!

OP posts:
EatriskierDrinkAndBeMerry · 06/12/2013 14:30

I think nobby bits not boys as autocorrect insisted on is for massaging rather than exercising purposes. though the added massage may help bash the fat apart. not that any if us have fat anymore of course

EatriskierDrinkAndBeMerry · 06/12/2013 14:31

btw, I have a smooth but that's just because that was what was there

TurkeyAtYuleHoHo · 06/12/2013 14:46

Thanks Eat Wine

OP posts:
TurkeyAtYuleHoHo · 06/12/2013 14:47

the - not to!

OP posts:
sweetiepie1979 · 06/12/2013 15:11

I reckon the one with Bumps ismy really going to do much more than the other one. Except hurt maybe! But I am basing that on no knowledge of hula hooping at all. I might try it though. Does it really tone your bottom?

Hi Alouf your story is great we'll done I have 2 stone to lose post birth too just had secind dd 6week's ago. I'm not breast feeding. Did you find weight loss slowest beginning?

Another question for the pros, I think I might have lost inches but not weight what's that about? I've not done ant exercise though I do keep busy and I'm doing more than I've done for months.?Will the weight loss catch up with the inches?

MrsFlorrick · 06/12/2013 15:26

Turkey. Don't get the knobbly hoop!!! A world of pain awaits if you do!!

EatriskierDrinkAndBeMerry · 06/12/2013 15:54

the heavier it is the easier it is to spin. I'm not quite thinking of upgrading yet and I've had mine for a few months now so if that's a concern you may not need to worry

BsshBossh · 06/12/2013 16:10

Welcome umlauf :)

TurkeyAtYuleHoHo · 06/12/2013 16:10

Right! Finally caught up!!

Am working backwards in responses as last page is provoking emotional response!

AnnieL dearest twinny! Xmas Grin - I am totally with you on the 5:2 night out!! D(nearlyex)P is off out tonight for Christmas drinks/meal with colleagues. Meanwhile I am wondering how I am going to take a picture of me in my non existent party frock to upload!

Think best I might manage is pic in xmas pj's or xmas jumper - not that much of my shape will be visible!

Maybe we could have a skype party and get sloshed wearing xmas face masks! Lol!

Reading all the stuff on here about MrsF and hearing everyone's responses, is really highlighting how different we all are. I am surprised when I hear some of the comments about MrF's behaviour because, in my experience at least, that type of behaviour I have always just taken as being part of the whole sahm/ partner out working set up. The (largely) men/women divide!

That is not to say I agree with it. Rather that a lot of your reactions are making me question just how 'normal' this is.

My DP is lovely (bit impatient sometimes) with dd, and does make time for her. He'll tuck her up, dish out medication and takes her to school.

But regarding everything else home related, including all of the non-play aspects of dd's care, I pretty much do it all. Whilst granted he doesn't have much of a social life, compared to me he has lots of outlets through one thing or another.

Have I lost the plot and am actually the martyr-ish, door mat, I swore I'd never be? Have I actually turned into my mother???..

Whilst granted, a bit mental from time to time, I am no shrinking violet, and would like to think am quite a strong woman who is more than capable of fighting her own corner. I am also a very considerate and good natured person, I think, Xmas Hmm but am now starting to wonder if I have inadvertently let good naturedness snowball into doormat who can't see the woods for the trees!??

Are you all living totally different lives out there with whip cracked fellas/ones who do it right automatically??

What have I been doing wrong?

Oh and MrsF.... do yourself a favour and get all your finances in check, so that if/when you do separate, you at least have some financial security.

Although we have been engaged for 9 years (together 12), for one genuine reason or another we hadn't got around to getting married. Was never an issue because as far as we were both concerned it was always going to happen, just a matter of time. When you think you're going to spend the rest of your lives together, where's the rush! We've always had insurances in place to take care of matters should the other die, so again no unromantic reasons to rush it!

Now however, I am royally screwed!

Thanks to the shite laws in this country, I am actually, legally entitled to diddly frickin squat of my own home, contents, partner's business success of which I have helped him start/build and support through the hard slog of first few years. Not to mention all the sacrifices made for it!

I have to now rely on him being/staying reasonable, as well as the feeling of being 'kept' by somebody you no longer share a mine is yours future with - which leaves me feeling that it is not our money anymore.

Sorry! Was trying not to get started. I barely have Xmas Grin - but I won't!! I am not turning this into another of those conversations!

But I just wanted to say Mrs F - get a head start! Start looking into these things NOW. I wish I'd had the foresight. If I hadn't been so naive about our future, I might have been tempted to do something more calculated like push for a quick marriage just so I could divorce him! I stupidly allowed myself to stay sucked in by the (shared) belief that it was something we wanted to make special, so could wait a while longer. I never realised just how shafted it would leave me. Probably because I really, really, never expected us to finish.

The next bastard one is getting nowt until we're wed!!!!

.... storms off to put on Beyonce - If you like then you should've put a ring on it! Xmas Grin

Feckin life eh!

OP posts:
TurkeyAtYuleHoHo · 06/12/2013 16:19

On a positive note ......

Welcome and great to hear from you!

Umlauf, MariaRossa, FunnyFestive and Papaya

It's lovely to hear other's spin on things.

I am fasting today. Again a possible liquid ish only, although I am at 60 cals already through sugar in coffee and a bouillon, so that would put me at fail for the under 50 cal thing.

Will prob repeat wed, which had me at same as today plus a small apple, milky/water coffee and square of choc in evening.

Thanks Eat and MrsF for hula advice. I am going to go for the smoothy I think! Can't wait now to get it and be one of y'all!

OP posts:
BsshBossh · 06/12/2013 16:20

Turkey I think we all have different expectations of and personality dynamics with our OHs. I lucked out completely with my DH (and like to think he lucked out with me too) and he's so different from MrF (despite senior position, high flying career, long hours, work overseas blah blah blah). When I read these posts I get very angry but then I think if DH was like these men perhaps I would be more tolerant of such behaviour (balancing it against the other qualities I'd expect he would bring to the relationship). ??? Who knows really. You both know your OHs much better and can see other sides to their personalities that we can't see...

EatriskierDrinkAndBeMerry · 06/12/2013 16:23

turkey I'm not sure about what normal is but if dh out any blockers on me having a small social life whilst his continued his then he may find me inserting said blockers somewhere he wouldn't like Wink .

Talkinpeace · 06/12/2013 16:47

I've been with DH since we were both 19. I no longer need the cattle prod Grin

TurkeyAtYuleHoHo · 06/12/2013 16:50

That's the thing I'm getting at I guess...

With Bssh response - I have always thought regarding any 'shortcomings' - 'well at least he's got x,y,z going for him!

With Eat he is the passive to my aggressive Xmas Grin so don't think he's got it in him to try the blockers!

But what I have been questioning is whether I've been settling my expectations too low, because he wasn't an obvious bad boy bastard, have I just been grateful for a quietish life and not asked for anything more than that!?

And maybe he is actually passive aggressive, and he's getting me to be extremely low maintenance without me noticing! lol!

But then what is one's idea of a bastard?? This is the confusing part! I am so sick of seeing so many women out there with partners falling all over themselves to do lovely stuff for/with them, that I wonder why I never seem to evoke that reaction myself??

I certainly haven't asked for or had the life I would've ideally had during our time together. I always felt grateful for what we did have, rather than dwell on what was missing.

I'm gonna need help ladies! When I am all on my lonesome, and eventually one eye open for love again, I am going to need help!

Think Sandy in grease kind of help!! Xmas Grin

OP posts:
TurkeyAtYuleHoHo · 06/12/2013 16:55

I should add that there are a few more complications to matters.

He was very bad in early days. With somebody else kind of bad.

Meanwhile I have had my depressive episodes in last 8 years too so that may have made me behave more submissively. It might have changed me.

Coming from years of turmoil growing up/early adulthood, I was/am always grateful for quiet life too!

OP posts:
TurkeyAtYuleHoHo · 06/12/2013 17:16

ANYWAY!..........Moving on!.........

Lots of liquid only fast talk recently.

There was mention of a '2 back to back fds of 600 cals' study within last couple of threads. Think was the guy on the Horizon with MM. Can't remember name.

I am intrigued to know if there has been any experience of doing this by anyone we know of??

I would be intrigued to compare the two.

I am increasingly finding that fewer cals consumed on a fd is easier than trying to manage meal prep.

Also that avoiding any form of snacking is the key to making the difference between losing or not losing every week.

No snacking huh! Who'd 've thought it! Xmas Wink

OP posts: