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Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

The 5:2 thread number 32 - We can eat it tomorrow: toffees, toffee sponge or even toffee sausages!

999 replies

TurkeyAtYuleHoHo · 04/12/2013 09:32

The continuing thread for those of us following the 5:2 fast or other forms of fasting such as 4:3, ADF, or daily 16:8.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012 and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat normally - or approximately your Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE - see explanation below). 4:3 is the same except you fast on 3 days in the week. Alternate-day fasting (ADF) is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. 16:8 is another form where you stick to only eating in an 8 hour window each day, therefore fasting for 16 hours each day.

By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average for a woman, 600 for a man, on those days.

You'll find on these threads we use a number of acronyms. If you're new to the threads, or Mumsnet in general, they might not make much sense.

WOE/WOL = Way Of Eating/Way Of Life. We use this term instead of "diet" as many of us see this as something to do in the long term.

MFP = My Fitness Pal, a website or app many use for keeping track of the number of calories they're eating.

TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.

NFD = Non fast day

NSV = Non scale victory

Michael Mosley has a website to accompany his book on the subject. Please go check it out, as he's the whole reason most of us are here!

Lurkers and new starters: please just jump in and post - you'll find a lot of support here and we’re a friendly bunch.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

All our previous threads can be found by browsing through the fasting section of the site.

Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the tips and links that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!

eatriskier’s thread has some lovely inspiring stories which are worth checking out if you want some motivation to get started or keep going through a plateau. Please add your own too.

frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

If you've been at this a while and are moving on to maintaining your goal weight, there is a thread here to discuss that.

Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon.

There's a link to the aforementioned Horizon programme here.

A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

This link nicely demonstrates that there are many body ‘right’ body shapes and types, because what we are actually aiming for is low body fat for fitness and health.

A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley himself, very informative if you're just starting. (I highly recommend this for an overview)

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Something to consider if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI.

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful.

A HUGE THANK YOU to Greeneggsandnicht for putting together all this info and resources into one concise OP text, much appreciated by so many 5:2ers!

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this diet!

OP posts:
BsshBossh · 08/12/2013 07:36

rubbish feeling lonely is normal. I've felt it keenly at many junctures in my life, but I've learned from my own experiences (or loneliness, sadness etc) I can make the choice to be nice to myself at the same time, to look after myself if no one else will, to do nice things for me.

I had cancer once that had spread into my lymphs and was a bugger to cure. It took 3 long years of treatment. My whole life went on hold and I felt very lonely, sad, angry, the works. But it was also during that time that I learned that I had the choice to do good things for myself. I've always been a glass half full person (and very independent by nature as I grew up a happy only child) but the experience did make me stronger and more confident.

I think all that is my very long-winded way of saying yes you're feeling lonely, but despite that you can also do nice things for yourself.

Emmabryant123 · 08/12/2013 08:38

Just back from nyc with dh,
Oh my the food-
Frozen yoghurt, cakes, breakfast everyday although three days in a row I had oatmeal with raisins, banana, dried cranberries and pistachios. Mmm.
Two dinner of salad.
But I also enjoyed
Fries up
Starbucks hot chocs and cakes n biccies
Sandwiches
Chicken with BBQ sauce and corn bread and jacket pot
Ny cheesecake
Ben and jerries peanut butter waffle with banana peanut butter Ben and jerries and chocolate peanut butter swirl Ben and jerries (all their flavours over their wow about 100!) so jealous
Pretzels etc.
Hershey's chocolate
Their portions are amazing.

Yesterday ate just two bananas and a mini pack of mini cheddar a until 3pm then had hm fish cakes, huge heap of salad and hm coleslaw and a yogurt after, no idea how many calories yesterday.
Did two fasts after nyc.
And guess what I lost a pound after consuming 3,000 cal plus a day in nyc some days nearer 5,000!.
Might be the fact we walked 5-6 hours a day though :/

BigChocFrenzyAteYourReindeer · 08/12/2013 08:58

Bssh You are a really tough lady, to come through that long nightmare of cancer and then resume your life.
I'm so glad that life sounds a very happy and fulfilling one. You are a great role model for determination and self-confidence.
Flowers Flowers (({Big Hugs}))

I agree: It is very important to enjoy one's own company, (naturally also being with other people), because the relationship with self is the longest in every life and cannot be dissolved in the courts or otherwise

We don't want to sit miserably, polishing our whips and studded leathers, with life on hold until the next hunk comes by.
I'm off to the gym soon, to thrash some more hunks. They're not my hunks, but who cares ?
Xmas Grin

BsshBossh · 08/12/2013 09:03

Emma welcome back! I love NYC and go most years (mainly to check out restaurants!). Yep, the food is amazing :) so well done for losing a lb.

BigChoc thank you.

rubbishfamily333 · 08/12/2013 09:05

Bssh - wow that's a massive thing to go through and I feel like a bit of a whinger now as I've never had anything nearly as bad as that to go through and I can't imagine how hard it must have been. I can see what you mean as in it made you stronger though. It seems like you took something positive out of being so unwell. I agree that taking time to be kind to yourself is important and I will try to find out what I like to do so I can make myself happy alone Grin

rubbishfamily333 · 08/12/2013 09:08

Emma - wow all that food and you lost a pound? That's amazing Grin

Bigchoc - thrashing hunks sounds like fun Wink

Southeastdweller · 08/12/2013 10:24

Hi all. Back after a stressful time in between digs - the London rental market is brutal! Moving into my new permanent place next weekend and staying in North London at the moment. It's been tough but I haven't succumbed much to emotional overeating which wouldn't have been the case pre-5:2. Been eating out a lot and little time for the gym but I've consciously 'closed the kitchen down' early on most days and with that, not much pigging out and running round the city I've maintained which I'm really happy about.

Just had a veggie breakfast out - with fried halloumi which was fabulous - and looking forward to a coffee with a slice of cake later whilst I read the papers if I can get a seat.

I'll be online later at a desktop so will catch up then and see everyone's latest pics.

emma The walking in New York can offset thousands of calories a day of food consumption, which is one reason of many of why I adore the place. How did you find the shopping? Those waffles sound heavenly...

rubbishfamily333 · 08/12/2013 10:49

Where have all my fellow 30 day challengers gone? Come and join me on my exercise thread as I look like a little loner at the moment Confused I did my exercises yesterday and squats already this morning Grin

TurkeyAtYuleHoHo · 08/12/2013 10:50

(((Rubbish))) Bless you! This time of year is so bittersweet isn't it! Everywhere you look there is such a contrast of images to stir up the emotions too!!
I can only second Bssh in two ways... You really should try to make a plan of how your're going to 'get through' the festivities. Make it a positive special time for you and your dd, with lots of self indulgence and pampering.

Also going on the making choices vein.... One of the things in one of the hypnotherapy c.ds I've been banging on about, was explaining how our subconscious is programmed by our responses and reactions to things. If in the past we have dealt with or reacted to a situation in a certain way, the chances are, when that situation arises again, our learnt behaviour will repeat itself.

Because whilst our conscious mind is maybe trying to deal with things a new positive way, our subconscious mind is still programmed by the past, which is why it can feel very difficult to maintain/sustain new attitudes and behaviours.

Other than trying the hypnotherapy approach :) I can only offer from this, that it will take some new programming by yourself. If you can keep slogging away at trying a new approach/attitude to the whole Christmas time experience, using Bssh's advice for example, then after a while, your subconscious will learn that this is the new way you react to this time of year and in the future those negative, damaging feelings that arise automatically when the season begins, should be a thing of the past!

Hope that didn't sound like a load of waffle!! I guess the short version is, you won't always feel like this. But it is the choices you make that can really make a difference to your internal computer for future as well as current benefit.

This applies to our attitudes to everything really. I'm sure we can all identify with how the longer we are on this woe/wol the easier our mind/body finds it, and how our bad habits are reduced. Because our programming has changed through repetition.

On the same note as BigChocs 'stating the obvious' comment - I really hope that isn't what I have just done Xmas Grin

Which by the way BigChoc - I loved your comment. And all of your input. Please don't hesitate on the STO front because I for one need/love that kind of reiteration. Sometimes we can't see the woods for the trees, and suddenly somebody will say something in a way that just clicks! So keep on keeping on, just the way you are! X

OP posts:
TurkeyAtYuleHoHo · 08/12/2013 11:07

Bssh - You truly are a remarkable woman. And you are the poster girl for taking a massively difficult and frightening life changing experience and coming out of the other side using the experience to enhance your future life, by taking so many lessons from it.

I have always tried to live by the rule of taking the positive out of every situation. There is always one. Even if it is just to say I will use this for good/I am stronger now/I have learnt something about life.

It sounds like this is exactly what you have done. Your attitude to things in general and your calm/at peace attitude to life pours out of your posts.

I wish you a future of health and happiness, and really hope you never have to see the hideous face of cancer ever again. Well done you for taking charge of your health through 5:2 and for doing so bloomin well with it! And thank you for being such a positive and wise force on this thread for everybody's benefit.

I'm sure it has been anything but easy for you to come through so much, but you really are giving a fantastic example of how life can be lived, with the right mindset!

Thanks Thanks [dhbakery] [little choc shop in london] Thanks

OP posts:
TurkeyAtYuleHoHo · 08/12/2013 11:09

Rubbish and all..... I have to go out now so exercise tonight tomorrow but I will be on it regularly from tmw. Just a busy day ahead. But I will squat even if it's just while cooking dinner later Xmas Grin

OP posts:
TurkeyAtYuleHoHo · 08/12/2013 11:14

One last word.....

I bloody love you lot!

.... not a drop has passed my lips. Honest. Just needed to be said!

OP posts:
rubbishfamily333 · 08/12/2013 11:16

Thanks turkey, I think I do need to change the way I think and I might give hypnosis a go! How often do Tig listen to the CDs? I tried the Paul McKenna one for weightloss and was meant to listen every night. I fell alert and I don't think it really worked for me.

MelanieCheeks · 08/12/2013 11:19

Love that attitude Bssh.

BsshBossh · 08/12/2013 11:48

Turkey thank you.

rubbish try and find a NLP book at the library or online. It's a great method for reframing thoughts for the positive. NLP - neuro-linguistic programming

Right, I'm off to a big birthday bash. Lots of food though I still have this blasted cold so won't be eating as much as I want to.

BsshBossh · 08/12/2013 11:51

Oh dear. The Wikipedia article on NLP isn't very favourable, calling it a discredited pseudoscience. I personally have found it very useful though so the pseudoscience tag is irrelevant (to me).

ToffeeOwnsTheSausage · 08/12/2013 12:20

rubbish - I have the Pm I can.... make you thin, mend your broken heart and make you happy and the first two are the ones I have read and listened too. They helped but I barely lost a pound. He helped emotionally a bit with food but nowhere near as much as you guys and the broken heart thing used to need more help up to recently.

Feeling hungry today. Had some cheese but holding out for a lovely roast dinner I cam currently cooking. I have put in my new phone to fast on Mondays and start a 36 hour fast on Wednesday night. I am quite looking forward to it Shock.

ChristmasPudding6 · 08/12/2013 15:40

Heart goes out to all you guys having such a touch time with relationships and health. I wish you all the best. I'm not best places to offer any advice as thankfully I have not been through it myself but this thread is amazing for all the support you have at your fingertips (literally).

I'm fast becoming a fan of the 36 hour LOF. In the last 2 weeks I've managed to do 2 of them (one brought on by illness, the other intended) and its really helped kick me off my plateau. Now at 10st 6 (as per Sat morning) for first time I can remember without having cut out any major food groups or doing dodgy milkshake replacement plans. I'm so pleased! Although after last nights party and with lots of left over rubbish to finish off I will need a few fasts this week to rebalance.

The good news is that I feel absolutely no guilt and no worries that I will 'fall off the wagon'.

NSV my belt seems to be going one notch smaller :)

ChristmasPudding6 · 08/12/2013 15:42

I had hypnotherapy several years ago. That's how I managed to go 10 months without eating chocolate. It never quite worked for weight loss in general, but it was worth a try!

ChristmasPudding6 · 08/12/2013 15:48

I'm half way through squat challenged but missed a few days. You've all motivated me to get back to it again! Which press up challenge are you doing? Do you have a link? My arms need a really good seeing to and I get bored doing JM more than a few times.

headintheclouds · 08/12/2013 16:10

Hi ALL,
a little update from me. I had my weekly weigh in on Friday morning(post wee ,naked, pre breakfast as always) and Ive another low of 9st 10lbs.(20 llbs down since starting 5:2) Ive been pretty much static for the past few weeks, so VERY pleased with that. So pleased in fact that Ive uploaded a photo as promised TIP in my party frock just before I went out to my works Xmas 'do'.
I tried to find a pre 5:2 pic but I don't actually have one of me on my own . It was wonderful going out in a dress that was a pleasure to shop for !For the last 10 plus years Ive kind of dreaded shopping for a dress for an event-Ive always felt so matronly and meh!!! I felt fabulous on my night out and had lots of compliments.
Only 3 lbs to go to target -Come on everyone get your photos loaded!

BigChocFrenzyAteYourReindeer · 08/12/2013 16:35

Just back from the gym: spin, then weights , followed by my first Xmas party of the year, which was a gym buffet. I only had a few small canapes on pumpkin bread, because I was breaking a 38-hr sub-200 fast, which included spin yesterday and today's spin plus a few weights. So, I was not tempted by the mulled wine or the massive number of choc cookies.
Xmas Shock
I've since scoffed a double portion of kebab and salad (hooray for NFDs !), but only ate one portion of chips. I had 2 pots of rice pud, but only a moderate amount of frozen choc and orange yoghurts. No ice cream.
Xmas Shock
Kitchen is now closed, so I'll be slightly sub-TDEE today. This week I was pretty disciplined except for Friday and even that was sub-4000 (just), so I don't count it as a real Frenzy. I've kept to NND.
5:2 has definitely improved my habits, even though you probably all still think I'm very greedy!
Xmas Smile
So, yes I have my Xmas pics, but none of us were wearing our party gear and I'm hanging from the rafters or holding heavy weights ! I'll have to edit and post them tomorrow (my zero-cal FD lunch) because my gym pal who took them for me had a few mugs of the mulled wine, so every photo has heads or bottoms coming out of walls and plant pots.
Xmas Smile
My only other 2013 Xmas party will be outdoors, so I'll be layered like Michelin woman, rendering photos pointless.

Talkinpeace · 08/12/2013 16:54

headintheclouds you look fantastic
buff your nails and polish that smile

for those feeling lonely at crimble
I've not done it but single friends have
serving meals and generally arsing about for homeless shelters and old people homes can be utterly uplifting - and provide networks who last because they are by choice not blood

many of the people in soup kitchen type places have grandkids they never see, so if you take your kids they will be spoilt rotten and appreciated (in safety because you are there) and made to feel more valued than they ever have before
and you get to grin at their happiness

and Christmas starts to mean something again
just a thought

BigChocFrenzyAteYourReindeer · 08/12/2013 16:57

Well done on the new SV, HeadIn. You look beautiful, so elegant in your party frock. No wonder you recvd all those compliments, thoroughly deserved.

Bssh NLP may be one of those things that help some individuals but not others; hence why it doesn't show up well in the statistics.

Established medical opinion is occasionally wrong (think how long before HRT problems were found). I also disagree with their blanket panning of supplements / vitamins and their pushing of statins, also the low fat / high carb diet for all.

peplum41 · 08/12/2013 17:02

Hi rubbish what's this thread you've started? That must have passed me by somehow.
Mincepies

((southeast)) hope you like your new pad (and neighbours aren't feral).
Mincepies.

weetabix great post, I think a few are nervously regarding the approaching feasts and fearing the worst for their waistline. I've avoided mincepies so far. I love them.

And emma glad nyc was a great trip,would love to go there. Just to go to the land of Ben and jerrys. Mincepies.

Oh I need Mincepies!!

FD today, didn't feel like it this morning, but it had to be today or not til Thursday, plus I ate loads last night at friends, including pizza and some baileys cake thing.

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