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Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

The 5:2 thread number 31 - Getting healthier one day at a time.

999 replies

BetsyBell · 19/11/2013 10:36

The continuing thread for those of us following the 5:2 fast or other forms of fasting such as 4:3, ADF, or daily 16:8.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012 and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat normally - or approximately your Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE - see explanation below). 4:3 is the same except you fast on 3 days in the week. Alternate-day fasting (ADF) is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. 16:8 is another form where you stick to only eating in an 8 hour window each day, therefore fasting for 16 hours each day.

By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average for a woman, 600 for a man, on those days.

You'll find on these threads we use a number of acronyms. If you're new to the threads, or Mumsnet in general, they might not make much sense.

WOE/WOL = Way Of Eating/Way Of Life. We use this term instead of "diet" as many of us see this as something to do in the long term.

MFP = My Fitness Pal, a website or app many use for keeping track of the number of calories they're eating.

TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.

NFD = Non fast day

NSV = Non scale victory

Michael Mosley has a website to accompany his book on the subject. Please go check it out, as he's the whole reason most of us are here!

Lurkers and new starters: please just jump in and post - you'll find a lot of support here and we’re a friendly bunch.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

All our previous threads can be found by browsing through the fasting section of the site.

Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the tips and links that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!

eatriskier’s thread has some lovely inspiring stories which are worth checking out if you want some motivation to get started or keep going through a plateau. Please add your own too.

frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

If you've been at this a while and are moving on to maintaining your goal weight, there is a thread here to discuss that.

Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon.

There's a link to the aforementioned Horizon programme here.

A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

This link nicely demonstrates that there are many body ‘right’ body shapes and types, because what we are actually aiming for is low body fat for fitness and health.

A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley himself, very informative if you're just starting. (I highly recommend this for an overview)

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Something to consider if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI.

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful.

A HUGE THANK YOU to Greeneggsandnicht for putting together all this info and resources into one concise OP text, much appreciated by so many 5:2ers!

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this diet!

OP posts:
LikeaHurricane · 27/11/2013 22:22

Delurks cos of cinnamon roll temptation with a question.......
Mrs Florrick or Bread & Wine is there any stage at which the rolls/snails could be frozen?? Would love to have these whilst opening pressies on Christmas morning but won't have time to make them on either Christmas Eve or the day before.
Back to the land of lurk in anticipation..........Grin

Coveredinweetabix · 27/11/2013 22:22

I've gone slightly off the rails here. Yesterday was a NFDS but I ate way over my TDEE. Was determined to get back on track today with a good FD and exercise but didn't get home from work until 9.30 and, by the time I'd done some chores, it seemed a bit late to Shred so I went into the kitchen & just nibbled on some of DP's left over pizza and then some more and then a but more. I already know Friday's planned FD is going to be a fail as I'm now out for dinner in the evening. I don't think I'll be 10st6 on Sat which was the aim. On the positive side, despite the fact that I now want some post-pizza ice cream, I am resisting. And DP just offered to make me a hot choc & I said no.
Goals are to have a below TDEE day tomorrow and then have a really light lunch on Fri.

Coveredinweetabix · 27/11/2013 22:24

And hugs to Toffee and everyone else feeling a bit overwhelmed at the moment. I never realised that so many things would get thrown at you as an adult and that they would have a tendency to all come at once.

somewherebecomingrain · 27/11/2013 22:25

FD fail. Dp insisted on 3 episodes of breaking bad. His energy just knocked me off plan. I could have done a LOF if it wasn't for him.

Peanuts, quiche, salad, chocolate tart, chocolate. List of shame.

Sad

I need an early night on FDs.

BigChocFrenzy · 27/11/2013 22:29

Toffee, Cuckoo You have both been through such troubles for many years and are coping so bravely, without much help. Big squishy hugs to you both !
(({})) Flowers cake

Just vent here when things start to get too much. There is usually someone around to listen read.

BigChocFrenzy · 27/11/2013 22:44

For Cuckoo and all who like reading about playing with hunks and other gym toys:

I accidentally broke my first 6'5" toy. He doesn't do CrossFit anymore because he says it is too tough
Hmm
Just returned from 90 mins boxing, where today they let me play with another toy, must be 6'6"

BigChocFrenzy · 27/11/2013 22:52

Further report on boxing and hunk exercises:

Sometimes we do a fun contact exercise where we basically try pushing each other around, for 3 sets of 1 minute.

In standing position, I put one shoulder against the shoulder of my opponent, my foot and lower leg next to his, then we put both hands on each others hips.

From this position, we are shoving each other at the shoulder, trying to establish dominance

BigChocFrenzy · 27/11/2013 23:03

EatRiskier I hope you have managed to put a cork in DD, before she floods RiskierTowers ! What a lot of (smelly, yuk) work for you.

I trust a chastened DH is now helping with the pee-mopping, but I know the weaker sex come over faint when faced with such tasks. Something to do with having a spout, I suppose. Well, shout at him if he deserves it.
You deserve
Wine

Talkinpeace · 27/11/2013 23:04

FAST DAY FAIL
there is no such thing
there is
Fast day deferred
or
Fast day converted to mini fast
or
Fast day converted to 16:8
but you cannot fail

All I would ask is that if you do go wildly overboard on an unintended eating day, pop the details into MFP along with how you felt and why so that you have an extra "control reminder" to help you keep tabs on things next time.

BigChocFrenzy · 27/11/2013 23:17

Cuckoo Really well done for giving up smoking.
Flowers
It is absolutely the best thing you can do for your DD, to make sure you are around for her. Cigarettes killed my dad when I was a little girl and it was shattering.

Better to be overweight than a smoker. You can still be fit (but 4:3 must be producing a slimmer avian)

Night everyone

CuckooAtchooUhOh · 27/11/2013 23:25

Toffee Yes unfortunately same here about telling folk! I should've made that clear in my post. The only people I have been able to talk to about it are strangers on this thread!, or medical professionals. I have mentioned it to certain members of family, including inlaws, but it is such a complex issue and very difficult to explain to people who don't have personal experience, or seem really uncomfortable with subject.

And to my complete disgust there are those who simply look at you as if you're just weak, or whimpy when in actual fact, they couldn't handle a fraction of the crap! And these are relatives I'm talking about!

I think that is why I am so happy to talk about it on here. Albeit, I am in a positive enough frame of mind to do so at the moment. Sometimes I still just want to hide. But it is nice to talk about it. Can't do that with real life friends. What with not having any and all that! Grin

The hypnotherapy, I was similar to you. Didn't know what to expect, but I was very open and willing to try something new. I read lots of reviews and settled on a therapist to try, through their website. You can buy cds or download direct. (Obviously you can do this in person at a therapists too) For me, I liked the being able to try in my own home, in own time and knew that I was both open minded enough to give it a fair try, yet also sceptical enough not to fall for any old hogwash!

My perception of what the feeling of being hypnotised is probably similar to yours and fairly common. After the first go, I wasn't convinced I had 'done it properly' so I kept looking on hypnotherapy websites and for info on the experience. When I was satisfied that actually it is just about being in a very relaxed, almost as if on verge of sleep, trance like state, whilst still being in total control of everything, I relaxed and became even more receptive to it.

The lady I use, I find so soothing. I cried after first time. The story she used was so descriptive and I could connect with so much, that it felt as if she might as well have been hugging me herself. She talks you into a very relaxed state, then plants new ideas into your subconscious to help change your thought patterns at a deeper level. But all very above board! You will not want to rob a bank or act like chicken!

It really does work. For me anyway. I swear by it. I am so grateful I ever tried it, because it changed things for me in a way nothing has worked before. Obviously there are still other things to do alongside it. But the hypno, actually helps to make those things happen too.

You would not have caught me, cutting out drink, taking up my studies again, doing umpteen things I had been avoiding for years or having the confidence to be on here hanging up my washing for all and sundry, before I had started with them!

I actually need to have a few top up sessions, because I have been noticing a slightly downward turn with each month that goes by since autumn kicked in. But now it is just case of make time (an hour tops) as and when, to get me back on track. I must do tmw actually!! Keep getting sidetracked, but now need to act when I recognise those signs, so no excuses! (Wags finger at self)

Waffle Alert! Again lol!

rubbishfamily333 · 27/11/2013 23:39

toffee - I know how you feel "I just want someone to look after me sometimes. I have never had it, ever, and I want it"

I also feel like this. I dont think I'm depressed but I havnt had the nicest childhood and my family are rubbish. Note the name Grin so also feel like I would like someone to look after me. I am a single parent to a lovely 6 year old.

I have counselling every week and had a session today where my counseller said when we were speaking about something that she feels like I am waiting in the bus station. It made me feel like she is right, I sometimes feel like I am going through the motions of living life, but I'm not really living my life. I feel abit like I want a real adult to come and tell me what to do, make decisons or come to my rescue. Unfortuntly I doubt that will happen.

I appear to be in control, I run my own house, have my own car, look after my dd with hardly any help from her dad, but I just feel incomplete somehow Confused. I do often feel like I'm waiting for something or someone but I know that has to come from me and no one else can give me what I am missing.

cuckoo what hypno cds do you listen to?

rubbishfamily333 · 27/11/2013 23:42

well today I went over by 341 cals. I really hope I loose weight this week as I only lost 0.6 lbs last week :(

CuckooAtchooUhOh · 27/11/2013 23:48

BigChoc you big (in a hearted not arse size) lovely lady X

Thanks for you and (((X))) on losing your dad so young. That is why I had to stop when pregnant with dd. I was so concerned about leaving her prematurely.

It's been 9 years now, bar a total of about 6 months relapse, in very difficult times, so I think I'm out of it now. Never even remotely tempted anymore. In fact, I am the worlds worst kind of ex smoker. I practically suffocate if I have to walk through or behind anyone puffing out the dreaded weed! And the complaining/drama I make about people fagging outside shops/hospitals/buildings!! I really am bad!

I absolutely love hearing your gym tales! Not for the lecherous reasons you might think either. In fact you make them sound quite pathetic lol! But I just picture you (from your pic), all kick ass attacking these giants and bellowing at them til they cry! It is hilarious stuff!

I do hope you are charging for dominatrix services??? There is top dollar to be had in that kind of malarkey! Maybe you could do 2 for 1. Start up new sideline career 'entertaining' some gentlefolk as a dominatrix, whilst getting to kick seven bells of shite out of them to practice gym moves. You will probably get extra for making them cry too Hmm kerching!!

Night! [jar of miracle non fat bestest ever nut butter]

CuckooAtchooUhOh · 28/11/2013 00:10

Rubbish ((((())))) to you too! I know there are lots of people out there struggling everyday with a world of crap!

Sounds like you are doing a remarkable job under the circumstances and hats off to you as a single parent especially!

The lady I swear by is called... Sharon Shinwell. I think the website is called here to listen. I can't say this will work for anyone or everyone, but it has for me, when lots of stuff didn't. Was surprisingly, one of the last things I expected to try or be of any real use. Has honestly changed my life!

I have downloaded (after purchasing) 3 different cds. There are actually loads of different subjects to choose from.

Lots of other people out there to try also, but I did find it bit of mission trying to work out who was any good or not. One bloke who's name I forget, had a sample on his website, I swear I actually burst out laughing when I heard him shouting 'Sleep' in an almost sinister sounding, strong south east accent. Could not have taken that seriously!

Guess it's quite personal. I found Sharon's site through various links on my google searches and then read that she was NHS recommended or something too. That decided it for me, so I thought what the heck for £8, it's worth a shot. Not looked back! Think it's something we def need to hear more about.

Website is: selfhypnosisuk.com / here to listen.

CuckooAtchooUhOh · 28/11/2013 00:11

They also do a gastric band one!

But we don't need that with IF do we! Wink

CuckooAtchooUhOh · 28/11/2013 00:20

For anyone interested click on the 'Myths' icon on the home page for a good explanation of things you will hear and experience. It is truly amazing stuff!

Right really am buggering off now!!

toffeesponge · 28/11/2013 08:02

Morning all Smile

Dreading today. DS2 isn't behaving too well at school (week two in a new one) and I dread what might happen today. I told the kids off in front of his teacher and the deputy head, raising my voice slightly, so think they will be Hmmabout me. I was already teary so it tipped me over a bit.

Cuckoo - DH told his father I was depressed. FIL asked what I had to be depressed about Angry. At that point I was 8 months pregnant, my Nana was dying (my only family to bother with me) and I had a 1 year old and a 4 year old.

I don't fully understand the hypno whatsit but I definitely would like to try it so any pointers would be great, thank you. I have used CD's in the past - two Paul McKenna ones but not sure they helped or worked.

Now go and do your listening!

Rubbishfamily - I totally get what you mean. I know I am waiting for my life to start and get to the next stage in the hope it will be better and easier than the one I am in.

I hate being so bloody emotional all the time. It is never good to cry in front of school staff Blush.

Now I have to get DS to school when he isn't feeling well and wants to go back to his first school Sad.

BetsyBell · 28/11/2013 08:24

Here's wishing everyone a great Thursday! Fast day for me - it doesn't feel like one as I deferred Monday's to Tuesday so I must keep reminding myself…

Toffee Thanks for the well wishing - was a dehydration headache mixed with a cold that's coming on I think. I'm afraid I suffer from a touch of the cuckoo's on cold days so if I'm at work all day (I'm not usually) I daren't drink too much as my job is such that I can't run off for a wee whenever I like. I definitely used to have no bladder issues and it seems to have got worse in the last year or so - bit of a delayed post-birth reaction (by 8 years!) so perhaps exercise and general ageing is to blame…

On that note …. CLENCH ….. Grin

NNN is going well - I resisted the mountain of cake several times in the staffroom yesterday. I succumbed to 1 tsp of Peanut Hottie which I mixed into a mug of Barley Cup - so a bit of sugar but hardly any and very satiating. The alternative was doing the same with a spoon of Options but I feel icky about the aspartame.

Lots of nuts and dried fruit but wheat has been avoided and after reading Bssh's lunch yesterday I decided on brown rice with dinner. I love brown rice and was delighted to see the fussy kids tucking into it too - I'm sure they wouldn't normally. The trick was to not even offer it to them, piqued their interest!

OP posts:
duckyfuzz · 28/11/2013 08:25

Toffee, not sure I can find words just Thanks and Brew and hugs Sad

TDEE question - if TDEE is calculated based on how active you are, then you use this as basis for NFDs in MFP, but then adding exercise on MFP, does that mean you double the exercise impact? Should I stop adding exercise in MFP or just use a no exercise at all TDEE or carry on as I am?

duckyfuzz · 28/11/2013 08:27

Bladder issues - have always needed frequent wees, especially in the morning and middle of the night when camping Hmm

BetsyBell · 28/11/2013 08:34

ducky There's nothing like knowing it's difficult to get to a toilet to really need to go all the time!

If you're wanting to lose weight it's best not to offset (eat back!) exercise calories. If you feel genuinely hungry then eat some extra food of the nutritious variety but if not then don't.

toffee I think we all want to look after you on here. I'm sorry we can't be there for you in RL. xxx

OP posts:
TheLeastAccomplishedBennetGirl · 28/11/2013 08:34

Morning everyone, bliley, you lot can natter!

FD today, am planning teas and water until evening then have a lovely vegetable soup to heat up.

I haven't had the chance to weigh in this week, but my clothes are feeling very saggy! My GYM stuff keeps falling down when I'm jumping Grin good job I only use it in the house, should be ok on my run, my elastic belt will help keep them up.

Good luck to everyone fasting today, we can eat that tomorrow!

CuckooAtchooUhOh · 28/11/2013 08:43

Morning All,

So yesterday was a fd. Managed under 500 so that is my two basics for the week. Would ideally like to keep up with 4:3 but finding it tougher to fit in this week. Will prob opt for 16:8 everyday instead. Except today as I will be getting my freak on with some Deviant Porridge later!

Haven't weighed in yet but feel like haven't lost. Could just be pmt bloat and water retention, and when I get on scales after totm I'll be half stone lighter??? [eager face]

Toffee I will pm you later so can make it a bit more personal to your situation. Please just try to hang on in there. What you can't see right now through all the stress you are under, is actually what an amazing job you are doing. It is not for nothing, all this crap. As for your ds, that is difficult yes. We don't know what we're doing as parents half the time, and nothing is straightforward! All you can keep doing is your best. I will pm you anyway Thanks

rubbishfamily333 · 28/11/2013 09:12

Morning all fd today! In my freezing cold office Shock

I am considering changing fd to Sunday and Wednesdays as I can be at home and keep warm! How do you all get on with fasting when not at work?

Well even after eating two chocolate cheese cakes yesterday I was 10.3.6 this morning so I'm hopeful for tomorrow Grin