Daughter not made a sixer when a younger child was

[tomtom88]

Ok so please be kind.

Daughter is in Brownies, the old leaders left recently and a new leader took over. I appreciate all the leaders are volunteers.

Without warning - the new leader allocated sixer and seconder roles, with my daughter being given a seconder role in a group of 2 where the other girl was the same age. In another group a child a year younger, who is a lovely girl but very scatty was given the sixer role. At the meeting brown owl said these are not permanent roles because sometimes I change things and swap things about.

Daughter gutted not to be a sixer.

I messaged brown owl in a very polite way thanking her for taking over the group, expressing that my daughter was disappointed, and drawing her attention to the fact a younger girl. I asked are these decisions permanent (she has implied they were not at the session)
Anyway she got back and said, oh your daughter will get the opportunity "at some point" eg not specified so could mean never if they cannot expand the group and then stated " she couldn't now take the opportunity to be a sixer off one of the other girls" although obviously by chosing the other girls and not being flexible she has effectively taken the opportunity to be a sixer from my daughter. I would have thought she should have given thought before allocating the younger girl in yr3 to be a sixer and perhaps swapped the girls over in their groups so the yr3 became the seconder and my daughter the sixer int he other group.

Long read - any thoughts

Your daughter will only suffer from The Choice if you keep whining on about it.

You can acknowledge her disappointment, but she needs to learn that’s life, and ‘life ain’t easy’. You can easily turn this around in your child’s head by being positive and encouraging, and generally smoothing the edges.

The woman who has taken control is probably already rolling her eyes and thinking why do I bother, support her, don’t put her down.

Give your head a quick wobble, get some perspective and move on!

You are not unreasonable to ask the question, however you have had an answer. (Which you found unsatisfactory) so it really should be left there.

what do you want to happen? Your daughter made a sixer because you complained ( which any further comment will be) or a better explanation of how/why the decisions were made?

If OP became Brown Owl 🦉 and promoted her daughter to Sixer status it wouldn’t look good.

I wasn’t a Sixer, ( Sprite) but the Sixers were generally the older sensible bossier girls.

No one would have dared questioned Brown Owl 🦉 as a parent , or as a Brownie.

It's a volunteer-run organisation. If you disagree with how it's being run, have you considered joining as a parent helper? They'd no doubt be glad of the extra help.

Me too - I still remember how unfair it felt and I'm nearly 60!

Blonde. Always an angel

Honestly OP, this is an absolutely tiny Brownie pack with ?8 members? Please just encourage her to concentrate on having fun and making friends. She has a whole lifetime to "develop leadership skills".

Maybe it would help you to imagine what the other girl’s mother would be posting on here if you had got your way, to help remind yourself that your daughter isn’t the only one with feelings that can get hurt.

Give your head a quick wobble, get some perspective and move on!

Best piece of advice on this whole thread

Yes it does, it is usually given to the older girls in my experience of being a volunteer at brownies. If there had been an order girl who had just joined and a younger one had been there a long time, then there would be consideration for the younger girl being a sixther.

Maybe chance for your daughter to understand things don’t always go their way. If your daughter was a sixer in her group the current sixer would be in the same position as your daughter

This is a great opportunity to work with your daughter to teach her some valuable life skills (clue- it’s not kicking off at volunteers because you don’t get what you want)

Also just to clarify - its a small group with 4 groups each with 2 in.

@tomtom88 so every girl is either a sixer or a seconder, in their group of 2?

If that's the setup, they would be better of having two groups of four.

However, I don't think you should pursue this. Not every kid is going to be a sixer, head of year, or lead in the school play. And not everyone gets the job they apply for or the dream home they put an offer on.

Disappointment is a part of life. I get that you want to protect her, but your daughter is going to have to learn that sometime, same as we all have.

4 groups of 2 is nuts better to have 2 groups of 4 surely.

I think this is a bad lesson for a child to learn

I was always taught to suck up every little and big injustice that affected me. The problem with that is people then know you can be walked all over and you aren’t going to be a problem

Had someone actually say they didn’t give me a particular role because when it came down to it the alternative person would have raised merry hell if they hadnt got the role and they knew I wasn’t going to cause a fuss

It must differ between groups then. A few others have posted that age isn't considered in their brownie groups and it wasn't in mine when I volunteered either.

Most children won’t have experience of being head girl or boy, or deputy. Most children won’t have the experience of being an elite athlete. Most won’t have experience of being the most able in the class.

You politely asked Brown Owl what her reasoning was. She replied with an explanation.

I think that it’s necessary to understand that our children will experience disappointment sometimes, will fail sometimes and will succeed sometimes. If she enjoys going to Brownies, surely that’s good enough.

Have you looked at the badge work that your daughter has done? She may have gained the relevant badge in a different way whereas those chosen as sixers may not. That would play a part in scouts. .

You do sound very critical of the new volunteer. Perhaps give her a chance, get involved or consider moving your daughter if you are that concerned? It sounds like the group may not be viable long term

I only got to be an Angel once!
Mary was the coveted role- I remember being disappointed at 5 when the gorgeous muslin gowns and tinsel haloes were given out and I didn’t get one!

When I was an Angel at 7, mum made me a gorgeous halo that the teacher said was more suited to Angel Gabriel- and tried to make it go on his head- luckily it didn’t fit!

I can’t see anywhere in what you’ve posted that she "is now saying it’s permanent". She has rightly refused to take the position away right now from the child who only just been given it, but that is not the same as it being "permanent".

For the "eldest are usually the sixers" discussion...

Its usually the eldest girls (or boys for Scouts) who have shown that they are responsible and experienced enough.

I thinknmany of us would agree that 4 groups of two is madness, but it could well be they've got lots of new girls starting shortly.

I'm of the opinion of " It's a hard knock life and What doesn't kill you makes you stronger ".
Ok she never made it this time , but it will be so much sweeter when she does.
We want the best for our children , I get that , but the reality is , she just one in a big crowd .
You can't go through life expecting she's going to be first pick , best in group /class , top dog in everything .
Be kind to yourself ( and her ) by showing her what will be , will be .

I think the difference is the word sometimes

Sometime indicates they are quite intelligent and know what they are doing most of the time

How to work with a boss who doesn’t know what they are doing 100% of the time

Keep records of their erratic behaviour as you don’t know when they will try to blame their F**k ups on you

(Thats from personal experience)

You are not running the show. Not your place to interfere.

And reading this thread I am not surprised.

OP, if you wish Brownies (or whatever) to run in the way that you want it running and to give your daughter everything she wants, then you should volunteer and run the thing yourself. Otherwise be grateful that people are willing to provide these opportunities for others (and not just your daughter).

As for your daughters disappointment, this is a life lesson - you don't always get what you want or even deserve. If you go through life having your mother intercede to get you what you want, then you are going to end up in a very sad place.

Well firstly being a sixer in a group of two makes the role meaningless because there’s no “six” to lead.

And secondly life is often disappointing and unfair so this is a good opportunity to teach your daughter the life skills she will need to cope with that. Stop focusing on the thing that’s out of her control (the decision) and help her with what she can control (her reaction to it) and you’ll help her develop resilience which will be far more useful in the long run that anything she might gain from being a sixer.

'My daughter herself was upset and disappointed and as a parent I questioned the decision. interfered

and reassured her everything would be fine / sort itself out in the future