2018 Running number 2

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Hi lovelies! I was just about to join the running thread and saw it was almost full and couldn’t find another
I’ve copied below from the last thread and I hope you don’t mind me joining you all!

This is the 12th thread since it started with a few of us who wanted to chat about our running, running clothes, support each other and get some training tips.

We talk about our runs and support and encourage where needed.

Please feel free to come and join us and add your miles to our running total for the month for the whole thread in bold at the bottom of each post.
Currently on 10.2 for September

Best wishes

Oh! Thanks @AuntieStella! I thought you must all be absolute machines

It really is true what they say about fitness coming back quickly. My run this morning was worlds away from my first runs back last week! I'm now running 5ks four or five times a week.

I'm not sure what level to aim for while pregnant, I was running 50-60 miles a week, usual long run being 15-20 miles with a mid week 15 miler. My 'happy' level of fitness is 'I can run a competent half marathon whenever someone asks me to'...erm, not that anyone has ever requested that I run one, but I'm sure it will come in useful for the zombie apocalypse!

Easy run in the woods and pouring rain this morning, nice and muddy!
stegosaurus can you just go by feel rather than a set mileage? Maybe do the same amount 2 weeks in a row, then up it a little and see how you feel. My youngest child was 4 when I started running, so I haven't experienced this myself, but I have heard other pregnant women say that their bodies told them when they'd done too much or when they should finally stop. I think it's really what feels right for you.

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That’s good news stegosaurus! I second going by feel, maybe class a 10k as a longer run for now?

I did a hill interval session before work on my own yesterday, normally only now to peer pressure at running club to do one. Felt smug for the whole day!!

496.3

Well done Buster!
Tempo run this morning, managed a really good pace -for me anyway! Beautiful sunny day, feeling very happy and a bit less scared of cross country!

502.3

Hello again.
Sorry keep falling off the thread then I managed to literally fall off the ground when running the other day. Just tripped over and landed quite hard but just a bit battered and bruised. Luckily no one saw it
Think I’ll take it easy for a few days
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Oh no IRun - I'm glad you weren't seriously injured or seriously embarrassed! Poor you though, falling over is always a nasty shock to the system.

I did a bit of a silly long run today - wasn't really counting mileage, just wanted to do "roughly a half". Ended up doing 17 miles which is 5 more than I've ever done before which is silly in itself but sillier still I didn't have any water with me. In all fairness I wasn't actually thirsty when I finished but I can see that that probably wasn't sensible!

This leads to a (potentially very stupid) question I was musing as I ran though- is it just because of sweating that we need extra water when we exercise or is there more to it? I don't sweat at all (not even a hint of moistness today) unless it's genuinely warm so just wondering what this means for my fluid needs.

Really can't believe this time last month I'd only ever run 3 miles at a time... this week- 31 since Monday!

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Irvina you use water for respiration (making energy from breathing/stored energy etc)

My science knowledge is shite pretty poor- but basically once you’re using stored glycogen for energy, you need water to ‘release’ it’s energy, plus oxygen, to fuel your run. Every molecule of glycogen also holds 3-4 molecules of water. Someone more knowledgeable will tell you more, but basically if you’re dehydrated you simply cannot make energy as effectively. I don’t carry water for anything under about 10km now, but I read somewhere that you should hydrate beforehand so I drink a few pints of water before I run long distances. And I always carry a pound coin in case I need water when I’m out. I don’t know how it works if you run glycogen depleted/fasted or the later stages of a long run when you’re burning fat, when glycogen is gone, so I’m very interested in any other posters knowledge on this.

Weigh yourself before and after you run- honestly, it’s about 3-4lbs for me on a 12/13km run. That’s literally pints of water.

I don’t sweat much either

Ooh that's really interesting! Thank you very much bear I love how you say you're not knowledgable and then demonstrate a great big load of excellent knowledge. I can only imagine how much you know about things you claim to be an expert of!

What you say makes a lot of sense though- I will try the weighing thing next time out of interest. I am v light already so it might be a bit worrying seeing a post-run record low weight.

(Also, totally off topic, but when I first saw your username I used to read it to myself as The New Wave Rage Bear which I think is actually a fantastic alternative if you're ever considering a name change!

Haha yes I get called that sometimes. I was always ‘average bear’ (eg Yogi, smarter than the average bear) and then a few years ago there was a hacker on the site and we all had to change names- hence ‘the new’. New wave Rage bear could be my alter ego!

My knowledge of glycogen/water etc is purely because I do a low carb diet to lose weight, so have researched it a bit. I will add as well, I have started having some starchy carbs the night before my long run (eg porridge oats) and I’ve taken 20-40 seconds per km off (today went from an average of 6m20 to 5m 37 per km on a 10km run) - which cannot be down to 20g if porridge. I reckon (musing while running, like you Irv,) that it must be water/glycogen related somehow, but I don’t know how!

Ah it's funny you mention low carb. I am (actually was) a fellow low carber and have been a proper lurker on the BIWI Bootcamp threads for years and years (to the point where I "know" all of the regulars really well without any of them knowing me as I'm just a creepy lurker).

I've never done it to lose weight- although I did when I first started five or six years ago but I've just found it to be an amazing way to make sure I'm eating for health rather than for the wrong reasons. I absolutely adore vegetables and don't miss bread/rice/pasta at all. I would so much rather a massive portion of za'atar roasted cauliflower (or whatever) than chips.

HOWEVER I am really considering eating all of my words on this subject. I've been totally adamant that it's the healthiest best way to eat for so long but this new found ability to run really far has just happened to coincide with my first forays into carb centric eating experimentation. It's only been pre- run but (like you) I've had oats, legumes and bananas. I honestly think this has been what's made the difference and it's made me question whether LCHF is genuinely healthier if I'm able to run so much more easily with the extra carbs... I know what people say about being fat adapted and Tim Noakes etc etc but for me personally it seems carbs do = more energy. I think going forward I'll go more moderate carb- loads of veg, legumes galore, plus oats and all root veg and fruit.

(Sorry that was so long, I've clearly been musing too much!)

I have heard some experts say that what is low carb varies from person to person, based on your own metabolism, so maybe you just need a little more carbs Irvina. Can't speak from experience tho, I do my best to avoid the 'bad' carbs and eat the healthier ones like sweet potatoes & oats.

Irvana I eat around 50g carbs a day but no potatoes, rice, bread, pasta, grains, sugar, or fruit (occasionally berries). I have a ‘day off’ a month, and occasional misdemeanours! I’ve done it to lose weight (lost nearly 3 stone this year) - but, when I started I was brand new at running so would do 3 km/ 5km was my longest. Now I’m running 150 km a month, every month, plus I have more muscle to sustain all the time, and less body fat, I definitely felt my performance waning. I could do the runs (and I run my shorter runs fasted as well) but I was finding I just couldn’t pick my pace up; plus when I got in from my run, I was literally a starving animal, I was clearly getting quite hungry ‘long term’ as opposed to actual immediate hunger. My body was fighting me it felt like, and I was forcing it to run on empty and not refuelling properly.

So, anyway- this month I decided to shake it up a bit. I’ve stopped counting carbs and calories, and have used books like Joe Wicks and a running book to research it a bit, hence the introduction of a carbier meal before my long run. It hasn’t affected my weight loss one bit, and I feel a lot better actually, plus my pace has improved. So a bit like you, i am reconsidering my low carb ‘rules’ a bit and considering the introduction of some ‘running rules’ as well! It’s all a learning curve though isn’t it? I am learning so much on threads like this, and also from just trying new things and seeing what happens,

Yes- experimentation is definitely the way. I've done low carb in all its forms now, when I first started I was super strict- probably around 20-30g a day but looking back on it not that healthy at all, lots of processed meat and cheese, some green veg but not lots and lots. In the last few years I've grown to love veg more than anything and become a lot more wary of meat (both health and ethics wise) so it's been higher carb, probably 50-100g but IMO much healthier all round. After this recent revelation though I think I'll try and stop thinking of things in carb terms and just eat what makes me feel good and healthy- I don't actually think this is as linked to carb content as I would have told you it was 6 months ago. I'm very happy to have peas and lentils and chickpeas etc back in my life!

"so I drink a few pints of water before I run long distances"

What!! How do you manange for loo breaks? I'm always weeing obsessively before the start of an event (at least two trips to turdises). I certainly don't need to hydrate during a 10k, and I''m usually fine for up to about two hours when just running, so I might manage a half as well (need to actually think about where the water stations are on the longer events, and at least try to have a plan)

But, I also know from this hot summer that I run considerably more slowly if (probably) a bit dehydrated. My legs just feel a bit dead, and one hot day when I really got it wrong (evening run, shouid have been 10k) I had to stop at 5k-ish because of calf cramps that just would not go away even after a pause for stretching.

I've never low-carbed, and I find the ideal refuelling for longer runs is mini-Haribo. The packets just fit perfectly into a flip belt.

Auntie I try and hydrate for as long before the run as I’m planning to run for, if that makes sense? I read it in a book; so before a 10km I’ll drink plenty in the hour before as I’m running for 60 min. I suppose it means your cells are well hydrated, even if you do go to the loo a few times before you leave?

I hear a lot about eating haribo/ jelly babies and it always confuses me- a jelly baby has about 30 calories, which is about 3 minutes running. It must be mostly a psychological boost, a few sweets can’t actually fuel you while running? Did any of you see the programme where they swilled glucose water and spat it out, rather than drinking energy drinks? It had the same effect on performance as actually drinking the sports drink. I wonder if it’s the same with jelly babies?

Hi all, I'm new but just placemarking as it's late and I have a 12 mile club run tomorrow. It's my final 'long' training run before my first HM in October.

I'm very interested in the nutrition talk - I really need to sort out my diet!

Really interested in the nutrition chat as I’m in need of losing a couple of stone that I’ve re-gained over the last few years of peri-menopausal hormones going mental despite exercising lots. I definitely run better, further and easier off a carb meal. My body really struggled on low carb but I need to find a better balance than I’ve had lately as weight is creeping again.
I’ve had to reduce running which is really frustrating as I’d got back upto a 8m run in mid-July (did HM Feb then injured) only to struggle with injury again and now I’m back struggling with one 5k a week but supplementing it with cycling and swimming, whilst trying to strengthen.

stego interesting article here: www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.irunfar.com/2017/12/baby-on-board-long-distance-running-during-pregnancy.html/amp from great website run by someone I knew many moons ago.

This is such an interesting thread! I try to eat healthily and love to cook so always make a point of having a proper, balanced meal the night before a long run. So as a general question to all, what would you consider a good meal, considering the points that have been made about carbs? (not addressed to anyone in particular although Irvina and New Wave Rage Bear you obviously have particular thoughts on this!!) Also, I run at about 8am and have a banana when I first get up (about 6.30ish) and then nothing till I get back afterwards. It seems to work for now, but not sure if I will need more for breakfast as I build up the distance?? What do you eat, those of you that run in the morning?

I did my second Parkrun this morning - a gorgeous, cold, still morning perfect for running. Cock-a-hoop that I got 29.28 which I over 2mins 20 secs off my PB yeah!!

A gentle run this morning. Cold to start but blue sky and sunshine - perfect running conditions.
Don’t think I can add anything useful to the eating/carbs discussion as I got home from my run and ate a doughnut
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Daisy I have home made granola & yoghurt before I run and then have some protein & carbs after. Wouldn't say no to a doughnut but sadly being coeliac I rarely get one! The night before a race or long run I try to eat sweet potato, it's my go to fuel! Prefer it to pasta I think. The rest of my meals are usually a mixture of protein & carbs and I am making an effort to increase the size of my veg portion.

Thanks emummy thats very helpful (and IRun4Me I like the sound of a donut!!) emummy do you mind me asking how long before a long run you'd eat your granola & yoghurt? I am terrified of getting a stitch, although haven't ever done so, and not sure if you even do get it from eating?!?

I will eat either porridge made with around 20g oats and 100 ml milk, or I make overnight oats with 20g oats, full fat yogurt, spoonful of peanut butter powder and frozen berries (its amazing), eat at around 6.30 and run my long run at 11 ish. Or eat it immediately after running. I am wary of getting a stitch, and it does seem more common if I run after eating. Anything less than about 10-12 km and I will not eat beforehand, just coffee, but I will eat soon afterwards.

This most likely isn’t what a ‘real runner’ would do though, I am still in weight loss mode!

I am definitely noticing an improvement in my average km pace in the last few weeks since reintroducing certain carbs (oats for example), even if I’m not eating them immediately before I run, they seem to be having an overall effect on my performance without really seeming like I’m increasing effort.

Daisy on Sunday's for my ,one run there's about an hour between eating & running, on weekdays about an hour and a half. I never get a stitch (touches wood!).