Genuine question - what does anyone like about Brexit?

[Pipsquiggle]

I have always been a committed remainer - I work in an industry that depends on seamless logisitics, particularly entering / leaving the UK. Brexit is a shit show for my sector.

Just had to pay £96.80 to UPS to release a package that I'd paid express delivery for, that should've arrived 2 days ago - I'm pissed off. The German firm has already agreed to reimburse me but it's all such a ball ache.

So I have a very bleak outlook when it comes to Brexit.

Genuinely, I would like to hear of good news stories around Brexit.
How has it made your life better?
If your pay has increased - how much by and which industry are you in?
If there has been a legal upside for you - which law and how has it helped?

I am genuinely hoping to 'reframe' my thoughts / feelings on Brexit and was hoping this board could help me

@GlobeTrotter2000 if No way can 2,000 be extrapolated to reflect 46.5 million

Yes it can. You might want to go live in a cave if you think data and statistical analysis have no place in modern life.

I don’t ‘import dogs’ from Greece.
I fundraise and pay for neutering programmes to try to make a dent in the stray dog population.
Are you another one of these people that moan about British people helping ‘forin’ dogs when there are so many British dogs that need help?
Funny how these types never to anything to help anybody anywhere and just complain about those that do.

well, i don't know about dogs but i did take a Ukrainian family in.

@Daftasabroom Yes it can

So, why were the polls from 2013 to 2016 wrong?

Perhaps people changed their minds? It has been known.

That sort of foreign behaviour is strictly forbidden.

I just thought I would leave this here.

https://www.markpack.org.uk/168548/why-is-a-1000-sample-enough-for-an-opinion-poll/

And this.

https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/2497-understanding-margin-error

@jgw1

The soup analogy comparison to polls on EU membership fails as follows:

The 2016 EU referendum had two ingredients in the bowl. One was Leave and the other was Remain.

Also, it was not the same person being asked to taste the bowl, but 46.5 million from both different demographics and geographics.

@jgw1

The YouGov link reads:

Strictly speaking, these calculations are based on the assumption that polls are genuine random samples, with every member of the population having an equal chance of being selected. In many cases this isn't true ‒ polls are carried out by quota sampling, or from panels of volunteers. Even polls done by randomly dialling phone numbers aren't truly random, as the majority of people decline to take part

So, by their own admission, results are unreliable. This was demonstrated in the polls from 2013 to 2016 which favoured a remain result in the 2016 referendum. If the polls, which were within the margin of error were excluded, the ratio of remain to leave was 2:1 in favour of remain.

Another example is MN itself. For over seven years, posters have argued that opinion has shifted from leave to rejoin. Their logic appears to be the same:

Leave replies to remain questions are not acceptable and therefore are wrong.

That they are worse off after Brexit, then by definition the entire country must be worse off.

The list could go on.

Remainers silence leavers - that's why there are very few leave voters chipping in on the thread. It is just an echo chamber of remainers slapping each other on the back as usual.

Where are even the 30% you speak of OP - silenced. But when given the opportunity to vote privately I would not be so sure that many people have changed their minds.

The polls pre brexit were wrong because the same hatred was thrown at leavers then as would be now. But as a democratic country we get to vote in private and without having to be interrogated on mumsnet thank god.

I think that for "most" Leavers they ve realised how hollow their arguments are, they may well still believe them but they see they can't get carers for them or their parents, they see huge hospital waiting lists, legal migration at 750k per year.

If Brexit was so great, people would be keen to tell us all why, the best most can do is say "Things aren't that bad... queues into Holland were ok" ignoring the delays we ve seen at Dover or the farce that is Pet Passports..

Personally, leave voters either never ever mention the subject now or have changed their minds, one or two, who celebrated loudly in 2016 now deny this ever happened and say Brexit was always a stupid idea.

Hatred towards Leavers??? Sorry but both sides were equally capable of throwing insults and thats probably the worst effect of Brexit... Division.

Remainers silence leavers - that's why there are very few leave voters chipping in on the thread.

No dear. The reason there are so few Leavers "chipping away" on this thread is that there is fuck all to show for Brexit and the untold billions it has cost the UK.

Apart from a slightly different colour passport.

And trying to portray the team that bought you ENEMIES OF THE PEOPLE as some sort of collective shy shrinking violets is gaslighting taken to a new level.

'Remainers silence Leavers' what a joke. Its Leave voters who shout 'shut up about Brexit'.

Oh, and with regards 'shut up about Brexit' No, I won't. Leavers won. They got every single thing they wanted. What they don't get though, is me to stop pointing out what a shit show they've created.

Hear hear.

I will never forgive or forget I'm afraid. We are all paying for Brexit folly every day, and I for one am seething with resentment.

@Winter2020 It is just an echo chamber of remainers slapping each other on the back as usual.

As has been the case since 23 June 2016.

But when given the opportunity to vote privately I would not be so sure that many people have changed their minds.

EGGS ACT LEE

The silent majority who don't bother with forums such as MN, or any other, are the one that swing votes.

The polls pre brexit were wrong because the same hatred was thrown at leavers then as would be now.

CORRECT. Remainers had the opportunity to cancel Brext in the 2019 general election, but declined.

But as a democratic country we get to vote in private and without having to be interrogated on mumsnet thank god.

EVEN MORE CORRECT. Anonymous voting was introduced in the 1800's. Long before the EU was heard of.

@Alexandra2001 I think that for "most" Leavers they ve realised how hollow their arguments are,

People can think what they wish, but their thoughts do not constitute proof that others think the same.

If Brexit was so great, people would be keen to tell us all why

They have. As per the ONS, Unemployment has reduced from 5.5% to 4.2% since 2015 and the NHS receives more money than before Brexit.

Personally, leave voters either never ever mention the subject now or have changed their minds

Is there a link, or better still, evidnece to prove that statement?

thats probably the worst effect of Brexit... Division.

Division arose due to Remain supporters' failure to recognize one of the fundamental principles of democracy which is losers's consent.

@SerendipityJane The reason there are so few Leavers "chipping away" on this thread is that there is fuck all to show for Brexit and the untold billions it has cost the UK.

As per the ONS, unemployment in the UK has fallen from 5.5% to 4.2% since 2015. Also, since brexit, the NHS has received more money, even when corrected for emergemcy expenditure due to COVID.

Before Brexit, the ony EU member that had a larger economy than the UK was Germany. Seven years later, Germany remains the only EU member to have a larger economy than the UK.

If Brexit has destroyed the UK, why are all EU members not roaring past the UK's economy?

@Kendodd Remainers silence Leavers' what a joke. Its Leave voters who shout 'shut up about Brexit'

That sounds like Labour's manifesto.

@Kendodd What they don't get though, is me to stop pointing out what a shit show they've created.

It may be a shitshow for you, but can you provide proof that your view is shared by 46.5 million?

@MotherofPearl We are all paying for Brexit folly every day, and I for one am seething with resentment.

Can you provide proof that each of the 68 million persons in the UK are worse off? if so, may be you shounld share your evidence with Kier Strarmer.

A reduction of 4% in GDP affects the vast majority of the population...

@GlobeTrotter2000

I absolutely wish I could collar Starmer on this. For one thing, I blame Corbyn and therefore the LP at the time just about as much for Brexit as Farage, Johnson and the ERG.

And now under Starmer, I'd like to see Labour being much more courageous on this issue and pledge to start repairing our relationship with the EU, at least by rejoining the single market.

Ha Never heard of inflation or spending on Covid measures? Spending on NHS is now falling in real terms and you certainly cannot prove unemployment has fallen as a result of Brexit, very weak if thats all you ve got.

Which is why i said "Personally" ie Anecdotal but the 'polling on whether or not Brexit was a mistake, is pretty clear, way past the margin of error, due in no small part to changes in demographics.

On Losers Consent, do you think following an election, the losing side should just shut up? have you examples of this actually happening?

Plus of course, we don't get another Brexit vote, as we do in the case of General Elections.
The very nature of the 'vote meant division, it was evident long before the actually result, the anger between leave vs remain was very real, most leavers on the other hand, having screwed the country & their own kids, now stay quiet.