Brexit Megathread Part 3: COP26 and beyond. The Empire is no more.

[prettybird]

The old thread is nearly full so as COP26 is in my home town, I thought I'd start the next one.

I'm not expecting anything wonderful from COP26. The selfishness that is Brexit will extend to the rich nations - or rather corporations, countries and cronies - not wanting to do anything that might actually cost them money or hurt their profits and having made their money on the back of the resources of the poorer nations (in some cases quite literally ), they'll expect them to pay the price for the riches of the West.

The deliberate mistranslation of France's letter to the EU will distract from real issues - but that's ok for BJ as he can then blame the perfidious French.

Nothing changes.

"BBC - So soft leftie it's unbeleivable. When do they ever have anything pro Brexit?"

Delusional !

@wewereliars

You do realise that left wing and right wing are not the same as brexit and remain? Louise collins, you are really not helping yourself.

I am embarrassed for you

I absolutely do realise this. My point is that a balanced media should have voices/presenters and commentators from all sides, particularly the public service broadcasters we all pay for, ours largely don't. I'm not trying to help myself.

Where do you think the "centre" is?

@HarrietPierce

"BBC - So soft leftie it's unbeleivable. When do they ever have anything pro Brexit?"

Delusional !

OK Harriet, please find me one peice of pro Brexit content produced by the BBC. A programme, an article on their website... one.

Mostly a lurker but to answer Louise - can you identify a 'pro Brexit' content item that the BBC could have covered and didn't. Surely to produce content there needs first to be something to report?

Does telling the truth count as bias now? Are the BBC supposed to report that Johnson is trustworthy and keeps his promises in order to be perceived as balanced?

Well, I suppose someone could put together a puff piece of happy Leavers waving their blue passports along with some Union flags, because Brexit has made them so happy. That would constitute a positive piece about Brexit, wouldn't it?

But meanwhile back in the real world, the negative impacts of Brexit still outweigh the positive ones (such as they might be) by orders of magnitude. I still don't know what is is that people like Larry think they've won.

Ah a visitor. I think Brexit can't be going well for them. Otherwise we wouldn't need the jibes.

The WA is of course entirely renegotiable and will be renegotiated, probably right after we have torn up the NI Protocol.

But why should anyone bother to negotiate - whatever Johnson and Frost sign will be reneged upon as soon as they bother to read it. Oh and BTW NI voted Remain, so what the DUP wants does not represent the majority. Will of the People, you know, which was supposedly sacrosanct.

I do think the BBC are biased though. Biased towards facts. That's why they don't do much pro-brexit stuff. Because they don't really do propoganda.

@Peregrina

Ah a visitor. I think Brexit can't be going well for them. Otherwise we wouldn't need the jibes.

The WA is of course entirely renegotiable and will be renegotiated, probably right after we have torn up the NI Protocol.

But why should anyone bother to negotiate - whatever Johnson and Frost sign will be reneged upon as soon as they bother to read it. Oh and BTW NI voted Remain, so what the DUP wants does not represent the majority. Will of the People, you know, which was supposedly sacrosanct.

Will of the English People, you know, which was supposedly sacrosanct.

@FatCatThinCat

Does telling the truth count as bias now? Are the BBC supposed to report that Johnson is trustworthy and keeps his promises in order to be perceived as balanced?

The problem is that a lot of people take 'balanced' reporting to mean '50/50 positive and negative reporting'. Whether or not that reflects the actual situation or not.

If we look at the scales of Brexit in terms of positive and negative outcomes, realistically we'd expect the reporting to be roughly 90% negative. This is probably me being generous. That would be balanced, i.e. reflecting the actual situation on the ground.

People don't like the truth when it doesn't align with their desires.

Because they don't really do propoganda.

They do but it does have to be at least truth adjacent, there is no truth to Brexit benefits

Encouraging - not all Tories are corrupt

Although he was saying this two years ago before they drank more deeply at the trough of corruption

I am trying very hard not to be rude Louise collins, so this is my best stab.

Left and right wing are varying points on the political spectrum, a whole undergraduate degree and indeed Phd can and have been studied on the issues arising. The points are not fixed and change over time and place.

Brexit and remain are not synonymous with left and right wing.

The media that are not singing the praises of Brexit are not failing to do so because they re left or right wing. It is because Brexit is a total failure and disaster for the UK.

Any media outlet now espousing Brexit as a positive for the UK is engaging in propaganda, not news

@pollyannaperspective

Mostly a lurker but to answer Louise - can you identify a 'pro Brexit' content item that the BBC could have covered and didn't. Surely to produce content there needs first to be something to report?

I can but if I do then I'd be answering my own question wouldn't I?! I asked for 1 peice, 1 programme (from before the referendum or afterwards, it doesn't bother me) where the BBC gave a pro-Brexit viewpoint. No answers so far.

"BBC - So soft leftie it's unbeleivable. When do they ever have anything pro Brexit?"

The comedy shows may be left-wing (let's face it, right-wing comedy is not exactly side-splitting). But the important bit is the news reporting. That has been proven repeatedly to be pro Brexit, and pro government. They've even commented laughably that they can't criticise the government as it may damage the country's faith in democracy!

Claiming that to be "leftie" shows you to be either disingenuous, or, frankly, stupid.

Can't find anything on the BBC that is of a pro-Brexit news item. So I went looking for what the BBC may have missed.

Well it does appear that the BBC does not have anything on the website about a recent Liz Truss success (25 October 2021)

I found a reference to a bi-lateral statement between the UK and Greece on
"the signing of a strategic framework memorandum between the United Kingdom and the Hellenic Republic of Greece. This agreement will cover foreign policy, defence, and other areas to strengthen bilateral relations"

that is said to be with Brexit Britain and a sign of our 'Global' status. The suggestion is that this was only possible due to the UK having left the EU. Though curiously the Greek Minister does mention they have similar with France.
Is that the sort of missed pro-Brexit reporting you had in mind Louise?

Louise, have you never seen Question Time? The presenter even admitted that they selected their studio audience to be pro Brexit!

I don't know how much more proof of bias you can ask for?

Perhaps louise could find an anti-brexit story from the BBC that was actually opinion rather than reporting? Given the Kuenssberg provides most opinion in this area there won't be any!

These two stories reflect what the BBC does - report facts - albeit with a UK bias -- not a left or right bias.
What's the Northern Ireland Protocol?
Why is there a row over fishing rights?

OK Harriet, please find me one peice of pro Brexit content produced by the BBC. A programme

Well let's start with Nigel Farages record-breaking run on Question Time, before (QT again) Fiona Bruces cringeworthy trip when a Brexit critic told her he was a Brexit voter in response to her rather limp excuse for the viewers that the BBC "carefully selects" it's audiences.

The problem is that a lot of people take 'balanced' reporting to mean '50/50 positive and negative reporting'. Whether or not that reflects the actual situation or not.

Dara O'Briains routine about "Stargazing Live" wanting to have an astrologer on "for balance" springs to mind.

( Why can't you appear on a science programme ? Because your work clothes are a cape and wand .... )

Citing Question Time is a joke, Farage was always in a minority as a pro-Leave contributor. You know this. I honestly do wish they'd found other pro leave voices to use, but they didn't, that's their fault, not his.

BBC QT audiences are supposed to be representative, if they are, more than half of them would have a pro Brexit majority in the audience. If that's happened over the last 5 years I'd be amazed. Some audiences have been majority pro Brexit I'm sure, but nowhere near 52%. How many editions are recorded in London alone!

No @LouiseCollins28 - 52% of those who voted. To be representative they would need a large number non-voters (for whatever reason).

So QT doen't count, what about R4 Today? That features plenty of brexiteers.

Or Andrew Marr on Sunday, does that count?

Wikipaedia is your friend. Apart from Lockdown the programme is rarely set in London. Live audiences resumed in September and the closest to London was Beckenham.

Also, looking at the list of panelists for the 6 months leading up to the Brexit vote - there's many a familiar name Isabel Oakshott, Theresa Villiers, Nigel Dodds, Paul Nuttall (how soon we forget), Nigel Lawson and so it goes on. Was a trip down memory lane!

Fiona Bruce often mentions that the audience reflects the Brexit % split. Though as noted by pp those who may have voted one way may since have changed their mind.