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Brexit

Westminstenders: Sleaze. The Return.

1000 replies

RedToothBrush · 25/04/2021 13:37

The Brexit Agreement is still not signed. The EU are still pissed off with our bad attitude and how we managed to a have better deal on AstraZeneca's vaccines which they don't seem to like anyway.

The Ireland / NI border is still a mess. Both politically and economically. This is apparently something that wasn't discussed pre referedum, with regular Westminstenders suffering from collective delusions over remembering differently and reading madeup stories which just happen to be dated prior to the referendum. Its a sign of how good fake news has got.

The lying architect of Vote Leave is complaining about the lying of Vote Leave's biggest champion and cheerleader, countered with the pm who cheated on his ex wife multiple times and ran off with a younger woman accusing his former aid of being deeply sexist.

The government is embroiled in numerous accusations of lining its own pockets following the brexit power grab by the right wing of the party. Which of course wasn't a worry pre referendum. As of course accountability generally.

In keeping with taking a lead on the world stage, we have seen through our promises to cut back on overseas aid, instead preferring to spend money on trading. This is well represented by our purchasing of 10million AZ vaccines from India with not much sign of sending aid to help with the unfolding humanitarian crisis there.

Our post Brexit foreign policy looks muddled at best. The new world order is a big confusing. We dont mind trading with regimes which have human rights abuses... As long as they are countries which are smaller than us and we can exploit. We don't particularly like China atm because we aren't getting much out of the shitting on others. Plus its not really proving a great opportunity for Westerners to line their pockets like other dodgy regimes because its generally closed to outsiders and this is even more true in covid times.

But don't worry, we will soon be able to go abroad again on our covid passports. The 17th May beckons when the penny will drop that efforts to integrate medical records with passport data which apparently border agencies are working on, isn't ready yet and that doesn't matter because other countries won't be ready to let us in yet, especially since we are outside the EU and EEA and we haven't been great at talking to them. And we probably will still have to quarantine on return anyway. (End of June is still optimistic but more realistic).

We've still to impose customs checks yet because we didn't want to do it in April in case that meant the shops would be empty when they reopened. So we still have that joy to look forward to. Great for EU exporters. Less great for uk exporters. For now.

Of course we have the May Council elections to look forward to, in which it will become apparent just how fucking useless and invisible Keir Starmer is and how Labour policies are not connecting with voters in spite of all of the above. Mainly due to navel gazing and an inability to get beyond their social circle. Any good ideas they do have are promptly nicked by the Tories.

Post Brexit talk of reviewing the Monarchy are also growing in steam...

If we look back it feels like the sleaziness of the early nineties has returned but with no prospect of joining the Eu, no John Smith or Smiling Tony to inspire, no coming Cool Brittania to cheer us up. Just sleaze tolerated and accepted, rather than rejected. And one massive debt than had been largely repaid.

Its hard to see where we go from here. We seem bewildered by geography and confused by technology. Unwilling to invest in science and no longer aligned with the right people to collaborate effectively.

Instead we are more pre occupied with in fighting.

As a friend said to me this week, they had started to watch alternative news channels to British based ones because she felt we had become so inward looking. She felt like our mentality was increasing like the US which simply was unaware of events and ideas beyond our borders. I think its a comment that has so much ressonnance.

OP posts:
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AuldAlliance · 04/05/2021 12:33

This reminds me of someone, can't quite think who it might be.

twitter.com/RosieisaHolt/status/1387669418495381506?s=20

prettybird · 04/05/2021 13:53

Those negotiations [between the EU and India] were suspended in 2013 after disagreements over tariff rules for car parts and free-movement rights for professionals, but resuming them has been a priority for both sides.

Iirc, it was the UK who was resisting increased visas and free movement for Indian professionals Hmm. That should make it easier for future EU negotiations with India Wink

HannibalHayeski · 04/05/2021 13:55

So, after Norway, going well with France.

The Brexit bonuses for fishing just keep piling up like as a motorway pile-up

Westminstenders: Sleaze. The Return.
Peregrina · 04/05/2021 20:49

More on the fishing row

One thing I notice from this report is that the UK Government is passing the buck to the Jersey Government. The Channel Islands were never in the EU.

DGRossetti · 04/05/2021 21:26

@Peregrina

More on the fishing row

One thing I notice from this report is that the UK Government is passing the buck to the Jersey Government. The Channel Islands were never in the EU.

I am in absolutely no doubt the French would cut the electricity to Jersey. Mainly because it's an asymmetric act.
yellowspanner · 04/05/2021 22:36

So do you think it's reasonable for the French to cut off electricity to Jersey...including the hospitals, schools and care homes...just to punish the UK over fishing licences? I don't. It is vindictiveness. Jersey are not involved in the fishing rows. It just shows how nasty the EU can be.

LostToucan · 04/05/2021 22:39

The Channel Islands were never in the EU.

Whilst not an EU member, as a Crown Dependency Jersey was effectively treated as part of the EU for the purposes of free trade in goods. Post Brexit, it is now lumbered with being under the TCA and Jersey goods bound for the EU are treated as they would if they come from the UK.

Peregrina · 05/05/2021 06:57

Trust a Leaver to jump in to slag of the EU!

Is anyone saying that it's reasonable for the French to cut off the electricity? Why blame the EU for a French decision? There is this thing called Sovereignty that Leavers were particularly fond of at one stage.

How about Johnson remembering what his hero said, that "Jaw, jaw is better than war, war"?

mathanxiety · 05/05/2021 07:31

www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-56942056

Something's rotten in the state.

DGRossetti · 05/05/2021 07:43

@yellowspanner

So do you think it's reasonable for the French to cut off electricity to Jersey...including the hospitals, schools and care homes...just to punish the UK over fishing licences? I don't. It is vindictiveness. Jersey are not involved in the fishing rows. It just shows how nasty the EU can be.
The theme of Brexit has been to ignore what I think for five years. So there's fuck all point in what I think.

The point is the UK has happily drifted into an arrangement where this is possible under the deal Boris brokered and the deal the UK signed up to - presumably intending to honour.

And if the UK had no intention of abiding by the deal, then it really, really, really should not have chosen to test the French out on their willingness to stand up for themselves.

DGRossetti · 05/05/2021 07:45

@mathanxiety

www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-56942056

Something's rotten in the state.

It will be interesting to read why the judge refused to hear the UK governments "evidence".
FrankieStein402 · 05/05/2021 08:13

It will be interesting to read why the judge refused to hear the UK governments "evidence".

Well the news report you report says the 'evidence' was commanded to be provided by the men and not under caution. It would be more interesting to know why the prosecution ever thought that would be acceptable and why, knowing it would not, they pressed on with the prosecution.

yellowspanner · 05/05/2021 08:35

Cutting off electricity to Jersey is the French "standing up for themselves" is it? Really?😳
Peregrina what has "jaw jaw" got to do with the french cutting off electricity to jersey (including hospitals etc)?
Is our Prime Minister responsible for the actions of the French now?
Looking forward to the election results🙂

borntobequiet · 05/05/2021 09:13

The French haven’t cut off any electricity to the Channel Islands. They’ve raised it as a “point of leverage” and “jaw jaw” refers to talking so as to prevent these things happening. Of course none of it would be remotely on the cards were it not for Brexit and this Government’s appalling handling of it.
I think it’s only on these threads I’ve seen discussion about our reliance on cross-channel electricity. I hope that the supply is never compromised, though of course the propensity for our leaders to wreck such useful arrangements on a whim should never be underestimated.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-55750411

Peregrina · 05/05/2021 09:24

I am sorry, I thought the reference to 'jaw jaw' was so well known as to not need an explanation. It is always better to try to negotiate.

LostToucan · 05/05/2021 09:40

Jersey is caught in the crossfire - bound by the TCA that it wasn’t allowed to negotiate and which superseded the existing fishing agreements with France.

Frost and Johnson need to take some responsibility for this.

Peregrina · 05/05/2021 09:55

Frost and Johnson need to take some responsibility for this.

Yes, that was what I was trying to highlight.
In the link I put, the statement is made
It is claimed that the UK government is using red tape to limit the operations of French fishing vessels, in contravention of the trade and cooperation agreement struck with the EU on Christmas Eve. The UK government denies the claim, saying Jersey alone is responsible for the management of its waters.

Yet as a territory already outside the EU, they had no say whatever in the Brexit negotiations, so this government statement seems disingenuous at best, and downright dishonest at worst. As with the Norway agreement there were knock on effects that the British Government under Johnson, more concerned with willy waving than actually negotiating in good faith, completely overlooked.

Peregrina · 05/05/2021 09:59

I assume then that if Jersey is solely responsible for the management of its waters, then it should be possible for their Government and the French one to sit down together and negotiate something to their mutual acceptance.

LostToucan · 05/05/2021 10:04

The TCA changes sea fishing access rights, but Jersey has to implement them.

The terms of the UK-EU Trade and Cooperation Agreement (TCA) make significant changes to the access regime to Jersey Waters for fishing opportunities. In order to fulfil these obligations, amendments are required to the Sea Fisheries (Jersey) Law 1994 and Sea Fisheries (Licensing of Fishing Boats) (Jersey) Regulations 2003.

These amendments reflect the new requirements under the TCA and reflect the fact that the Agreement between the Government of the United Kingdom and Northern Ireland and the Government of the French Republic concerning Fishing in the Bay of Granville (GBA) has been superseded by the TCA.

statesassembly.gov.je/assemblypropositions/2021/p.38-2021.pdf

FixTheBone · 05/05/2021 10:10

You're all mistaken, it couldn't possibly be as complex as everyone is making out.

Easiest trade deal ever....

...is what was sold.

Peregrina · 05/05/2021 10:17

So what happens if the States of Jersey decide not to implement the TCA?

All these are details which should have been thrashed out months ago. The sort of thing which should have been discussed during the Transition period.

LostToucan · 05/05/2021 10:24

Jersey Parliament agreed to be included in the TCA in December 2020. I’m not sure whether that was a Hobson’s choice or not though.

FatCatThinCat · 05/05/2021 10:59

Nobody said the sunlit uplands would be sunlit as the electricity had been cut off. Is this evidence of De Piffle lying or of him delivering what he promised?

Jason118 · 05/05/2021 11:27

The fishing saga is a good example of how French ministers represents its people and the UK doesn't give a shit. It's French people's livelihoods not some weird international game, and when livelihoods are threatened the French are quite 'demonstrative' in their defence. If you look at the jobs being lost on the UK fishing side, what protestations are our government making, other than toothless sound bites? What have we done with all the cards we were holding?

Peregrina · 05/05/2021 11:46

I am quite sure that Johnson doesn't give a shit about Jersey, never mind their fishermen.

What happened to our cards? It looks as though we dropped them on the floor.

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