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Brexit

Westminstenders: Governing by U-Turn

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 07/09/2020 01:45

Johnson's determination to get brexit done and to have 'a clean break from Europe' on terms which involve other countries happily returning fishing rights they bought from us (without recompense for the said previous purchase) in addition to the EU accepting terms they don't feel create a level playingfield and risk their economic future make any deal impossible. Our demands simply aren't achievable.

The alternative is adherence to the Withdrawal Agreement in which we are unable to bail out businesses via state aid and to have no deal which creates huge trade barriers and tarriffs overnight and massive customs red tape which we simply are not yet prepared for because the systems for running this are running behind schedule. This would lead to massive food shortages and Brexit lorry parks throughout the country for the forseeable future.

Johnson's latest bright idea is that he seems to think he can avoid chaos by a strategy which would cause even more chaos by deliberately reneging on the withdrawal agreement which is an international agreement just months after throwing a hissy fit for China doing exactly the same thing. This wouldn't just be hypocritical but would make a mockery of our credibility internationally and potentially endanger every other international agreement we've currently in place because well, why should anyone else stick to an agreement with the UK.

We could face years of legal wrangles with god knows which countries and businesses suing the British government.

But y'know Johnson thinks this is a sensible strategy and a cracking plan to force Brussels to blink first rather than actually take the subject seriously and do something in the country's interest rather than prevent Johnson from damaging his internal reputation with leave voters and because he thinks this is the correct hill to die on to prove he doesn't govern by u-turn. Johnson's ego seems more important to him than feeding the nation and having an international reputation.

Or he could do another u-turn.

OP posts:
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mathanxiety · 10/09/2020 04:45

I'm sorry to see him gone. He's an arrogant gobshite but he was a brilliant trade commissioner.

Me too, @OchonAgusOchonO. Not for nothing was he known as Bruiser Hogan...

Darker · 10/09/2020 05:29

Re the mass testing - surely there is no point blowing so much on this unless he also massively cuts international travel to prevent reinfection.

Darker · 10/09/2020 05:32

Unless it’s because a few mates have got shares in a small company which makes - I dunno - pigeon netting - and thinks it can turn its hand to testing.

borntobequiet · 10/09/2020 07:51

Ten million tests and £100 billion costs are just numbers plucked out of the ether.
I bet if you asked any of the Govt front bench to write those numbers down, they wouldn't put the correct number of zeros.

mrslaughan · 10/09/2020 07:57

Well we know Patel is far from number literate.

mrslaughan · 10/09/2020 08:08

The Salisbury - Alison herring is complete bullshit. Guarantee it came from Cummings - Peston started it. But the "Lords" will all know it doesn't apply, but probably will be built into a narrative of these unelected posh folk attacking democracy and frustrating the will of the people. I know there is still a very noisy bunch of brexiteers- but support for brexit over the last couple of months has been quite quickly ebbing away........ so will it actually stir people up enough to give Johnson the support he craves/needs? I think people are more worried about Covid, work , schools staying open etc. I think Furlough will end and this government will become reviled as people loose jobs and it becomes clear they have completely fucked up Covid management. I just heard the clip of Whitty (or was it Valance) pouring cold water on Johnson's obscene £100bn testing plan . He is a man that has lost a grip - making more and more wild promises.
The travesty of this is some Tory supporters will become obscenely rich out of this and generations will be paying for it.

RedToothBrush · 10/09/2020 08:50

This is now the BBC website lead

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54097050
Coronavirus: Concerns over Boris Johnson's 'moonshot' testing plans

Scientists and health professionals have raised doubts about Prime Minister Boris Johnson's "Operation Moonshot" plan for mass coronavirus testing.

The PM hopes millions of Covid-19 tests - including some giving results within minutes - could be processed daily.

But experts say there are issues with laboratory capacity for current tests, while the technology for more rapid tests "does not, as yet, exist".

The British Medical Journal says leaked memos show the plan could cost £100bn.

Its up there with his flipping bridges isn't it?

The man lives in fantasy land.

OP posts:
Darker · 10/09/2020 08:53

The Daily Hate-mail is also leading with it.

Is there a book running on how long BJ lasts.

OchonAgusOchonO · 10/09/2020 09:02

@mathanxiety - I have a hunch that only a very small minority would be so alienated from the idea of a reunited Ireland that they would cause problems.

I really hope you are right but listening to Sammy Wilson over the last week and knowing that he represents a sizable opinion worries me.

WorriedMutha · 10/09/2020 09:27

Has there been any polling on the prospects for a reunification referendum. My Irish family were less than enthusiastic as they fear NI would be an economic burden. Many there are employed in the public sector. Health provision also differs so the North would have to make quite an adjustment.

ListeningQuietly · 10/09/2020 09:30

Johnson is a like a 7 year old still at prep school who brings home his latest cereal box space rocket and Mummy says
"Well done Al, it will definitely fly"
and he goes off for his bath assuming it did, rather than that Nanny binned it.

ICouldHaveCheckedFirst · 10/09/2020 09:31

Never underestimate the strength of feeling among Unionists in NI. It's in their DNA.

DGRossetti · 10/09/2020 10:17

Seems the Shetlands have had enough. Whats 18:2 as a %age ?

www.shetlandtimes.co.uk/2020/09/09/self-determination-motion-passed-overwhelmingly

DGRossetti · 10/09/2020 10:35

Seems Facebooks AI programming groups "rabid Brexiteer" and "fossilised turd" into the same feed. Bad luck Dom.

Even the machines are smarter than the Tories.

Westminstenders: Governing by U-Turn
OchonAgusOchonO · 10/09/2020 12:29

Does anyone know when they will be voting on the Internal Market Bill? I assume pretty soon as it has to go through both houses.

BigChocFrenzy · 10/09/2020 12:35

@WorriedMutha

Has there been any polling on the prospects for a reunification referendum. My Irish family were less than enthusiastic as they fear NI would be an economic burden. Many there are employed in the public sector. Health provision also differs so the North would have to make quite an adjustment.
.... I posted upthread that many polls since the 2015 ref have > 60% in the RoI who would support reunification - that would be after an NI vote for this, as in the GFA

e.g. taken at polling stations after the EP & local elections last year:
65% in favour vs 19% opposed

www.politico.eu/article/election-two-thirds-of-irish-would-vote-for-united-ireland/

borntobequiet · 10/09/2020 12:48

What idiot thought up the name "Operation Moonshot"? Just more meaningless words, totally unrelated to the actuality.
They may as well have called it Operation Bullshit.

Darker · 10/09/2020 12:53

It's bonkers.

I know several people who have taken tests and never got their results. A waste of time and money.

BigChocFrenzy · 10/09/2020 12:54

The bill to deliberately break an international treaty could be called Operation Tree Branch

Westminstenders: Governing by U-Turn
BigChocFrenzy · 10/09/2020 12:55

@Darker

It's bonkers.

I know several people who have taken tests and never got their results. A waste of time and money.

... Ah, but if they would count in the official test figures, then job done
BigChocFrenzy · 10/09/2020 13:05

@OchonAgusOchonO

Does anyone know when they will be voting on the Internal Market Bill? I assume pretty soon as it has to go through both houses.
.... United Kingdom Internal Market Bill 2019-21

https://services.parliament.uk/bills/2019-21/unitedkingdominternalmarket.html

The Bill was introduced to the House of Commons and given its First Readingg^ on Wednesday 9 September 2020. This stage is formal and takes place without any debate

"MPs will next consider the Bill at Second Reading on Monday 14 September 2020, followed by consideration in Committee of the Whole House on Tuesday 15, Wednesday 16, Monday 21 and Tuesday 22 September 2020."

BigChocFrenzy · 10/09/2020 13:08

Afterward their internal debate, the Committtee will return the bill for full debate to the main House

  • we don't know how long will be allowed for this -
after which comes the HoC vote

Then it has to go to the HoL for deabte and a vote, before returning to the HoC

BigChocFrenzy · 10/09/2020 13:13

oops, I read too quickly
It looks like the full HoC debate is 15 - 22 September, so maybe vote on 23 Sept ??

I thought the bill would be debated fully in the Brexit Committee first - not much time for that before 15 Sept

BigChocFrenzy · 10/09/2020 13:17

Useful flowchart showing all the stages, with first opportunity for debate on Monday, at 2nd reading

This looks rushed

Westminstenders: Governing by U-Turn