Immigration: Sh*t just got real...

[Miljea]

Wonder how Timmy Wetherspoons is frothing today?

Points based??

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-51550421BBC

"Low-skilled workers would not get visas under post-Brexit immigration plans unveiled by the government.

It is urging employers to "move away" from relying on "cheap labour" from Europe and invest in retaining staff and developing automation technology."

And take on the 6m 'economically inactive' 16-64 year olds in Britain.

Good luck with that.

Gosh, that devil is in the detail, innit?

And, separate but important point, who the chuff is clamouring to get into the UK, now, other than southern Asians uniting families? (Which I completely understand).

@OnlyFoolsnMothers wouldn't it be great if they counted carers as "highly skilled"? I suspect the chances of that happening are zero to none but yes, could solve the problem...

justcleanyourbloodyteeth well if there is a detrimental shortage due to the change in FOM then surely the positive of having an immigration system means we can alter it accordingly. I remember a bbc documentary when the nhs went on a recruiting drive to Manilla for midwives, so clearly they made the visa system simpler in that scenario.

@OnlyFoolsnMothers of course they can. But the thing is, the issue is entirely predictable. It will be an issue. No one can explain how it won't be. There is NO route for unskilled labour at all. We have a shortage of unskilled labour and almost full employment. Those is social care policy have made it extremely clear that this will be a problem. So rather than waiting and seeing, why not adjust the immigration policy now? It simply makes no sense to wait for the inevitable. Prevention is always the best course of action.

almost full employment yet we have growing levels of in work policy and diminishing standards of living.

@OnlyFoolsnMothers yes we do. How will this help?

I didn't vote brexit, but I do believe this will encourage those who say there are "no jobs" to gain employment. I personally believe we have a lazy nation who feel they are too good for certain jobs. I was made redundant after 11 years nhs service, and would have literally taken any job because I don't believe any job is "beneath me"...but some people do. We have a large warehouse near me where 80% of the workforce are polish. My cousin hasn't worked since he left school - says there are no jobs. When I mention the warehouse he simply says he's not doing it. But why not? A job is a job isn't it? I'd certainly take a low paid job if it meant feeding family - but is this where the benefit system outweighs the benefits of working??

For many countries, it's nothing new to ask this, or have set criteria.

Well, absolutely, there is nothing stopping the UK doing this. The point is though that the UK seems somehow intent on associating it with Brexit.

Nothing in EU stopping them do this.

As your example in Belgium demonstrated.

@Jason118

My views are based on what I’ve seen as part of my job. I can’t give you precise numbers but I’ve worked in several inner city areas and believe me, not working is the norm for many.

Define whole section. How many? Just because Channel 5 do a documentary doesn't extrapolate to millions of people

For once in my life I agree with Diane Abbott, who said yesterday that there will have to be so many exemptions to this policy that it's utterly meaningless. The work-shy native population aren't suddenly going to get jobs in the NHS, care and hospitality sectors and training and automation will take time and large amounts of investment, so we will still need large numbers of low skilled workers for many years to come. It makes a good soundbite, of course, for all the leave voters, but that's all it is - a sop to the Conservative 'base'.

@Squirrelpeanutbutter I agree there are many who choose not to work, for a variety of reasons. The new immigration policy does nothing to address that, unfortunately. It's what comes next which is the worrying bit. You could envisage a system similar to the disabled benefit assessment which cuts benefits to the work shy. But we all know the government wouldn't finesse such a system and it would sweep up all sorts of people with genuine reasons not to be able to do certain types of work. Or just rename us Gilead and be done with it.

Comedy as truth?

www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/society/priti-patels-guide-to-the-economically-inactive-20200220193691

justcleanyourbloodyteeth well i would hope wages go up. The government churning out low unemployment figures is farce when the benefit bill goes up still and people cannot afford to eat when working.

As for the work shy - of course there will always be work shy people in any country. The benefit system is far from perfect, there will always be people who are on the boarder and are actually worse off financially when in full time work, having to pay for childcare and council tax. I actually don't begrudge them keeping with UC temporarily.

Wages will go up I'm sure, and do you think the resultant saving the government makes in UC/tax credits will go towards increased funding of adult social care? And before you say yes, no they won't.

People looking after their own children and relatives are economically inactive

People looking after the children and relatives of those who have other work are economically active

People studying to better themselves and their prospects are economically inactive

People who ave up on learning and are happy with unskilled work are economically active

If all the immigrants have the high skilled, well paid jobs
and the indigenous have the low paid, low skill jobs
its not going to go well

Jason118 not necessarily- our government will be rubbish regardless im sure. I think its even more imperative then to get the net migration figure down, then.

Every job I have applied for on for example Indeed shows how many others have applied for the same job.You are looking around the 250 mark for each job.
Been for mass interviews where I was the only person not from Europe.
Worked in a warehouse,95 percent were either Romanian,Polish or similar.
So this is great news for me.
I have sat on benefits for two years,now my time has finally come.

There was plenty of unemployed local brits offered jobs in the farm, most refused to pick fruit for the salary available and others left after only a few hours.

This was exactly my experience working in a London restaurant. I was the only native English speaker, even though the job actually paid decently (thanks to tips), required no training, was easy to get to.

I think twice we did have young English guys in their 20s try the job out for a couple weeks but they left, it was 'too hard'.

Yes we had a few people sending money home but most people did not. They managed on low-ish wages the same way anyone else does, they live in shared flats or way out in the burbs or with family.

Restaurants would prefer British nationals but it's a mystery why (in London anyway) it's so hard to get any to work for them. This is not something that will change with the new policy.

@OnlyFoolsnMothers but how will wages in social care go up, when the government funding that pays the wages does not go up? Where does the extra money come from?

justcleanyourbloodyteet I dont have the exact answer because our government is inept - I dont think a mass of cheap labour is the answer though. I know my council tax went up to help the social care in my area.

Don't worry exemptions can be made so we can still get slave labour.

If the country needs farm labour then the shortfall can be made up allowing those in to work in that sector.

So don't worry rich people, poor people will still be allowed in to work very hard for not a lot of money.

I think it's fine as long as wages increase and we start training more citizens for HCP roles etc.....

Will this happen though??

the children of migrants tend to do better at school than native children.

Have you got a source for that @Mistigri

Out of interest tonglong, how would you handle immigration to benefit the poor if you were in a position to do so? I assume (sorry if this is incorrect) that you would favour lower immigration? Do you think higher prices on for example food and higher taxes would be worth it? The MP for Grimsby I heard this morning hinting that social carers should be paid more and this would be funded by the tax payer.

I know my council tax went up to help the social care in my area.
Hampshire County Council spends £1.2 per day on adult social care
that amount has been rising at around 6% a year during the decade of austerity when council budgets were cut by 40%
hence why everything else has been cut
but Adult Social care is collapsing around us.

If wages for carers go up, councils will have to cut even more of everything else

floatygoat
GCSE results by ethnic background
www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk/education-skills-and-training/11-to-16-years-old/a-to-c-in-english-and-maths-gcse-attainment-for-children-aged-14-to-16-key-stage-4/latest