Immigration: Sh*t just got real...

[Miljea]

Wonder how Timmy Wetherspoons is frothing today?

Points based??

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-51550421BBC

"Low-skilled workers would not get visas under post-Brexit immigration plans unveiled by the government.

It is urging employers to "move away" from relying on "cheap labour" from Europe and invest in retaining staff and developing automation technology."

And take on the 6m 'economically inactive' 16-64 year olds in Britain.

Good luck with that.

Gosh, that devil is in the detail, innit?

And, separate but important point, who the chuff is clamouring to get into the UK, now, other than southern Asians uniting families? (Which I completely understand).

One of the biggest practical issues (I won't get into the moral stuff about how we value people who do low-wage but high-value work) is the question of how this affects the regions/devolved nations.

It will be easy for immigrants to reach the salary limits in London. Not so much in Scunthorpe, Scotland or Northern Ireland.

What this means in practice is that companies in the London area will be able to recruit employees to all but the lowest wage jobs without serious difficulty. Companies in the north east or Scotland may struggle to fill exactly the same roles. So if you were going to invest, where would you put your money? In a well connected city with access to an international labour market, or in the north where you may struggle to employ people with the right skills and can't recruit from abroad?

Widens the north/south divide and this policy is utterly unsuitable for Scotland and NI both of which need more migrants not fewer.

We have a whole section of British who choose not to work. This is their lifestyle choice, they have no work ethic as their parents didn’t work either. Our country has enabled these aspirations for years. It’s not good for individuals or our country.

We have people from other countries who come here, desperate to work and they will do anything and work very hard at it.

There’s something seriously wrong with this and it needs addressing. I don’t know what you do.

What I’m saying is, it’s very unlikely that they wouldn’t make provision for these shortages, despite what some people on this thread are trying to infer.

Well the new policy is now on the Gov website, as is MAC's list of occupations. And guess what - care workers aren't on it. So yeah, there is no provision for the shortage.

Quite a lot of those economically inactive are raising kids or caring for elderly or disabled relatives.

I guess that in the national interest and to show that we are Getting Behind Brexit, we at Mumsnet could campaign to make economically inactive SAHP do care work or pick vegetables. They can wipe bums and lift potatoes with their babies strapped to their backs, like women in third world countries. And maybe when the kids are a bit older and too heavy to carry, we can set them to work too! What's not to like!

@Jason118

Well, as stated, you nor I, nor anyone else on this thread can know exactly how it will work, so forgive me for not listening to the hysteria from the remainers.

There will be some sacrifices, no ones denying that. We may have to pay higher prices for ‘apples’.

If the trade off for that is that there isn’t as much pressure on other services, I.e. housing, school, GP’s then yes, I’ll take the hike.

I don’t expect you to agree and that’s fine. In the sane way I don’t agree with your school of thought.

We have a whole section of British who choose not to work.

As exemplified by our Prime Minister, but he gets a free pass because he was born into a moneyed family.

@Squirrelpeanutbutter We have a whole section of British who choose not to work
Define whole section. How many? Just because Channel 5 do a documentary doesn't extrapolate to millions of people.

@Potkettlexx but the policy sets out how it will work, that's what policy is for, otherwise why bother having one? So we do know how it will work out and only long necked people with plenty of sand can't see it.

Well, as stated, you nor I, nor anyone else on this thread can know exactly how it will work

Try reading the published policy....

Well, as stated, you nor I, nor anyone else on this thread can know exactly how it will work

Try reading the published policy....

We have a whole section of British who choose not to work

Some choose not to work because wages are so low that it makes better sense to stay home with the kidsbinstard of outsourcing expensive childcare

I love how we can bash British people but all Europeans are hard working NHS saviours.
Fact is people are people, whether from the UK or outside. You get lazy, scrounging people in every walk of life. Sadly we cannot ship out the lazy Brits.
Bringing in a cheaper labour force is a temporary fix, covering the real issues which is low wages, lack of investment in apprenticeships and training. I do not believe the current levels of migration are unsustainable- basic rule of economics (supply/ demand). I am willing to see how this new point system works.
This does not mean I give the government a free pass on under investing in our services- not at all. I just dont see a benefit from having a migrant come to the UK to work in a shop, paying minimal tax and then have them use the nhs/ school system etc. (which they will be completely right to have access to).

What is wrong with a migrant working in a shop, if the shopkeeper can't find someone already living here to do the job? Should the shop just close?

Peregrina I dont believe they cant find someone to work in a shop- there are enough stores for there to be an available workforce already.

*enough stores closing- that should read grrrr

I suppose it depends where you live, but a lot of local shops are advertising for staff. We also have gaps in the shopping precinct where various firms have pulled out. Whether that was because they couldn't find staff, or because of the move to online shopping - it's very hard to tell. Possibly a bit of both.

All those on here saying how happy they are about a points-based system becoming the norm; what is your solution for adult social care? Agencies can't raise their wages, as suggested by Ms Patel, as those wages come from government funding, which is completely insufficient. It certainly can't be automated. So if non GB nationals are no longer allowed in the do the work, who will? Because GB nationals certainly don't want to, as demonstrated by the current massive shortfall in workers. Same can said for our agriculture industry.
And it doesn't make any difference that non-EU nationals will now be treated the same was as EU, because there is no provision in the policy at all for unskilled workers wherever they come from.

So can someone please explain how this conundrum can be solved, please?

They advertise but interview 100s of applicants looking for the perfect fit.

I very very much doubt whether any local care homes could advertise and get 100s of applicants.

I love how we can bash British people but all Europeans are hard working NHS saviours. Fact is people are people, whether from the UK or outside. You get lazy, scrounging people in every walk of life. Sadly we cannot ship out the lazy Brits.

People who are prepared to up sticks, move hundreds or thousands of miles away from their support networks, find a low-wage job in a foreign country and then work their way up are almost by definition not lazy scroungers.

This is one reason why for any given level of income/parental education, the children of migrants tend to do better at school than native children.

Try reading the published policy....

That would be too much like hard work for the average British voter.

@profanitiesatthedinnertable who interview hundreds of applicants?

Courtesy of the Times

So can someone please explain how this conundrum can be solved, please? why cant the additional skill that increases your points be related to the caring profession?
Surely a points based system is ours to run and the government can try and fill the short fall of a specific industry.

How do you propose we take care of our elderly in 20/ 30 years time with a net migration figure c. 280k p/a?

For those that haven't bothered, or are in denial, this is the policy for low skilled migrants, which includes care workers:

14. As part of the significant changes we are making to the operation of the border and immigration system, we are delivering on our manifesto commitment to reduce overall migration numbers. We will therefore end free movement and not implement a route for lower-skilled workers. We have reached this conclusion based on a number of factors set out in this paper.