Please can leavers please tell me how Brexit will benefit us?

[DaveGrohlsMuse]

Whenever this is asked mid-thread, it's never answered. There's plenty of information out there about how the UK had benefited from membership, but I really struggle to find info on how it's had a negative impact.
So in Jan 2021, once the transition period is over and we actually start to see the impact of the decision, what will improve? How will yours, and mine, and the general population's lives improve?

Just contradicts what you said elsewhere

How

Enoch Powell said he would campaign to leave the EEC forever, and he did

Some might say his rivers of blood speech in 1968 was correct.

No, I imagine they’d probably want a decent living wage for doing so

Exactly. That’s why I left the UK in the 80s.

Disaster for many, but Rule Brittania beckons no matter the cost. I don't see any upsides at all. But hopefully I will be proven wrong.

Like many others I have not seen any benefits for leaving. Wish someone would tell me what they are. Leave out the sovereignty and jingoisim for a minute and be truthful. Thanks.

Like many others I have not seen any benefits for leaving

UK only left 2 days ago. Brexit was never going to be an overnight windfall.

Well Mystery, we have had three + years to portray the windfall.

Still do not know. Apart from looking at Union Jacks and those celebrating.

But realistically, what are they celebrating? Genuinely interested, as it might change my mind.

This again 😴😴 first and foremost the uk Supreme Court will actually be supreme, not the European courts

The rivers of blood speech was racist claptrap liked by racists.

UK unemployment is low, you said this yourself, but suddenly now we have millions unemployed because wages are too low?

Round and round we go.

The ECHR will still have jurisdiction in the UK.

It isn't part of the EU.

Not on UK only matters

People will still be able to take cases to the ECHR even if it is UK only.

It isn't part of the EU and we haven't withdrawn from it.

'Fairing better', what on earth does that mean ? There could hardly be a more nebulous phrase.

Echr will stand. Great.

So what's next to try to denigrate post Brexit?

A bit of shuffling in the background I'd say.

UK unemployment is low, you said this yourself, but suddenly now we have millions unemployed because wages are too low

Referring to the Blair period. Things have tightened since then. Benefits can be stopped if people refuse work they are capable of doing. Hence making it easier to keep wages down for those at the lower end of earnings.

3 people working 16 hours per week instead of 1 person working 48 hours is cheaper. Wages can be kept down as the two that refuse the work can have benefits chopped.

Immigration increased the number of people at the lower earnings levels so 1 job is spread over three people. However, the increase in overall population stresses services.

Throughout the Blair period unemployment was low, at about 5 percent, benefits could always be stopped.

Immigration doesn't cause unemployment in UK nationals as all the studies show.

Low wages are not down to immigration ( See BOe, LSE and UCL studies for more info).

We tried to reform from within but got ignored or ridiculed. Outside we can ditch some of the more rediculous regulations such as tampon tax and bananas not aloud to curve more than a certain amount and fishermen having to throw dead fish back into the sea because they have caught their quota. Out of EU shackles we can make trade agreements with many countries such as US, Australia, Canada and NZ who are our security allies in Five Eyes Project. We can still agree a trade deal with EU. This will bring cost downnas more competition. As a coastal nation we can control how much fish we catch and if we want to share with other EU countries or not as Norway does. Under current rules we get less than 30% of our own fish and other EU countries get the rest. Under immigration rules we have to prioitise EU citizens just because of where they come from rather than the skills they pocess and we are forced to take people with criminal records who pose a threat to UK citizens, after Dec 2020 we can refuse anyone with a criminal record for terrorism for example. It is a fairer system as we can welcome immigrants from other EU ciuntries with skills we want and need. We can insist upon better and higher standards of animal welfare that EU currently refuses such as no live exports of animals for slaughter. We can still participate in progammes such as Eurasmus and cooperate on security. The UK is growing faster than EU and it will expect us to pay an even higher amount into its coffers. Only three net contributors and 25 taking out more they put in. The EU rules means we can not subsidise our own stealworks when they are failing. After we get out we can choose how we run our own country and no longer take orders from European courts above our own supreme court. The reasons are endless but some are so indoctrinated they think EU is answer to everything.

We did change the rules in fishermen chucking fish back in the sea.

The bananas is a myth.

Trade deals with the anglosphere is not going to replace lost UK trade with the EU.

We export 80 percent of fish to the EU and import most eaten here. Get used to eating other types of fish.

We had a very good deal within the EU, we weren't ridiculed at all.

Tampon tax the EU were changing.

Oh and its WTO rules on state aid that mean we can't subsidise our industries to whatever level we like

Good luck getting that changed.

I think (correct me if I’m wrong) that unemployment remains low. Full Fact did a good series on interpretations of employment statistics and concluded that yes, it really was low.

What concerns me is that an awful lot of workers are outside of these statistics. Apparently “the number of self-employed workers has been on the up in the UK since 2001 and they now account for around 15% of the working population” (BBC, haven’t verified it) and that the “gig economy” (Uber, delivery type jobs etc) is though to be a large part of the reason. It’s very hard to measure if they are underemployed, whether their earnings are up or down and whether their work supply is consistent.

There just doesn’t seem to be the information out there.

@WwfLeopard did you know that the ECHR will still have jurisdiction in the UK even though we've left the EU. If you'd know that, would it have changed your mind?

It's been fun watching the penny drop with the DUP. Aside from that...let's see what the end of the year brings. I am not hopeful.

Some countries do get a good deal out of EU. The ones that pay in less than they draw out. The UK is one of only 3 net contributers who get out less than they pay in. Please explain how that is a good deal for UK?

The EU also sellsĺ more goods to UK than we sell to EU, again EU benefirs most.

DaveGrohlsMuse in my view it is very hard to anticipate what benefits there may be in reality after January 2021 because we know neither what shape our future relationship with the EU will finally assume nor what impact will be seen on our relationships with other nations.

Threads of this type are usually frustrating affairs because posters ask for “what will improve” and then proceed to dismiss any benefits identified. I think the problem is essentially this, anything that I’d see (as a Leave) voter as a benefit of leaving the EU, you probably don’t. Equally, those things you’d likely identify as benefits of being “in” it I don’t see in the same light at all.

There will be change, some good, some bad, among the things I expect to happen that I’d say will be good things are...

Our laws will be made by people whom the electorate here can remove if they so chose. We should no longer have MEPs from other nations, whom we couldn’t vote out, deciding what the law here says.

Our trade with other parts of the world besides the EU should be more equitable because we will no longer have to discriminate against non EU nations by applying EU common external tariffs.

We will no longer be a major financial contributor to an organisation that I would argue hasn’t served our interests for decades. Why do I think that? well to give an example, I would always want to see more power handed to nation states, and channelled away from the European Union, yet the scope of EU law and EU development has only ever gone one way, it gets more competencies, not fewer, more powers not fewer. If I’d seen any evidence of the EU handing powers back to its member nations I might have reconsidered, but I saw none.

I could write plenty more about motivations for voting to leave and I’d like to take you at your word that this thread was “genuine questions” and “not goady” unfortunately your subsequent responses make that rather difficult.

Now you might say, how will any of the above benefit me, or benefit you? That you’ll have to answer for yourself I fear. For me, I don’t expect to benefit personally in any financial sense or directly in any other. Me voting to leave wasn’t ever about personal benefit to me.

We had a very good deal within the EU, we weren't ridiculed at all

Paying in more than you get back is a bad deal.