Westminstenders: The only way forward is up.

[placemats]

A new thread as the other one is getting full. I'm enjoying the post election discussion. Every view is listened to and welcomed.

Brexit is happening, but what kind of Brexit will it be?

New leaderships for both Labour and the LibDems.

Most importantly, will Britain be Great in 2024?

tobee they are a very scraggy bunch - the smallest and baldest of them all is also the loudest! They havent learnt to put themselves to bed yet so have just been out and put a torch in their coop - back out in the rain again shortly to round up any stragglers. In a month or so they should look rather less oven-ready...

RLB is a continuation of Momentum, which has had its day and is now run out of steam. It would be a futile appointment.

Nothing to do with anything on this thread, but I know you lot are felinophiles...

I do not five a flying what gonads the
(a) interim
(b) new permanent
leader of the Labour Party has
so long as they are
competent and able to hold the Government to account

Male, female, young, old, straight, gay
who gives a shit?
they just have to be somebody who resonates with those who would never join the party

Starmer knows that if one man stood against an otherwise all female shortlist, he would win. And it really is that simple when it comes to leadership and the Labour Party.

Most of those who rubbished Harriet Harman were Labour members!

Just to be clear I’m not recommending a merged lump of non-tories personally (mostly as I think at this stage it would be an absolute clusterfuck!) but it’s interesting that Japan’s opposition parties are feeling the same pressure to defeat the incumbents at even a cost to their parties. It’s not something I can imagine happening easily here, but sometimes desperation is a wonderful drug.

If Starmer is the strongest competition against Cons then he should stand. Labour needs all the help it can get right now otherwise it won’t stand a chance.

RLB is a continuation of Momentum, which has had its day and is now run out of steam. It would be a futile appointment.

The demonisation of momentum by the centre really needs to stop a lot of MP's would have lost their seats without the sheer force of people momentum brings

Supporting austerity in any form

The Labour manifesto (even without the WASPI giveaway) was less progressive than the LD's manifesto.

I'm quite bored with Labour Party members who think that buying votes is progressive politics.

Momentum is a movement that failed catastrophically in the Northern heartlands. Own it. Move on. Change.

The demonisation of momentum by the centre really needs to stop a lot of MP's would have lost their seats without the sheer force of people momentum brings
And lots of others would not have lost theirs if Momentum had not been so toxic and tribal threatening moderate MPs and candidates and presenting such an extreme narrative to the electorate

It's not 'demonisation' to say that it failed.

DGR
Love that picture.

Oh I know I'm at risk of being told I'm demonising Tories and Tory voters, but those who thought the Tory Party was still the party of 'one nation' conservatives and denying its lurch to the far right may have pause for thought on the latest Tory supporter...Tommy Robinson.

The founding member of the EDL sent a message to his supporters today saying: "OK, I have just joined the Conservative Party...." as well as praising Dominic Cummings by saying "Your country salutes you." Hmm, wonder what kind of salute he meant?

Starmer seemed the most impressive senior Labour team member but is he 'electable'? Code for someone who will appeal to a wider electorate.

Catching up and skimming.

to @placemats and @squid4 .

Interesting to read squid comment about Corbynites not being welcome in the Labour Party. I think 1)the Labour Party has been pretty much taken over by the Corbynites. And 2) I find it disturbing and short sighted that the Labour Party can't cope with a broad spectrum of people supporting them/being members. Appealing more and more to a diminishing minority is not the way to go. Further proves my point that Labour Party aren't not genuinely seeking power.

Interesting thoughts about Starmer.

I'm divided:

Do we need the Leader to be someone the Conservatives fear?

Or do we need a Leader with the skills to make the changes in Labour that need to be made (membership-wise)?

Is leading a party performed by the genitals ?

• Yes, then choose on the basis of sex

• No, then choose the best person

@OhLookHeKickedTheBall sorry to hear about your dd!

Good question Cat. Will he even get to lead if the party is still not ready? In which case someone else does the ground work.

If they do choose him then that’s fine

The Labour Party needs to find a sweet spot between the hard left under Corbyn and the neo liberal Centre under Blair / Brown.

thecat A new leader requires both qualities - and in fact they go together

A leader that can't make the necessary changes won't be feared

The Tories will fear anybody who can communicate important issues to the public better than Johnson

The Tories will fear anybody who can command the support of at least 80% of the PLP

The Tories will fear anybody who can think fast and clearly

Where on the political graph they lie is less relevant
than the ability to speak to waverers
and make them question the guff that will be coming from the Government over the coming months

Starmer would be perfect apart from one very big obstacle - he epitomises the metropolitan elite. Oxbridge, lawyer, north London seat, knighthood - none of that will play with working class voters.

Johnson did however with the wc. Starmer can work to overcome it. An issue yes but I wouldn’t immediately dismiss him.

You see, I'm not sure Keir Starmer can make the changes with regard to the membership.

I don't think he has reach beyond the Remainer/London base & he really, really is a charisma-free zone. And I think he has never demonstrated the ability to politically manoeuvre in the way that is going to be necessary - or to be forceful where necessary.

He hasn't demonstrated those things because they're not present enough in his character.