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Brexit

Westministenders: Promises, promises

985 replies

BigChocFrenzy · 17/11/2019 17:46

We should see the party manifestos soon
in 2017, that changed the election

So far, Tory and Labour have been competing for who can offer the most spending on the NHS

Labour have been giving tantalising glimpses of free dental care and free broadband

The Tories have been hinting at tax cuts, as well as public spending

The polls suggest the public like all of the above,
but also that Brexit is the most important issue

25 days to go, still all to play for

Westministenders' Abbreviations:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/3492426-Westministenders-Abbreviation?msgid=84503730

OP posts:
Thread gallery
37
PotterHead1985 · 19/11/2019 23:13

I've been absent the past few threads. Been sick. Watched the debate on itv. Flipping farce or what. Yer wan couldn't control BoZo. Wonder will the next be any better.

Also have a PMKitten who is moving into Chez Potter tomorrow. I give you Cola

Westministenders: Promises, promises
Jux · 19/11/2019 23:17

Hallo Cola ! ♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️

Motheroffourdragons · 19/11/2019 23:21

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on behalf of the poster.

ArseDarkly · 19/11/2019 23:30

It was quite cute at the end of the debate when BJ had to stop saying 'Brexit' and think of a present, he eventually said 'Damson Jam' - JC looked genuinely pleased and said 'I like Damson Jam!'

Little does he know it's just another bit of Bozo PR fakery to pretend he makes jam so Corbyn's going to be disappointed Sad

RedToothBrush · 19/11/2019 23:35

On CCHQ twitter account renaming itself to appear it was a fact checker service:

Lewis Goodall@lewis_goodall
.@maitlis asks @JamesCleverly about the “dystopian” CCHQ fact check tonight, he says it “came from our digital team” and refuses to say whether or not he gave the sign off.

@maitlis: “Did you OK it? Did you know about it?”

.@JamesCleverly: "The digital team have got a remit. I set that remit." #Newsnight

Thats either a yes I signed it off or I'm responsible for it even if I didn't sign it off

tobee · 19/11/2019 23:48

Lovely pussy cats! 💕

Cola looks like she/he would give Johnson what for! Grin

Ellie56 · 20/11/2019 00:23

Did anyone else think when Jo Swinson said we deserve better than the two tired old parties think it sounded like she said, "tired old farties"? Grin

FoldyRoll · 20/11/2019 00:28

The CCHQ Press account masquerading as a fact checking service was genuinely appalling. They used a purple tick logo and tweeted out graphics that gave no hint that they were from the Conservatives. It was a deliberate and cynical attempt to mislead people. The account name and avatar reverted to normal as soon as the debate was over.

tobee · 20/11/2019 00:43

They will get away with it.

Has cunt Cummings fucked off? Or is he controlling things from his hospital bed?

Coppersulphate · 20/11/2019 00:54

Well, clearly Boris won that debate.
Corbyn is incoherent on Brexit .

FoldyRoll · 20/11/2019 01:11

Sad but true tobee. I'd write a long rant about it but am already half asleep.

borntobequiet · 20/11/2019 05:32

As a result of my years of teaching I have noticed that students prefer and do better with a reliable teacher who turns up for every lesson, knows their subject, communicates it clearly, sets homework and marks it, and cares about them than with some charismatic firebrand with leadership ambitions who is always off somewhere being charismatic and telling others how to teach, leaving the class with a cover supervisor.
JC is the nearest thing we have to the reliable teacher. My vote is going Labour...

lonelyplanetmum · 20/11/2019 06:03

JC is the nearest thing we have to the reliable teacher. My vote is going Labour...

Morning, and Hear, hear Born

I'm still a political novice on here compared to most. But think your comment reminds us all in a nutshell. We have to vote for the nearest thing.

Labour has always been more than Corbyn. The Conservatives are now not^^ more than the ERG. As they kicked the more measured caring Tories out.

In constituencies where only Labour have a chance of beating the Tories people must vote Labour. Even if it's a one off.

If anyone doesn't like Corbyn well think that he will retire soon anyway; really people are voting for their MP and not Corbyn.

He will retire. The Labour Party has many many good experienced MPs and morally motivated candidates.

Look at...

Rebecca Long Bailey
Kier Starmer
Yvette Cooper
Hilary Benn
Emily Thornberry
Angela Rayner
David Lammy
Angela Eagle
Even Ed Miliband

Compare that to IDS, JRM, Gove,Johnson, Cleverly, Francois etc

Labour are collegiate and do listen to their back bench MPs. Unlike the Tories who are now the ERG having hounded more the reasonable ones away.

bellinisurge · 20/11/2019 06:22

Labour don't listen to their backbench MPs as exemplified by Corbyn himself. Lifetime backbencher.
I admit he gave the debate a good shot.
But for all the good people you have listed, the Opposition front bench is, with a few notable exceptions, packed with people like him. Neither man messed up. They were both clearly under instructions which they followed.
Hasn't changed my mind about either.

Motheroffourdragons · 20/11/2019 07:17

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on behalf of the poster.

bellinisurge · 20/11/2019 07:20

Yes, the "40 new hospitals" lie is snake oil salesman work of the highest order.

DadDadDad · 20/11/2019 07:37

@ArseDarkly - let’s get to the important facts: I thought JC said that he makes his own damson jam.

fedup21 · 20/11/2019 07:40

for the avoidance of doubt, could you please name the 40 new hospitals, the timescale for completion, the cost, how the need for each was determined & precisely what you mean by ‘new’ and ‘hospital’? Thank you.

Would love a proper answer to this.

lonelyplanetmum · 20/11/2019 07:55

name the 40 new hospitals

This is how the discussion on the NHS needs to be framed -with specifics.

It struck me in the debate last night that the language used even by Corbyn about the NHS not "being for sale" helps conceal the fact that the NHS has progressively been eroded.

Anyone who takes a superficial interest thinks " The Prime Minister must be right saying they are putting millions into the NHS . I'd know if an American company could 'buy' my local hospital".

People believe Johnson especially those who don't know medical professionals or who haven't used the NHS lately.

•It needs to be explained that the high cost of US pharma means that the NHS will have to reduced the services it offers or charge for them.

•It needs to be explained what the Health and Social Care Act 2012 did. It is only 7 years old. It has opened up the NHS to private sector providers.its a slow process but it is happening.

•It needs to be explained that the loss of NHS EU staff means that there's a 40% recruitment gap and this will leads to services being cut.

•It needs to be explained how the last 7 years the Tory competitive tendering process has been slowly undermining the NHS.

• it needs to be explained that the private companies have already started with the more contained stuff like hip replacements. But this leaves NHS providers with less money and still having the complex expensive services like A&E, intensive care, or long-term expensive care.

( The attached link explains how before the Tory changes the NHS providers could balance out surplus from one area to support the more expensive services . ) it needs to be explained how the Tories opening it all up to private providers makes it more expensive for the NHS to provide core services.

▪	it needs to be explained that private companies let the NHS train nurses and doctors. Then they leech the NHS-trained workforce exacerbating the acute staff  shortages.

The problem is - it is happening progressively. It is deliberate Tory policy. Yet people believe Johnson's words not his deeds. He says passionately he loves the NHS and " The NHS is not for sale" . People stupidly believe him.

The words say one thing but the deeds show the reality- it is being progressively given away drip, drip.

Dentistry went and medicine is going too.

I hadn't even realised but the many private companies providing NHS services are allowed to use the NHS logo on signs and staff ID etc. So sometimes you don't even know that services are already contracted-out.

This link explains more of what is actually happening and hidden but how many hits does it get ...
Few I expect.

www.patients4nhs.org.uk/how-is-the-nhs-being-privatised/

BaloneyInMySlacks · 20/11/2019 08:15

I had a confusing few minutes this morning while I tried to work out the logic behind CCHQ renaming their twitter account to FatChequeUK.

I must get my hearing checked. Grin

WhatwouldJessicaJonesdo · 20/11/2019 08:32

I'm voting based on who I would trust to look after my house while I was away. Corbyn would make sure the doors and windows were locked, water the plants and probably leave me bread and milk and a home cooked meal in the fridge for my return. BJ would leave the door wide open, lose my key, eat all my food and block up the toilet with a massive turd.

Peregrina · 20/11/2019 08:33

Johnson might be worse than that - he might have a party and let his friends trash the place. Remember his current girlfriend says that he has no respect for people's property.

MockersFactCheckMN · 20/11/2019 08:36

I understand that "New Hospital" means a different foyer carpet and improved coffee machine with added froth.

WhatwouldJessicaJonesdo · 20/11/2019 08:39

Exactly, and if I wouldn't trust him with my house, why would I trust him with my country!

BackInTime · 20/11/2019 08:57

The CCHQ Press account masquerading as a fact checking service was genuinely appalling.

I agree this was truly appalling, the idea of the governing political party masquerading as an independent fact checking organisation is really sinister. I believe that one of the reasons for doing this is to cause confusion and discredit the genuine fact checking sites that keep calling Johnson out on his daily lies.