Westminstenders: DUP says no

[TheMShip]

I don't really feel qualified to start a Westminstenders thread but we need a new one....

the poorest and most disadvantaged - didn't vote.

A lot did, the ref at the time was seen as a way to give those in the HOC a 'kick in the teeth' but there was no way Leave was going to win, I mean who'd be that short sighted right?

Ft is reporting 321 against, 318 for. Mood music from Eu will be key and i’d be surprised if that wasn’t part of the deal behind the scenes. Court of appeal deciding tmw if they can hear a legal action urgently in which they seek to declare pm cannot act to enable the Eu to refuse any extension requested as part of the benn act. I would guess he already has.

borntobequiet Then what? It could end up with no deal,

The collapse of UKIP and lack of BXP in the two other results posted is interesting ...

If Remainers could hold their nerve and vote down the WA - Brexit would be on its last legs.

Totally disagree!.... If the WA fails to be agreed, we’ll likely get a short extension for a GE, which the Tories will stand a good chance of winning now they have this deal (whatever you may personally think of it). The deal will pass and the Tories will have five years to implement and take us down a deregulated path.

The best thing to do is let it pass...allow things to settle, and have a GE. The UK public are notoriously ungrateful in elections... look at Churchill after WWII. People would then vote on issues other than Brexit, and concerns about loss of workers rights would stand a chance of a fair hearing.

JustAnotherPoster00 This is where it all fall down, people ( Parliament) really under estimated the real feelings towards the EU, in my area I would have been amazed if leave had not won.

borntobequiet Then what? It could end up with no deal

Appeasing (I use that word purposely here) this right wing nationalistic takeover of the Tory party shouldnt be done because we fear the alternative, no they need to keep fighting against these bullshit deals, theres still a glimmer of hope that rational minds will prevail but its the tiniest of slivers

@Oakenbeach 's Churchill analogy is spot on. It's all fecking ghastly.

really under estimated the real feelings towards the EU

Fuelled by decades of inaccurate coverage of the EU institutions by the UK MSM, austerity has been the driver of this, no doubts about that, Ive been re reading the ragged trousered philanthropist again and the thoughts and attitudes are identical to now, if we do stay in, or leave there needs to be a structural change in politics in this country this inequality is going to bubble over again and more often with more and more damage each time, the ref was the first bubble over

For above posters about workers rights and deregulation, the politico.eu summary of the changes to the deal says the level playing field provisions (labour rights, environment etc) have been beefed up in bj’s version.

Farming is going to be fucked under this deal.

More so than under May's.

Regulations changed to permit influx cheap food from USA; no labelling of sources, so consumers can't choose and origin can't be traced; consequent difficulties selling into EU (plus tariffs, so economically uncompetitive); no tariffs to protect UK farming.

Silly Brexit-supporting farmers; a tragedy for most farmers; depressing for the UK.

Mike Clancy
@mikeclancy1
· 21h
This morning I met with @michaelgove to discuss the new Brexit Deal.

I asked for reassurances that the government would not diverge on workers' rights after Brexit as this is critical for @prospectunion members.

He could not give me those assurances.

Level playing field commitments include state aid, competition, social and employment standards, environment and climate change and tax. Again from the politico article.

JustAnotherPoster00 No, against the EU especially in our area where all the local well paid factory jobs were going to EU citizens on below min wage, the people didn’t blame the EU citizens for trying to better their lives, but ( EU’s Fom ) which allowed it

Megan They are not in the WA.

They are only in the political declaration, stating that any future deal with the EU will have to take account of level playing file on workers' rights, H and S etc.

But

Johnson has made it clear he won't be pursuing a close relationship with the EU, and won't be negotiating for a far-ranging trade deal with the EU.

So all those 'beefed-up' rights are a chimaera.

They are not in the legally-binding WA.

For above posters about workers rights and deregulation, the politico.eu summary of the changes to the deal says the level playing field provisions (labour rights, environment etc) have been beefed up in bj’s version.

I haven't read the article, so I don't know if you are desperate spinning the politico article for partisan purposes, or whether they just have it wrong - but the big difference is that the LPF provisions are now in the non-binding political declaration rather than in the legally-binding withdrawal agreement.

No, against the EU especially in our area where all the local well paid factory jobs were going to EU citizens on below min wage, the people didn’t blame the EU citizens for trying to better their lives, but ( EU’s Fom ) which allowed it

The weakening of the unions caused that not FOM

Caveat up front that I am NOT saying all Leave voters (including any on this thread) are in favour of capital punishment, but the key finding of this Brexit voter intention study is interesting:

71 percent of those most in favour of the death penalty indicated in 2015 that they would vote to leave the EU. This falls to 20 percent among those most opposed to capital punishment.

The conclusion of the study is that Brexit was / is about values and ideology. It's not about politics or economics. How do you argue against that? You can't...

eprints.lse.ac.uk/69138/1/blogs.lse.ac.uk-Its%20NOT%20the%20economy%20stupid%20Brexit%20as%20a%20story%20of%20personal%20values.pdf

Hester They would have been even better blaming an employer paying below minimum wage. And better still to have looked at ways of getting workers unionised to push - together - to stop below-minimum wage jobs, to be honest.

I have more exciting things to do today, some fresh paint to watch drying.

Jon Worth
@jonworth
·
1h
I have just run the numbers again for Saturday's vote, based on my own estimations (not the Twitter polls)

My current estimate:
FOR the Deal 317
AGAINST the Deal 319

This is getting very nervous now

I wonder if we could just make a second referendum about the nations favourite colour instead ? You could have just as much passion, vim and vigour in arguing it, but no peoples futures would be harmed in the making of it.

thecatfromjapan You could say that, but before the available cheap labour, there were no EU citizens working in the factories, they had to pay the going rate,
The EU workers were happy to accept the wages, so why would they complain, there was always somebody else for their job,

I'm pretty sure it won't get voted through tomorrow. Then again I was pretty sure we would vote to remain!

😁@DGR

I think that's the thinking behind football and Strictly, to be fair.