Westminstenders: The Slow No

[RedToothBrush]

Have to make this quick.

Johnson has made an 'offer' to the EU. Let's stress this isn't a deal because they haven't agreed.

The EU have made kind noises about it but will say no thanks.

The UK are expecting this, and despite what's been said apparently are expecting more negotiation on this.

The DUP and the ERG seem to be on board with the proposal meaning in theory Johnson might have numbers to get through parliament. Except its not a deal so this is currently meaningless.

Parliament is prorogued again from next week with the Queen's Speech the following week.

As a GC feminist it's clear to me that men like Bannon hate women. To men like them the threat of powerful women is the worst thing they can invisage.

The ukippers who think wife beating is something that's "private"...

The ukip councillor who said that their member who killed his wife was as much a victim as she was...

Trump...a self confessed sexual predator....

Farage...who voted against every single EU law or regulation that helps women in the workplace...

Our own dear PM who cheated on his wife whilst she was undergoing cancer treatment...

I get really down about it. The sheer visceral hatred

But of course this misogyny is actually really irrelevant to women really, but speaks volumes about the misogynists themselves.

I have been thinking about this recently as we had friends staying. I said to my friend's DH that I never got why his DW and all her sisters have had such a chequered relationship history as they are all so lovely. He said the problem is they're all too strong women. That's it isn't it? Bannon, Trump, Farage think they've topped the alpha male scale and so they have, but subconsciously they want and need women -and this makes them feel a vulnerability that they don't like. They hate the fact they want and need us, therefore we are hated.

Thanks for this thread. Whats all this about Hungary as a spanner in the works. Boris and his nonsense is like watching elephants trying to fly. I feel sorry for those being taken in by it.

You are so right. Good to read this. I've also noticed that many of this Brexit lot had dubious relationships with mothers or their mothers dominated weak and/or philandering fathers.

Lisa Nandy's constituency will have a lot of people of Irish ancestry.

Has anyone spotted the unusual thread claiming all young people in Italy and Greece are anti-EU?

Shaking my head sadly here at the idea that there is a 'dilemma' (i.e. 'how could anyone possibly vote for Jeremy Corbyn?').

Seriously, what is the alternative?

Look at what happened in the US in 2016 when people stayed home rather than vote for Hillary Clinton (the story of that election is as much about who stayed home as who went out and voted in the districts that made the difference).

Look at what made people stay home - relentless smears against Clinton (and she wasn't a terrific candidate, just to be fair, but the alternative is now President, and she was a better prospect than him despite her flaws).

The moral of that story is that voting against a candidate you know will be disastrous, even if you have to hold your nose, is a Good Thing, and quibbling over details (many of which are to the forefront because of a propaganda campaign) has the effect of adding momentum to the party you don't want to see elected.

Labour have taken significant Remain votes from LDems
BUT
have lost more than these from Leavers
Hence the overall drop in support

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/oct/06/poll-shows-conservative-party-15-points-ahead-of-labour

Among remain voters, the Liberal Democrats have dropped seven points in a week,
with Labour gaining nine points among the same pool of voters who voted to stay in the European Union.

However, Labour has lost as many voters among leavers.
According to the survey only 8% of leave voters now say they would back Labour

Surely Brenda would only have to suggest that Johnson goes for a little drive with the DofE?

Clinton was indeed a poor candidate, but not voting for her meant letting in Trump

So the US voted to set their hair on fire, instead of to put dirty water on it

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/3710865-Westminstenders-Pro-Rogues?watched=1
New thread

@SwedishEdith I've noticed a fair few strange brexit threads today. Remainers are ignorant, wtf were the welsh thinking, what's the problem with the backstop, and the Greece and Italy one off the top of my head.

I rarely even look at other threads in the Brexit topic

The wilful ignorance is not worth bothering with - lack of knowledge is something quite different

Yolo
I read the AIBU Remainers thread and also decided it was not worth my energy

I bit on the Italy Greece thread - I couldn't resist

No, I usually ignore the other Brexit threads but I opened that one. MN don't care that, of course, and will shrug and say "Seems fine".

Brexit is like a Baby

Once it is delivered, we will need to -
change its smelly nappy several times a day
wash its clothes for years
cook its meals for years
it will give us sleepless nights for years
and even when it grows up it will keep asking for money from us

Delivering the thing is the start of the journey

its not an Amazon box after all

Bottom line for me is that three + years later, the UK really wants to stay and always did.

Late to the show I'll admit. Just found the thread.

I see brexit more like an alien baby springing out of its host's chest and killing them in the process.