Westminstenders: The Slow No

[RedToothBrush]

Have to make this quick.

Johnson has made an 'offer' to the EU. Let's stress this isn't a deal because they haven't agreed.

The EU have made kind noises about it but will say no thanks.

The UK are expecting this, and despite what's been said apparently are expecting more negotiation on this.

The DUP and the ERG seem to be on board with the proposal meaning in theory Johnson might have numbers to get through parliament. Except its not a deal so this is currently meaningless.

Parliament is prorogued again from next week with the Queen's Speech the following week.

There's a delightful goody thread in AIBU about Remainers being [thick ignorant] (this bit doesn't bother me, water off a ducks' back ) LEFTIES Again, this weird fake left-right dichotomy.

I may have missed it in my skim-reading, but I'm sure it's only a matter of time before somebody Leave-y posts about the greater horror of bogeyman-Corbyn and socialism.

Its not a government of national unity though is it? Its a remain alliance that will piss leavers off and solves nothing. Centrists have been opposed to Corbyn leading a GNU anyway. They fear "the reds under the beds" as much as the Tories. Probably because - aside from Brexit - they are on the same team.

twitter.com/i/status/1180721558500909056

Leave-y posts about the greater horror of bogeyman-Corbyn and socialism.

Just read any of Cendrillion or Bears posts, mainly Cendrillions though they make me laugh, comes short of calling anyone who isnt rabidly right wing a pinko commie

Swinson is not insisting she leads it though, just pretty much anyone other than Corbyn, so yet again the stumbling block is him.

I know most of you disagree but I honestly don’t understand how anyone can defend either main party leader right now

They both have options and they are both refusing to choose them

Which screws the rest of us right up

Swinson, as leader of a minority party doesn't get to call the shots. Corbyn should be very cautious of any alliance with a voting record like hers. This has been the problem for centrist remainers they hang their hat on any MP that supports remain, blissfully ignoring the type of politician they are cheering on. Rory Stewart is another example.

Just read any of Cendrillion or Bears posts, mainly Cendrillions though they make me laugh, comes short of calling anyone who isnt rabidly right wing a pinko commie

Jo Swinson could help if she stopped all the nonsense about not backing him in a temporary govt.

So get the Tory and Labour rebels on board and then Swinson will change her mind.

A Corbyn-led government does not have the numbers regardless of what Swinson does. Some of the people whose votes will be required left the Labour Party because they believed Corbyn unfit for office.

I'm not a massive fan of Swinson but she's right on the money here.

Funny thing is JustA we have disagreed previously on voting intention, because IIRC you are an actual lefty Labour Corbyn supporter, and I think Magic Grandad is a fucking useless courgette who helped exacerbate this shitstorm

I consider myself politically centrist, some things a bit more to the right, others to the left. In the past I was genuinely a floating voter. Now my hair is on fire and I am voting Pro-EU. My constituency, fortunately, is a Lab-LD swing seat. Therefore I can afford to not vote for the courgette's party in favour of the LDs. But if I lived elsewhere, I would vote Labour - because I don't fear the socialist beardy bogeyman.

This makes me, alternately, a student-fee-imposing, coalition-austerity-forgiving, uncaring rightwing monster and a pinko commie wealth-destroying ignoramus.

The Tiggs and expelled Tories are not going to make Corbyn PM. Can people not grasp this?

Join the club Elements. We are Schroedinger's Centrist.

This makes me, alternately, a student-fee-imposing, coalition-austerity-forgiving, uncaring rightwing monster and a pinko commie wealth-destroying ignoramus.

You have me beat elements I am only the aforementioned pinko commie who worships at the courgettie shrine of the cult of the Magic Grandpa

^^

The Government is acting like a bolshy child who is insisting to their parents that "All my friends are going" when insisting that their proposals have support (not that the EU is the UK's parent )

@KateEMcCann
Robert Jenrick tells #Ridge that Boris Johnson has widespread domestic support for his Brexit proposals. This is key message coming out of Gov today - was focus of PM's column too. They want to push EU to come to the table by using the weight of Parliament as persuasion

This when even the Brexit supporting Lisa Nandy, who is one of the Labour MPs who he needs, says the UK is "further away from achieving a deal than we were two months ago" - so just where in Parliament does he think that the Government is going to get this support? (...and that's before even considering whether the EU will accept these bonkers proposals which it quite rightly won't )

Just because the Government says something doesn't make it true. Indeed, we've got to the sad state that if the Government says something, then we know have a very strong suspicion that it is a lie wishful thinking

And yet the Government still seems to think and act as if it were respected internationally

Allthough being honest its really not about Corbyn, its about the policies and if there was another experienced politician espousing the same policies and was less devisive I'd vote for them but Corbyn is the only 1 right now I trust with those policies, give Pidcock a few years and she is going to be a force to reckon with.

Then its as BCF says Mockers No Deal it is and then we'll see how hard and how far along the left/right authoritarian we'll end up in a few years after No Deal makes austerity feel like a summers afternoon picnic, but for the Tories here theres at least a silver lining theyll get to kill more of us disabled people because 130,000 under austerity wasnt enough

Robert Jenrick tells #Ridge that Boris Johnson has widespread domestic support for his Brexit proposals. This is key message coming out of Gov today - was focus of PM's column too. They want to push EU to come to the table by using the weight of Parliament as persuasion

Good idea.

Let's have a vote.

Can I also just say, look at what Brexit is doing to all of us, I've just quoted and fully agree with BCF, we should all be ashamed, deeply deeply ashamed

Tom Newton Dunn @tnewtondunn
Extinction Rebellion’s military planning to occupy Westminster for 2 weeks. Different regions being deployed like battalions. Would stop the monarch from getting in and delivering the Queen’s Speech.

The timing is self defeating and ridiculous. If you wanted to undermine your own cause, you couldn't pick a better two weeks.

I'm with Misti and Elements, politically...this bench is filling up nicely!

(Apparently our seat is between CON and LD, if it stays like that LD gets my vote. If Labour is the party to oust the Tory, then I'll vote Labour.)

I'm with no deal crash out while the rest of parliament watches in incredulity as they never thought Boris had the gall to go ahead in whatever manner with whatever tricks he uses.

By Monday4th November shops run low on food, and petrol difficult to find but leave press report "what was everyone worried about" By Friday 8th food shortages become serious as press leak details of serious customs delays.
Within first week - Brexit death due to someone who had their head in sand and needed some vital medication - they get a GP's prescription but no pharmacies can fill it. Again leave press make person out to be non-Brexit related.
After 2 weeks - significant shortages, schools start to close, people get hungry, civil unrest. Boris blames the people. I could go on - what about the deaths from starvation, lost jobs - it will all come so quickly in some cases

I’m always utterly astonished that anyone can:
a) blame anyone but the Tories for instigating/escalating this Tory Brexit.
b) think that the Opposition are responsible for coming up with solutions to this Tory Brexit.

Trying to blame others is cowardly, dishonest and wrong.

The Opposition parties are trying to work in an imperfect situation that’s been forced on them. Parliament should really have been debating how to make the country happier, healthier, more solvent and more sustainable these past three years. The Tories have achieved the opposite.

I'm with Misti and Elements, politically...this bench is filling up nicely!

I'm actually a Labour voter (never voted anything but Labour in any U.K. election between the ages of 18 and 50). Now lost my vote but would still vote Labour if I could because my (ex) constituency is represented by a decent, remain supporting Labour MP.

Still think Swinson is right on this. A Corbyn-led GNU would require ex-Tories and people who left Labour because they think Corbyn is an antisemite to vote for him. Good luck with that.

TheElementsSong That AIBU thread has been started by a really GF who usually C&Ps reams of Torygraph op-eds by BXP members and tries to pass it off as her own.

And budge up on the politically homeless bench, I’ll need to join you, Misti and Fluffy.

Wot Elements said. Also in a Lab/LD marginal.

@NoWordforfluffy The Opinium poll data sheets didn’t appear until Monday last week. They are confusing to read.

I looked at the one last week the original sample of respondents was 2007. The poll where Conservatives were 12 points ahead was of 944 people of which over 50% was male and over a third described themselves as diehard leavers. In other words they had to filter out over half of the respondents to get the result they wanted.

I could have gone to the local golf club with a clip board and got the same result and I would have been cheaper.

As is often quoted on this threads opinion polls are about shaping opinion not expressing it.