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Brexit

Westminstenders: The House Is On Fire

991 replies

RedToothBrush · 03/09/2019 13:01

Have we walked into a trap or has the trap shut on the fingers of Johnson?

To early to tell but we have entered an All or Nothing Game.

Johnson seems to have been advised his only way out is a GE - the polls look decent to him. Yet the FTPA means he can not call one without parliaments consent.

He has tried to spook Tory MPs to his will by threatening de-selection. Yet this seemed to have backfired in combination with proroguing and fired up rebels and moderates.

This might still be deliberate though to remove the road block of an internal civil war in the Tory Party. In cleansing moderates though they become the Brexit Party...

... And Spreadsheet Phil has vowed to fight to the last for his party from entryists and non members like Cummings. After first getting support of his local association.

Tonight sees a vote at around 9pm, which is touted as a pseudo no confidence vote.

If this block no deal then tomorrow we face a big day. It looks like there are numbers to do this.

Rebels are looking to seize control of parliamentary time (which might affect prorogation timetable). This is a beefed up version of the previous attempt to do this.

This is around 3pm - 7pm tomorrow.

No 10 has a spad meeting at 7pm, which presumably is about fallout from that vote - and if it goes against government will probably be about trying to force an election.

If he can.

Labour now have leverage though. They can make demands and insist they are in law before agreeing to a GE on Johnson's terms.

Which perhaps makes a GE less likely than the BBC seem to think.

There is talk of trying to force another extension to 31st Jan. I'm not entirely sure how this helps, without a legitimate goal of a deal that goes with it. All it does is push things even more polarised.

And that's my fear. The issue of Brexit isn't going away. No deal, a deal and remaining all leave significant numbers highly dissatisfied. Its hard to see a way out of this without unrest because its been pushed so hard in a polarising way.

If Johnson fails to no deal or to deal on his terms where does this push Farage sympathisers?

We shall see what happens...

... Will the House's independence survive until Nov 5th?

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RedToothBrush · 03/09/2019 21:35

What is this Labour MP speculating about?

Mary Creagh @ marycreaghmp
Just been in the tea room.

Some nasty surprises in store for Johnson-Cummings at tonight’s votes.

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DarkAtEndOfUK · 03/09/2019 21:36

There could not be a stronger signal that Parliament and Executive are at each others' throats than the whip being withdrawn from rebels while this debate is going on.

OhYouBadBadKitten · 03/09/2019 21:36

Ok, heading home now - knackered! I met Thecatfromjapan and they are so so lovely :)

RosinaAlmaviva · 03/09/2019 21:37

The attempts to get the WA passed reminded me of a friend's cat which liked to steal baguettes from a local restaurant and would try repeatedly to force them through the catflap, lengthways.

If they can finally get their baguette turned the right way round, bring it on. I'd rather that than no-deal.

OhYouBadBadKitten · 03/09/2019 21:38

Can someone do a rapid summary please. This train signal is awful.

RedToothBrush · 03/09/2019 21:39

Tim Shipman@shippersunbound
Tory chiefs say there are 16 Conservative rebels tonight. They will all be stripped of the whip this evening

Jessica elgot@jessicaelgot thought 18.

Starting to get interesting.

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flouncyfanny · 03/09/2019 21:39

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TokyoSushi · 03/09/2019 21:39

Ah Sky news says that there will be a response from the Government (and annoyingly probably by JRM) to say that they will bring forward a motion for a general election tomorrow, let's see...

CGTER567 · 03/09/2019 21:40

Has the speaker told JRM to sit up and look like an elected member and not a drunk in a Wetherspoons yet? I've been away from PC for a little while.

DarkAtEndOfUK · 03/09/2019 21:41

I struggle to believe either that Johnson is genuinely trying to get a deal out of the EU, or that anyone seriously believes he is. All of his actions and signals are for no deal. OK I don't play politics well, but if it quacks like a duck, etc etc etc.

RedToothBrush · 03/09/2019 21:41

Arj Singh @singharj
🚨 Another headache for Boris Johnson as newly elected ERG chair Steve Baker:
- calls for an election pact with Nigel Farage’s Brexit Party
- vows to oppose Brexit deal even if backstop is removed
- criticises PM’s threat to sack opponents of any new deal

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flouncyfanny · 03/09/2019 21:42

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LouiseCollins28 · 03/09/2019 21:43

Not surprised Red. Govt onto a loser on this tonight, and they should be.

BigChocFrenzy · 03/09/2019 21:44

I wonder how much of a minority govt BJ is reducing himself to, how many Tory MPs will be stripped of the whip.

Will they lose the whip permanently, or just for a month or so ? - probably academic, as few if any will be returned at the next GE, with voters mostly going by the rosette colour.

TokyoSushi · 03/09/2019 21:45

I'm going with 19, if they all have the whip removed tonight, then doesn't that massively reduce the majority? (Well minority but you know what I mean)

What a fucking shambles, the walls really are closing in, shortest term as PM in a long long time coming up?

flouncyfanny · 03/09/2019 21:45

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LyraParry · 03/09/2019 21:47

I think Tory rebels will be approx 15 but I also think around 5 opposition / independent MPs will vote with the government.

MerryChristmasHarry · 03/09/2019 21:47

Roughly what time can we expect vote and result?

Motheroffourdragons · 03/09/2019 21:47

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This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on behalf of the poster.

RedToothBrush · 03/09/2019 21:47

Jessica elgot@jessicaelgot
We are just 20 mins away from a really extraordinary moment, where we expect 8 former cabinet ministers to lose the Tory whip, some of whom who left some of the highest offices in the land just weeks ago. It really is quite unreal.

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BigChocFrenzy · 03/09/2019 21:47

Poor party mangement, making your own govt even more of a minority by chucking out your own MPs

The ultimate "cutting off nose to spite face

But it shows how No Deal fanaticism has taken over the Tory Party and common sense has long left their building

RedToothBrush · 03/09/2019 21:48

Labour's John Mann voting with the government tonight

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Belindabelle · 03/09/2019 21:48

To lose one member is unfortunate to lose 16!

Memorable day for Mr Johnson but not for the reasons he would have hoped.

flouncyfanny · 03/09/2019 21:49

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PerkingFaintly · 03/09/2019 21:49

OYBBK and thecatfromjapan, thank you for your service to the country.Cake

(Been watching too many US govt hearings.)