All threads in brexit seem to anti brexit? Mn is usually balanced... Were are pro b threads?

[Knittedjimmychoos]

Looking for some lighter brexit relief by fellow leavers... Every thread I've glanced at seems to be dominated by renainers?

Is there any space for leaver on here?

Just interested... I wanted to chat...

[Clavinova]

WTO doesn't require a physical border. It never had. As long as you have control of your economic area.

The WTO have said they won't get involved at all unless another member lodges a complaint;

“The WTO will not intervene unless one of its members brought a case,” ...
“If they [the UK] do not apply any duties or customs procedures against other trading partners and they do not have a trade agreement, some people might not be happy about that and they can bring a dispute settlement case.”

[1tisILeClerc]

{but because I have said I am unhappy about free movement of criminal gangs from Eastern Europe. }

FoM legislation means nothing for this. Banning cheap flights would help as anyone can come to the UK for up to 3 months regardless of FoM. Getting a cheap flight from anywhere to UK (or even from UK yo Europe) with a few weeks 'thieving or whatever, leaving the proceeds with 'associates' in UK (EU) all falls under FoM 'radar'.

{"The Geneva-based trade body where countries negotiate the rules of international trade would only intervene in a dispute over trade if one of its 164 member countries made a complaint."}

Well how long do you think it would take for at least one of 164 countries to lodge a complaint? Minutes or hours?

[bellinisurge]

If the UK violates GFA, I think lots of people would notice. Including people we want to have trade deals with. Like the USA.

[1tisILeClerc]

The leavers seem to have some idea that the rest of the world will 'play nice' when the UK leaves.
The chance of a gathering of buzzards around the corpse in the desert is more likely, especially when you think how many countries the UK has pissed off over the last 3 years at least, and 800 if you consider Ireland.

[Bunnyfuller]

Remainder: why did you vote Leave

Leaver: because Unicorns!

Remainer: unicorns aren’t real. Even the people that promised you Unicorns admit they were fibbing now. Lots of them say our chances of ever having unicorns will be well and truly smashed with a No-Deal Brexit

Leaver: stop attacking me! All you Remoaners do is berate us on our right to vote what we wanted!

When someone is faced with being wrong, psychology says they will dig their heels in even harder and will refuse to countenance anything that reinforces their mistake, regardless of logic or common sense. The ego seeks to protect itself, because this is preferable to admitting their error.

[bellinisurge]

It's pretty funny (if it wasn't so pathetic), I voted Remain, I said you can have a Leave that doesn't fuck up GFA, and apparently that makes me a Remoaner.

[Bearbehind]

Why is it so impossible to create a 'special exemption' for the border

Because we’re not fucking ‘special’. When will that start to sink in?

What is wrong with refusing to put up a border?

Nothing if the UK and EU are prepared to trade with the rest of the WTO on the same terms.

[Clavinova]

Well how long do you think it would take for at least one of 164 countries to lodge a complaint? Minutes or hours?

"Even if other WTO members believe they are being disadvantaged by the rules and complain to the WTO, the lengthy disputes process means it would take "many years" before it could allow other members to impose reciprocal tariffs on UK exports."

"Elvire Fabry, senior research fellow at the Jacques Delors Institute, in charge of trade policy, globalisation and Brexit suggested that the UK could argue for a WTO exemption in the form of Article XXI: national security."

"It prevents any member from taking action against another state in order to maintain international peace and security."

"She said as it was a "grey zone", given the history of violence at the border in Northern Ireland, it could be considered by WTO members."

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-47559880

[bellinisurge]

Hilarious that you think that after our dicking about over NI that countries wouldn't try and shaft us.

[Peregrina]

What is wrong with refusing to put up a border?

Controlling our borders was one of the things the Leavers were asking for. Now they say they don't want borders?

[1tisILeClerc]

{Controlling our borders was one of the things the Leavers were asking for. Now they say they don't want borders?}

In so many of Theresa's speeches she was saying about taking control of our borders.
Well there is 350 miles of it on Ireland that needs controlling, and another, much shorter border in Gibraltar.

[BackInTime]

There is no Brexit that is better than the deal we have right now. There is no Brexit that upholds the GFA. Sorry to burst your bubble OP but there is is no 'light Brexit relief' in a situation that threatens peace in NI and where party politics and politicians personal ambitions means that we will all be very much worse off.

[jasjas1973]

Hatels We see the lengths and risks peoples will take to reach the UK, with no border... well, its an open door isn't? these poor folk will claim asylum and will become our problem, they'll be little co-op from the EU, we'd have pissed them off.

I think relying on the good people north and south of the border to police it is somewhat naive... i.e. if the UK imports say, hormone treated beef, there is zilch stopping an enterprising criminal from palming it off as Ireland's best beef (or anyone else's) and within 24hrs is being sold in France, once this gets in the EUs food chain, say burgers or baby food, then they'll be a border and that will be on the decisions that the UK has made.

[HateIsNotGood]

OK - I popped back because I'm flagging on working (that die was thrown as soon as I popped in earlier).

My first thoughts on today's debate thus far is how refreshing it is to criticize a Leave voter for being a Hippy - it' surely a first and I'm delighted to 'own' that 'mantle'. Makes a nice change from the usual criticisms cast at people who voted Leave.

Jas - do you mean the 'poor people' waiting on the other side of the Channel in places like the Calais Jungle (destroyed by French Police) and the other encampments waiting to seek Asylum in the UK? At worst the French Govt will let them all jump on ships to become 'our' problem.

At best that will stop them getting in dinghys and risking their lives even further to get here. So far, besides the French destroying their camps and discouraging their jumping on ships, it's an unresolved problem that hasn't been yet been resolved by our EU membership.
Maybe you have a solution that neither the EU, nor the UK itself, has discovered yet?

[HateIsNotGood]

Hi clerc - you're more than welcome to come and join us on our Peace-loving, tit-waving, No Border party-fest. You don't even have to grow a pair first - just don't go waving your bollocks around as you might get arrested.

[bellinisurge]

Turn on tune in drop out.

[Clavinova]

We see the lengths and risks peoples will take to reach the UK, with no border...well, its an open door isn't?

We employ 'Operation Gull’ now - no doubt there will be a similar arrangement;

^"a joint exercise between Irish and British police and immigration forces.The stated aim is to prevent the movement of undocumented migrants across the Irish land border and the ‘sea border’ with Britain.
Police and immigration officers board buses, search trains, stop private cars, and question passengers on ferries and planes.The operation is now known to involve the UK Border Agency, the Police Service NI (PSNI), and Police Scotland, as well as the Garda Síochána, and the Garda National Immigration Bureau (the Irish police, and immigration, authorities).In 2016 almost 800 people were ‘intercepted’ under Gull–a 66% increase on the year before.^"

[HateIsNotGood]

Another thought is that Merkel is the biggest Hippy in Europe - having grown up in East Germany she knows how bad Walls and Borders really are - and so I understand her intentions when she opened up her Germany to Asylum seekers (and thusly all of the EU).

If it wasn't for the Berlin Wall coming down she wouldn't be the German Chancellor, maybe she might hold a lower position in the East German Govt (or more likely disappeared c/o the Stasi for being too full of 'hippy-shit).

She is a quite remarkable woman and Leader and I hope she gets to leave Office with dignity.

[jasjas1973]

Why would the EU co-op with a former member state that refuses to pay its dues?
Why would there be a similar arrangement? cake an eat it springs to mind, brexitiers need to realise what 3rd country status will mean (in the event of a no-deal)
Which if we leave on 31st Oct will be the case, its impossible to have a new deal by then, there is no EU commision, something which seems to have escaped Hunt/Johnson.

Hatels You are not answering the point of the integrity of the EUs SM, all you appear to be doing is a Johnson and diverting onto another topic.
Surprised you are a fan of taking own borders when brexit will erect a new one, even ignoring NI

[1tisILeClerc]

I'm all for peace loving. My boobs are a bit 'sub standard' but I don't get them out anyway.

Ms Merkel is a very clever woman and I agree that she should step down or at least back a bit soon for her health. I am sure she would like to stay involved but at the front line it is a grueling job.

Working out how to occupy essentially too many people on the planet is a massive problem and some radical thinking needs to be done. Cheap jibes at the French police is simply being unpleasant for the sake of it. There are immense problems globally and small minded 'cat calling' will not help.

[jasjas1973]

Hatels the asylum seekers Merkel let in do not have papers to travel around the EU ie a German passport.
Around 140k asylum seekers are granted german nationality each year, most will stay in Germany because thats where they would have lived for many years before their cases were heard.

[HateIsNotGood]

Another thought is - the EU can deal with their own Orbans - maybe as 'it' is so superior to to the UK, they won't be asking the UK for any help on this.

It's gone all quiet on the Brexit front....have you all gone to bed, have 9-5's to get up for? Normally you'd all be gnashing away, asking for evidence, "what is your Plan", etc.

Or is there the infintessimal possibility that the odd point has been raised that your 'ammo-belts' aren't ready with the appro-pro ammo?

OP asked for 'lighthearted' - if nothing raised even a little grimace of a smile (prior to posting) I can only leave you to your own mire of despair.

[bellinisurge]

Some of us have work in the morning. And you haven't come up with anything to explain why No Deal is ok.

[jasjas1973]

...just like Johnson.... can't answer the points raised. though when he (BJ) said he'd never read paragraph 5 /c i did laugh, a brexitier without a clue, what a surprise!

[HateIsNotGood]

I don't do 'cheap jibes' clerc, just stating a fact as briefly as possible. I have no probs with the French Police, nor any other Police, for that matter. Even on the very odd occasions that I have come in contact with any Police, I find them very courteous, whatever country I might come across them - just normal people doing the job they are paid to do. That probably comes with being a generally law-abiding, repectful person.

At least we can agree about Merkel. And it's ok about your boobs, if possible I'd rather keep mine in my shirt too, but if needs must....
Maybe the threat of Hate swinging her tits around will be enough to keep an open border.