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Brexit

Westminstenders: A False Sense of Security

995 replies

RedToothBrush · 12/04/2019 22:34

The new exit date, unless we agree a deal sooner, is the 31st October.

It seems ages away, but its runs the risk of a false sense of security too.

The first deadline is May 22nd. The Conservative Party would dearly like to avoid European Elections. They are already liable to face wipe out in the early May local elections, as the party was at its peak in 2015 under Cameron when there were last elections.

The EU elections have the added danger of proportional representation meaning UKIP and The Brexit Party could win seats from them. This is despite polling suggesting that Ukip and the Brexit Party are unlikely to reach the high watermark of 2015 and this could lead to fewer UKIP style MEPs this time round.

The liklihood of a deal by 22nd May is low though. Especially given how well Tory - Labour talks are going. The potential for a deal seems remote in the next few weeks.

The next deadline falls on 30th June. If we do have EU elections, the next target for the Tory Party is the end of June to get a deal before the newly elected MEPs can take their seats. However if the goal is unachievable before EU elections, it seems unlikely that agreement will be found in the next 30 days unless there is a major change of heart amongst the hardcore ERG and the DUP. Labour will want to see the Tories humiliated too much.

May who says she will go, will face another wave of pressure to resign during May and June. Messages out of No10, though not May herself, had indicated an exit around 22nd May on the condition a deal was done. Crafty as ever, what May actually said was she would stay on until we reached the second stage of Brexit and had effectively left. This now falls as late as Oct 31st, thus killing plans for a summer Tory leader election.

Once we get past June though, time for a deal, any deal starts to become very limited. Parliament only sits until mid July. Here May hits another problem. The two year parliamentary session ends. There has been talk of it being extended but the DUP have firmly said no to this.

This means when parliament is due to return in September we have an issue. To start a new session May will need a majority to pass a Queens Speech. If the DUP and Hardline ERGers withdraw support in protest at May still being PM what happens? Can May win support from elsewhere. It seems unlikely.

At this point the question of a General Election looms large. And we only have six weeks from then before we exit the EU. If a GE is triggered then, the risk of no deal is extremely high, which might encourage some to support May from across the aisle to prevent parliament from being shut and losing those crucial six weeks.

The danger over the next few weeks, is there is a false sense of there being lots of time left. The reality is our real deadline might be in effect the end of the parliamentary session in mid July. After that all bets are off.

The date of 31st October isn't the one you should keep your eyes on.

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Flowerplower · 13/04/2019 15:28

I found this method for making your own nematodes which looks quite interesting as they're expensive to buy in, haven't tried it but I might when it's time for the next application: www.google.com/url?sa=i&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjyquSPo83hAhWl6uAKHUeTBh8QzPwBegQIARAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fhazelgroveallotment.wordpress.com%2F2012%2F05%2F21%2Fmake-your-own-nematodes-to-combat-slugs%2F&psig=AOvVaw1VpCj2K3BxtWN3-ZUZIJbo&ust=1555251946626996

NoWordForFluffy · 13/04/2019 15:33

Hmmm. That's quite grim really, @FlowerPlower! Envy < not envy! 😂

I'll get you round to sieve my dead slug juice, maybe (now there's an offer you don't get every day. I'll add lemon drizzle cake as an enticement if it helps)?!

So many comparisons between slugs and some of our MPs / party leaders!

woodpigeons · 13/04/2019 15:33

pretzels your post is amazing.
Could you send it to some remain groups as I they are saying that remain doesn’t really have a strong narrative like leave does ?
It said that remain only does hard facts whereas leave does emotion and leavers aren’t impressed by facts. Indeed Gove told them not to be.
I can’t remember which group it was but really believe they would all benefit from it.

BigChocFrenzy · 13/04/2019 15:40

Pascal Lamy - former director-general of the WTO & former European trade commissioner
Good article explaining some basic facts & comparisons, CU & SM

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/apr/12/brexit-customs-union-labour-irish-border

The single market without borders is about regulatory homogeneity.

Leaving the single market reintroduces a border – the thickness of which depends on the degree of regulatory divergence

The customs union is about the common external tariff.

The single market is about common regulations.

Clearly, staying only in a customs union would not be enough to solve the Irish border question.

Flowerplower · 13/04/2019 15:42

I guess I have a strong stomach NoWordforFluffy as that actually sounds like a fun social occasion to me 😁. Though not strong enough to bear our local MP Grin.

woodpigeons · 13/04/2019 15:42

Flower not sure if I could manage that nematodes recipe. Emptying slug traps is bad enough.

woodpigeons · 13/04/2019 15:49

Paece thank you but there wouldn’t be room for a poly tunnel as it’s squarish, quite small and with fruit bushes on 3 sides.
I’ll keep thinking about it though as if we leave I was thinking about turning over more of the garden to produce.

yolofish · 13/04/2019 15:50

I had a slug bucket one year, water with added salt - the bastards still climbed out though. Think I could give the home made nematodes version a go!

NoWordForFluffy · 13/04/2019 15:53

Great, FlowerPlower. I'll supply the slug juice and cake, you bring the beer!

And no, I'm not sure there's anything which would entice me to spend time with Mr Moore. He's still not replied to my email yet, so I'm not sure he's that enamoured with me either!

TalkinPaece · 13/04/2019 15:55

woodpigeons
A mini plastic greenhouse to get everything started and then plant out once sturdy might work for you.

yolofish
I find an old kitchen knife to cute them in half and then they eat each other works a treat.
Prowling the garden at night with a head torch and a knife is very good for folks like me Grin
have not specified whether I mean slugs or politicians

MangoSplit · 13/04/2019 15:56

Place marking

QueenOfThorns · 13/04/2019 15:58

@NoWordForFluffy the nematodes are wonderful! Even the first year we tried when we only applied them once a lot later in the year. Because this is the first year I’m trying veg properly, I’ve also ordered one dose of a different sort that deals with common fruit & veg pests. That comes next month.

Regarding pumpkins, the seed packet says sow indoors from March, and I wanted to give them a good long run to try to get a whopper for Halloween! It might be a bit early to plant them out, but they’re getting big, so I’ll give it a try.

Loving the Brexit slug metaphor! Nematodes are quite a sophisticated solution - someone pass the salt Smile

yolofish · 13/04/2019 16:08

jeez TiP big respeck!!! I had to use those claw things that old people have to pick them up... would prob work on politicians as well as slugs?!

Icantreachthepretzels · 13/04/2019 16:18

woodpigeons this is the only social media I'm on - but if anyone is linked up to a remain facebook group/ local group please pass on the narrative. And feel free to nick my post if you don't want to have to rewrite it.

NoWordForFluffy · 13/04/2019 16:29

You've convinced me, @QueenofThorns. I'll sow my pumpkins now (as in I'll literally do it when I've stopped typing!).

I'll definitely look at nematodes for the allotment as they aren't raised beds, so shouldn't die off, hopefully.

dontcallmelen · 13/04/2019 16:46

PMK, thanks Red & everyone, just catching up I really really hoping that European elections do take place, as I think the remain vote will be very inclined to go out & vote which will hopefully return many more remain MEP’s & that may start to nullify the ‘will of people’ blah blah narrative or at least make it harder to ignore.

countrygirl99 · 13/04/2019 17:03

I think Remain should have used the same ad agency as HSBC.

RHTawneyonabus · 13/04/2019 17:04

peace I found the wool pellets were a bit crap on my hostas after rain but they could be okay on veg. The hostas are like crack for slugs so they’ll do anything to get them!

pretzel I think your idea is really sound. I was struck on the small pro EU March I went on that the chants were really quite crap. I went on a lot of marches as a child in the 80s and they knew how to chant in those days!

DGRossetti · 13/04/2019 17:21

Don't forget, not everything can just hang on till October ...

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47921375

British Steel is seeking a £100m loan from the government in order to meet EU emission rules.

Previously, the company could have used EU-issued carbon credits to settle its 2018 pollution bill.

However, the steel maker has been affected by a European Union decision to suspend

woodpigeons · 13/04/2019 17:27

Paece I thought of a mini greenhouse but we get a lot of wind so got a big cold frame instead.
I can cope with slugs but the rabbits ate absolutely everything overnight. It was either rabbits or a rampaging army of massive slugs because there was absolutely nothing left the next day and the plants were quite big and sturdy.
Thanks a lot. I’ll continue with my wild and bee friendly flowers for now. See how I get on with the salad leaves this year and maybe change things next year.
The wild flowers, I’m growing a lot of different varieties, are spurned by slugs and survived the heat very well so that’s one success.

WhatWouldScoobyDoo · 13/04/2019 17:42

littlespaces

Thanks for the links re the European elections - really interesting!

Very worrying as I don’t think many people will realise the danger of the split pro-EU vote Sad Is there done way to get this message out?

I was going to write to my (lovely remainy) Labour MP to explain that they risk losing many votes unless Labour changes its official Lexit stance - but he knows this. So that wouldn’t be any use.

Want to do something though!

TalkinPaece · 13/04/2019 17:48

Scooby
I do think that Labour might have to change depending on how the local elections go ....
sadly there are none in London this year

BigChocFrenzy · 13/04/2019 18:07

DG All UK businesses potentially have this issue, just depends how important carbon offsetting is for their business

Uk airlines also can't use the EU carbon trading credits
iirc a small airline went bust a few months ago citing this suspension as a significant cause

BigChocFrenzy · 13/04/2019 18:10

🎺🎺 Happy 80th birthday, @GeistohneGrenzen ! 🎂 💐

DGRossetti · 13/04/2019 18:34

DG All UK businesses potentially have this issue, just depends how important carbon offsetting is for their business

we know that, but I doubt it's widely known ... it's a pressure for any agreement.

Incidentally, if the government does bail out British Steel, would it count as state support and preclude BS from certain contracts ?