Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Brexit

Westminstenders: And I neeeedddd moreeeee timeeeeee!

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 14/03/2019 12:57

We need Time!
Its the one thing we don't have.

Todays vote is on extending a50.

To the displeasure of leavers, Bercow has selected amendments:

e) Corbyn Amendment
demands the government should “provide parliamentary time for this house to find a majority for a different approach”.

h) Wollaston Amendment
cross party amendment requesting to extend to allow the ability to legislate for a PV

i) Benn Amendment
cross party backbenchers take over parliamentary time from 20th March to find a majority way forward which gives justification for an extension

j) Bryant Amendment
prevents meaningful vote III

After yesterday's vote, May is left with effectively four options:

1) Pass the WA and go for a short technical extension.
An extension would have numbers in the HoC, but passing the WA is a struggle and it's reliant on the EU granting extension which is probably viable in this circumstances.

2) Be defeated getting the WA through and be forced into asking for a long extension as a result. This would include EP elections.
This option is politically toxic to the tories and its unlikely a long extension would pass the HoC. The EU would still need a justification for a long extension - a PV would be the natural option - but not clear if that could pass the HoC. Ditto passing legislation for EP elections. Whole scenario is unlikely

3) Be forced to revoke
Tory party big red button of self destruct

4) Actively decide to pursue an illegal no deal Brexit
Let's not think of the ramification

Going through this at speed, my initial reactions to this are:

If e) passes it doesn't really make much difference to May's choices here, but Labour might have more say.

If h) passes it might make 2) more likely

If i) passes it might open up alternative options

If j) passes we might have a real issue if its the only amendment that passes - it would leave a straight choice of Revoke or No Deal UNLESS i) passes as well.

But there might be other things that are not hitting me right in the face now.

As it stands, Hard Line Brexiteers were earlier today making noises that they would now support the WA - including whispers that this would include the DUP who would be likely to set off a chain reaction of support.

However which (if any) amendments pass today could well affect whether thats even a possibility.

As a result this vote needs to carry the health warning 'Be Careful what you wish for'. What you would LIKE might be extremely high risk and might jeapordise the main vote and the chances of an extension at all.

So whilst Leavers might be unhappy about the choices, it might well ultimately work best for No Dealers. Or it could be a gift for Remainers. Bercow's selections are not necessarily biased for this reason. He does not know the outcome here. If anything it looks like he's actually trying to put more options on the table for the house, rather than allow May to dictate to the house. Which is exactly what he should be doing. He's given parliament the power.

I suspect we will not fully understand what is going on tonight EVEN MORE than last night. And it will take a short while for everyone to calibrate what the eventual result actually is going to mean.

THIS is the most important vote yet. And it has the potential its going to end up m-e-s-s-y.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
31
RedToothBrush · 16/03/2019 09:14

@bydonkeys has pictures of the 'epic' march to leave.

Almost as many journos as marchers by all accounts

OP posts:
LonelyTiredandLow · 16/03/2019 09:15

I'm looking forward to the People's March. Even if the 700k that turned up last time return (and I suspect there will be more this time) we are showing that this means far more to us than the leave voters. And we are organised.

I imagine many of the Leavers looked out of the window and gave up on any idea of being outside today. Was this the Farage "pay me £50 to walk on a road" march?

lonelyplanetmum · 16/03/2019 09:18

#EpicProtestMarch

lonelyplanetmum · 16/03/2019 09:20

twitter.com/bydonkeys/status/1106843640352202757?s=12

BigChocFrenzy · 16/03/2019 09:20

Leclerc Yes, date typo in a draft doc
The FT with the memo story:

<a class="break-all" href="https://www.ft.com/content/030dce3c-4749-11e9-a965-23d669740bfb" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.ft.com/content/030dce3c-4749-11e9-a965-23d669740bfb</a>

"The draft document, circulated to EU ambassadors on Friday and seen by the Financial Times,
makes clear Britain has to take part in the May 23-26 votes if it seeks an extension of more than three months."

We'll have to see if E27 heads of govt follow that advice

BigChocFrenzy · 16/03/2019 09:22

I hope Remainers aren't discouraged by all this shit - or the godawful gales if it's like here - and even more than 700k turn up

lonelyplanetmum · 16/03/2019 09:25

The weather forecast is better for the Remain march next weekend anyway.

The twitter comments on the NF march are really funny.

" Is that a cliff they are standing next to."
" If you squint is that the sunlit uplands I can see"

LonelyTiredandLow · 16/03/2019 09:29

Haha, just read this and thought they are probably Remainers out there on the march:
^Gina’s crusade

There will be a good turn-out for Nigel Farage when he sets out on his much-trumpeted march from Sunderland to London this weekend if Gina Miller has anything to do with it. Sadly for him, she’s urging Remainers to line the route.

The indefatigable transparency campaigner has begun writing pieces for the regional papers whose circulation areas Farage will possibly deign to walk through (he’s made it clear he can’t be fagged to walk the whole way). “I would say to anyone who gets a chance to see Mr Farage to hear him out respectfully, but do please take the chance to ask him the questions that matter,” Miller has just advised the readers of the Yorkshire Post. “Above all things, look the man in the eye and ask him to spell out how Brexit could ever have benefited your communities.”^ []www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/mandrake-no-respect-for-christopher-booker-1-5937103 Gina Miller calls for remainers to attend leave march]]

lonelyplanetmum · 16/03/2019 09:31

Some of the twitter comments
" The only real link to March is that it is being held in the month after February and before April"

lonelyplanetmum · 16/03/2019 09:33

"BBC estimate 100 marchers. Even if they all paid 50quid Nige won't beat his MEP salary. "Best we stay in" he'll say."

" I've played gigs with bigger crowds than that, and our band was a bit shit (with apologies to former bandmates)"

"It is just like The famous Jarrow March, but without the people...or the marching"

1tisILeClerc · 16/03/2019 09:34

I think the political will of the UK needs to be separated from the 'wealth earning' aspects, certainly in terms of discussion of the future.
Politically there is no sign of the shitshow ever ending, that will rumble on for, well who knows.
In practical 'wealth' generation, I see the WA being passed and hopefully shortly after (within days) the likes of BMW/Nissan/Airbus would declare their plans and actually put them into action. BMW have said they would shutdown for a month. Distributing P45's during that month, even if it is just trimming to allow for 3 or 4 day working weeks would send a very strong message that stuff WILL happen.
We have speculated, up to 2 million could be affected. If the industry that has strongly suggested it will relocate actually happens it will be a massive blow, obviously, but it would be survivable IF the government acts promptly (Oh shit!) as they are at minimum semi skilled workers and although car assembly may well be over, as a mass activity in the UK, as semi skilled, retraining for (something) is practical. Identifying and putting a new activity that is not already covered in the world somewhere is of course a problem as if it is a 'me too' activity, it will have to be done better and cheaper than existing sources (ouch!).
With the numbers involved it would need government with deep pockets and the will to sort out a new activity for them. Track record suggests the wolves may be waiting unfortunately.

RedToothBrush · 16/03/2019 09:47

There is a remain counter protest at the march for leave.

OP posts:
TheElementsSong · 16/03/2019 09:58

Even a crash out won't teach a lesson. Nothing will

Agree with this. It's a pseudo-religious cult.

Without wishing to offend religious posters, it's like how the lack of reappearance of Christ after 2000 years hasn't dented the faith of believers that He will return, possibly imminently.

What I'm trying to say, badly and probably offensively (sorry!) is that it's pretty much the definition of "faith" that it withstands crude material objectivity.

2beesornot2beesthatisthehoney · 16/03/2019 10:00

Sorry trying to catch up. Have I missed what happened with ERG and DUP thoughts on Vienna Convention thing?

MsLucyLastic · 16/03/2019 10:10

I understand the desire to crash out, as a means of destroying right wing hubris. But would that not break the GFA? Peace in NI is not a price that we should pay, just to bring leaver arrogance down a peg or two.

prettybird · 16/03/2019 10:10

Been trying 4 times (supposedly successfully Confused) to post a long-ish post - just posting this short one to see if it will post Hmm

prettybird · 16/03/2019 10:10

Weird Confused

lonelyplanetmum · 16/03/2019 10:11

Good point Elements

prettybird · 16/03/2019 10:12

Longer post still refusing to post Confused

lonelyplanetmum · 16/03/2019 10:14

But would that not break the GFA? Peace in NI is not a price that we should pay, just to bring leaver arrogance down a peg or two.

Especially when, given the faith element, nothing would work.

prettybird · 16/03/2019 10:14

Talking about the glorious sterling, the risk is not just joining the Euro (which I'm not massively opposed to, as I remember the amount that we used to lose in exchange rate conversions when inter-railing round Europe at the end of Uni holidays yup, more evidence of being metropolitan elite Wink - including one time we had nothing to eat for 24 hours as we didn't have drachma left and were waiting for the ferry to Italy Sad; a tiny inconvenience compared to what industry used to face). Shock

TheElementsSong · 16/03/2019 10:14

www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/mar/15/i-feel-frustrated-mps-leave-edinburgh-and-hastings-reeling-over-brexit-commons-remain-leave

“They say no one voted to be poorer. Yes, we did. We were told we would be £30bn out of pocket and that every household would be £5,000 down and we still voted to leave. It’s a worthwhile sacrifice if it means regaining control.”

🙄 Of course, the strange thing about Leavers is that if somebody then suggests maybe they ought to volunteer to be the first for job losses, we get wailing about BullyingPunishmentWishingBadnessOnThem.

QueenOfThorns · 16/03/2019 10:15

Me too prettybird but I’ve given up. It was a miserable post anyway. At least Nige and his pals will get rained on, that cheers me up a bit!

prettybird · 16/03/2019 10:16

When Should Scotland achieve its independence, and withdraw its oil backing, as well as the money that the Scottish banks have lodged in the BoE (which is, after all, jointly owned by Scotland Wink ) in preparation for its own currency, then sterling would crash Sad Not saying that the Scottish currency would be stronger but at least it would have oil backing - but sterling would definitely be weakened. It's one of the reasons why retaining sterling was the preferred option in "Scotland's Future" as it would cause the least damage to both Scotland and rUK of the (iirc) five possible options that were mentioned as having been explored. Confused

FUKD would be well and truly fucked Sad

But of course it would just give the Brexiters another excuse to blame others - in this case the selfish and ungrateful Scots Hmm - for the damage to the economy that their own choices have brought about, rather than take any responsibility Angry

prettybird · 16/03/2019 10:16

Successfully posted in two halves SmileConfused

Swipe left for the next trending thread