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Brexit

Westminstenders: And I neeeedddd moreeeee timeeeeee!

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 14/03/2019 12:57

We need Time!
Its the one thing we don't have.

Todays vote is on extending a50.

To the displeasure of leavers, Bercow has selected amendments:

e) Corbyn Amendment
demands the government should “provide parliamentary time for this house to find a majority for a different approach”.

h) Wollaston Amendment
cross party amendment requesting to extend to allow the ability to legislate for a PV

i) Benn Amendment
cross party backbenchers take over parliamentary time from 20th March to find a majority way forward which gives justification for an extension

j) Bryant Amendment
prevents meaningful vote III

After yesterday's vote, May is left with effectively four options:

1) Pass the WA and go for a short technical extension.
An extension would have numbers in the HoC, but passing the WA is a struggle and it's reliant on the EU granting extension which is probably viable in this circumstances.

2) Be defeated getting the WA through and be forced into asking for a long extension as a result. This would include EP elections.
This option is politically toxic to the tories and its unlikely a long extension would pass the HoC. The EU would still need a justification for a long extension - a PV would be the natural option - but not clear if that could pass the HoC. Ditto passing legislation for EP elections. Whole scenario is unlikely

3) Be forced to revoke
Tory party big red button of self destruct

4) Actively decide to pursue an illegal no deal Brexit
Let's not think of the ramification

Going through this at speed, my initial reactions to this are:

If e) passes it doesn't really make much difference to May's choices here, but Labour might have more say.

If h) passes it might make 2) more likely

If i) passes it might open up alternative options

If j) passes we might have a real issue if its the only amendment that passes - it would leave a straight choice of Revoke or No Deal UNLESS i) passes as well.

But there might be other things that are not hitting me right in the face now.

As it stands, Hard Line Brexiteers were earlier today making noises that they would now support the WA - including whispers that this would include the DUP who would be likely to set off a chain reaction of support.

However which (if any) amendments pass today could well affect whether thats even a possibility.

As a result this vote needs to carry the health warning 'Be Careful what you wish for'. What you would LIKE might be extremely high risk and might jeapordise the main vote and the chances of an extension at all.

So whilst Leavers might be unhappy about the choices, it might well ultimately work best for No Dealers. Or it could be a gift for Remainers. Bercow's selections are not necessarily biased for this reason. He does not know the outcome here. If anything it looks like he's actually trying to put more options on the table for the house, rather than allow May to dictate to the house. Which is exactly what he should be doing. He's given parliament the power.

I suspect we will not fully understand what is going on tonight EVEN MORE than last night. And it will take a short while for everyone to calibrate what the eventual result actually is going to mean.

THIS is the most important vote yet. And it has the potential its going to end up m-e-s-s-y.

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Thread gallery
31
SingingBabooshkaBadly · 14/03/2019 18:31

Jesus wept. Jeremy Corbyn. What a useless, self-serving, hypocritical arse.

RedToothBrush · 14/03/2019 18:32

Benn amendment had 15 Tory rebels v 6 Labour rebels plus 3 ex Labour rebels and Lady Hermon.

Otherwise on party lines as you'd expected.

We avoided a dead heat by one person. That would have been interesting... Speakers vote.

I have a crazy desire to see a speakers vote before we are done with this, just for the shits and giggles.

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Tomtontom · 14/03/2019 18:33

The Tories have voted down the amendment that would have allowed parliament to take control of the process.

And when Corbyn voiced support for the people's vote, I swear Hammond mouthed "sod off".

The Tories don't give a fuck what any of the people want. I'm remain but am all up for compromise. But there's none. The world are laughing at us.

indistinct · 14/03/2019 18:33

@mnhq - why aren't these threads on top 5 trending? What's the algorithm?

DGRossetti · 14/03/2019 18:33

A lot of expensive business planning and stockpiling as requested by government up in smoke.

I wonder how many businesses will go under as a result of having spent the cash once they will need to spend again ?

RedToothBrush · 14/03/2019 18:33

Has everyone heard how Operation Stack has gone in Dover and Calais today...

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Wonnacott35 · 14/03/2019 18:34

No how's it gone?

MarshaBradyo · 14/03/2019 18:34

So delay to 30 June but only if May’s WA is approved?

BigChocFrenzy · 14/03/2019 18:35

Yes, it would be one for the history books if Bercow ever has the casting vote
(and he might need police protection for the rest of his life)

but in the interests of healing the country,
we need MPs to soon approve an option - any option - with a LARGE majority

Anything done on the back of a narrow margin will deepen the divide in the country

SeaSeasea · 14/03/2019 18:35

Thanks for explaining it!
Bercow is my mums MP, she wants a speakers vote on brexit as feel like her town never gets a say so the final vote might make up for some of that!

67chevvyimpala · 14/03/2019 18:36

The govt have been ignoring business and finance experts for months.

They don't care

Nishky · 14/03/2019 18:36

Have been at work today. Any chance of a quick recap of what’s happened?!

BigChocFrenzy · 14/03/2019 18:36

We've speculated why so many businesses have done no Brexit prepping
They bet on it not happening
Still very risky
but at least they won't be explaining to shareholders how they wasted money prepping

TheMostBoringPersonEver · 14/03/2019 18:37

Chances ofEU going if ffs and denying the extension?

hdh747 · 14/03/2019 18:38

Corbyn wants a PV if HE gets to give it to the people, he doesn't want to let the tories do it.

NoSixPlease · 14/03/2019 18:38

Have never watched so much BBC Parliament. So so frustrated and angry at the state of it all, I'll sure it's having a toll on my mental health.
So MV3 will be 25th March? Ridiculous.

TatianaLarina · 14/03/2019 18:40

operation stack on Kent live

BigChocFrenzy · 14/03/2019 18:41

There was a leaked EU memo discussing extensions, which I posted earlier:

Almost certainly the EU would grant an extension if we pass the WA, because they really want the WA

However, if it fails again on Wednesday they would probably insist on a longer extension, which the Uk msut justify with a plan, either for a PV or something else.

They definitely won't accept a series of short extensions - that would be terrible for business

icannotremember · 14/03/2019 18:42

The DUP and ERG are making noises today that suggests the WA has a chance next week. This has been May's best day in a long time.

I really do wish the PV amendment hadn't been moved today. I see why they did but I wish they hadn't done it.

borntobequiet · 14/03/2019 18:42

I thought that there might be a tie on the Benn amendment, what with the delay. But probably not a good time for a Speaker’s Vote...(if there’s ever a good time, except on something of little national importance).

BigChocFrenzy · 14/03/2019 18:43

Corbyn was forced by his party conference to pay lip service to a PV

However, he really doesn't want one - he is a lifelong Lexiter and wants Brexit

If he became PM, he would just try for the Brexit he wants, no PV

BigChocFrenzy · 14/03/2019 18:45

I expect another PV amendment if the WA fails again next week

  • and the prospect of that PV would probably keep most Tory Remainers voting down the WA
SingingBabooshkaBadly · 14/03/2019 18:48

So are they able to bring back a PV amendment at another time? Perhaps back to the idea of guaranteeing support for the WA if it then goes to a WA/Remain PV?

SingingBabooshkaBadly · 14/03/2019 18:49

Cross posts. Thanks BigChoc

Caucasianchalkcircles · 14/03/2019 18:49

So if there's going to be an extension does that mean we'll be subject to the new EU tax evasion rules ? Sorry if that's been asked already Smile