So May has lost the vote. Now what?!

[BIWI]

Lost it by a big margin - 391 to 242.

Please, God, that means we're nearer to staying in the EU.

I fear a 2nd referendum would lead to chaos, with a possible 2nd win for leave (and where would that put us?!)

Has no-one been listening to Question Time and interviews with 'the man on the street'?

Sadly, due to a total lack of political education in schools, and people having no idea how international trade works, people have unwittingly absorbed the garbage and lies spouted by the Brexiteers. I have no idea how anyone can make them see sense before they find out the reality. Warnings from businesses, financial institutions, sane politicians, balanced news programmes aren't having any effect. (Watch Margaret Beckett on QT last week giving a clear assessment of no deal, and then listen to the booing. ) Here's a very recent poll that shows what the majority of the great unwashed think:
Politico

What a state of affairs!

How would you define OK? This is a bit like Brexit means Brexit and I intend to make a success of it, from Mrs May.

Would you be happy to see the NHS sold off, and an American system introduced? I personally think it needs reform, but we are never given the option of looking at other systems say the German one to see whether that would work for us.

At the moment, it looks as though food standards will be watered down or scrapped if we are to deal with the American market. Is that OK? It would be the greatest pity IMO, because UK consumers have championed animal welfare and seen improvements.

I haven't seen anyone planning any major inward investment. I haven't seen anything which suggests that the north and south west will get a major boost any time soon.

It would be great if we really made a proper attempt to finance the NHS and train up sufficient of our own staff so that we don't need to take them from elsewhere, but there haven't been major attempts to do this. In fact the opposite might be argued - nursing and midwifery applications are down, because the bursaries were scrapped, tending to deter mature candidate.

Gut the media have been keen to show the leave voters overly represented since the result - they don't want to be seen as being in a bubble. This has meant you hardly ever hear remain POV on news/vox-pops as they never engage or go to remain areas.

BTW went to a talk on Victorian Punishment the other day. The Q&A session concentrated mainly on the death penalty - the views of the audience terrified me. All educated people...

QT has an editor who was known to be a UKIP supporter. A Remain voter might well choose a more balanced audience.

lonely, I get the point that vox pop/interviews take place in mainly leave areas, but they're not really difficult to find. You only have to go north, south, east and west of London.

Wrong bloody map appeared!!

That had me scratching my head!

I think the biggest issue is that a GE would likely see the Tory's stay in power because JC isn't getting in anytime soon or stepping down from Labour.
A people's vote is likely to see GB vote the same way again because as a nation we can't be fucking trusted so we'll end up in the same boat. The EU aren't going to let us dick around for ever!

The government needs to do their job and decide that we're not leaving and that's that. Then hold a GE based on that.

I hope that's right!
(Interesting comparison for voter expectation though!!)

The BBC, TV at least is for some reason concerned about 'ratings' as programme viewers determine the longevity of the programmes.
This has a knock on effect that they need, or feel the need to be entertaining rather than accurate and factual. European state broadcasters have far more programmes with political debate, usually 5 folk sitting around a table discussing things.
Having Farage on QT repeatedly with his two faced 'viewpoint', slagging off the EU while taking a large salary as an MEP being particularly awful. The fact he is a crap MEP makes it worse still.

Has this been posted?

www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/emily-maitlis-hailed-for-capturing-mood-of-the-nation-with-exasperated-sideeye-during-brexit-a4090081.html

I can't understand how anyone can be so insanely dogmatic? jingoistic? arrogant??? to believe that it's a good idea to put your country's trading relations, financial institutions, living standards, etc, etc, etc at risk!

I watched Emily Matlis. She showed more self restraint than I could have. Barry Gardiner is a wanker.

"Just to remind everyone @MissedTheBoatAgain hasn't lived in the UK or EU for 30 years. 🐝"

Don't forget the past where he thought Scotland was part of England

People airily talking about surviving rationing

Rationing was required because we had been at war

We are not at war. This situation is entirely of the UK govt’s own creation and it is within their power to stop it unilaterally. That is why no deal is actually immoral. No one is forcing us down this path of hardship and destruction but ourselves. It’s not honourable or a demonstration of British stiff upper lip or bravery - it is pure tantrum cutting off nose to spite face immorality. It is a demonstration of weakness not to say “this is too harmful to our populace, we will not continue” but instead to prepare for conditions that people liken to wartime when we are not at war and have no need to be

And I'm not sure remain can be confident that they'd get 66-75% of the result.

It doesn't work like that.

Basically, if you're ok in a given situation, you'd need a very good reason to move.
Say, your job is not ideal, but it's not that bad. Would you leave it without another job lined up, just for the sake of it? No. Only if you were extremely unhappy.

In the case of Brexit, the upheaval is (clearly) so great and it's so risky, that only a 2/3 majority in favour of Brexit (or an equivalent margin) should have been considered worth acting upon.

Yes. It's like having a political manifesto that says 'vote for us, and everything will get worse'. Who in their right minds would promote that idea, and who in their right minds would vote for it???!!!

Just to remind everyone @MissedTheBoatAgain hasn't lived in the UK or EU for 30 years. 🐝"

Don't forget the past where he thought Scotland was part of England

And let's not forget their belief that an agreement between 2 sovereign nations does not constitute an international agreement.

God yes, I wasn't implying it was worse to be inconvenienced! I just meant for most people it'll be a huge setback rather than the end of days. I can't imagine how scary it'll be for some people in the months ahead.

Sadly the leavers don't give a shit about who they destroy. They (or the thoughtless online clones at least) don't care at all.

In the case of Brexit, the upheaval is (clearly) so great and it's so risky, that only a 2/3 majority in favour of Brexit (or an equivalent margin) should have been considered worth acting upon.

Yes, and that's how the last vote should have been organised, but it wasn't. Therefore any second vote should be on the same basis otherwise it's not a level playing field.

I do believe that MissedTheBoatAgain has caught the ship back to Trollsville on a one way ticket

OK. But if remain wins but doesn't get the required number, does that mean we stay, or does the result of the previous vote overrule? Or, is it only leave which needs to get the required percentage to be able to win and have us leave?

I'm smashed off my face on codeine and not really clear-headed enough to make rational decisions at present!

No MTBA will be back again to troll and mansplain.

NoWordForFluffy

As it stands, any new referendum would be by simple majority.

We are talking how it should be and how it should have been. Ideally, a major change would only be accepted if a very large majority was in favour.
That's how it works in most Parliaments for things like Constitutional changes. It's mind boggling how it wasn't the same for the Brexit Referendum.