Westminstenders: Oh Look is that a fire in the Italian Capital?

[RedToothBrush]

Next stop: 27th Feb.

Where we will apparently have Cooper-Boles II which apparently will pass but still assumes that
a) the EU will grant us an extension despite our fuckwittery
b) that it will prevent accidental no deal, which it doesn't
c) glosses over the minor point that the only way to 100% prevent no deal is to say you'll revoke if everything else fails

Meanwhile in reality we leave in law on 29th March, despite the rest of the law having zero chance of being ready in time. Withdrawal Agreement and No Deal alike.

All that is actually happening is the Tories and Labour fighting amongst themselves. Corbyn is still pretending that Brexit isn't really that important and hoping it will just go away. May is still trying to compromise with the ERG - whom if you paying attention 18 months ago were obviously were never going to compromise on anything - cos they are fuckwitted swivel eyed loons.

Meanwhile the entire country has no other alternative but to assume no deal and act accordingly.

A deal on the 21st March (as is the planned date of the Meaningful Vote) is simply too late for planners. For them no deal has already happened even if it does never come to pass.

The strategy of brinkmanship has destroyed us. We just don't know it yet.

A Split in the Tory and Labour parties may well make matters even worse going forward with further political polarisation.

Where next for Brexit?

Who knows and does it even matter now? The damage is irreversible and will take at least a generation to heal wounds. Economically it may never be recoverable.

FUKD.

None that I can see yet Tonsilss

I did find an article about the march that mentioned that Ian Blackford would be joining the one in London.

But that's not to say that one might still in the planning stage for Glasgow or Edinburgh and just hasn't been announced yet.

Are there any regional marches?

General strikes are not (generally) effective - where I live now, there's a general strike a couple of times a year. All it means is that people get really good at stockpiling, pissed off at the people striking (more than at the government) and don't engage with what the strikers are demanding.

I know there isn't the same culture of general strikes in the UK, but there woul be so many different reasons for striking that the overall message of "What do we want?" would be so diluted it wouldn't resonate with MPs / others in power

A march is important, though, if only for the history books. Thinking about the Iraq War, history will note the significant public opposition, despite Parliamentary backing for military intervention.

I want to go on The March but it may not be possible. I shall donate in any case, in response to an email request today asking for donations.

I've decided to adopt 'Pragmatism, Resilience, Non-capitulation' as the slogan on my mental banner, and carry it in the forefront of my mind - and I thank the PPs who brought me those words.

With that in mind today I have begun to repot my indoor plants, sadly neglected over the past two years... at least I can give them hope for the future. It will make me feel good too. I suppose that's the resilience bit kicking in!

Pragmatism for me has come from the education and enlightenment received from reading these threads. And prepping to my needs.

Non-capitulation? I suppose nr1 and nr2 are paths to nr3

I hear some African Violets calling...

By 23rd March the supply chain will be starting to collapse
so it will be interesting to see what the mood of the country is

but remember

amendments are an utter waste of effort
they can achieve nothing

I want to March.

Not because it will change anything...I know it wont.

But for me its important my children know I tried.

The acceptance of defeat on this thread is making me sad.

March. You are against what is happening, so make that known. We live in interesting times, nothing is predictable. We all know that 29th March is not the end, whether it brings no deal, the WA, an extension... March so that after 29th March, the HoC takes whatever actions it takes with the knowledge that millions of us care very very much, enough to take to the streets and refuse to accept almost certain defeat. Be counted. Make a point. Refuse to he silenced. Please. You are incredibly decent people on this thread, intelligent and insightful and caring- I will be proud to stand with you and demand that we are heard.

The acceptance of defeat on this thread is making me sad.
Do not be sad.
Be angry.
Remind your MP that if they cause a hard Brexit they will be judged for the rest of their life and long into history.
Remind their party leader that causing / facilitating Brexit will be judged harshly.
And then press for Revoke
as that is the best option.

The marches are important to show the strength of feeling
Go for it ! 💪🏼

Even at that late stage, there is a v small chance that a large showing could e.g. give May the courage to put country before party.

I agree a strike is very unwise, since people really need to hang onto their jobs now

• that's an important part of prepping.

Revoke

Legal opinions agree that May does NOT need HoC assent,
because Revoking does not remove any rights from Uk citizens (that was why the courts ruled that invoking needed the HoC)

She only needs to send a letter to the EU stating that she Revokes
The EU have no power to refuse (ECJ ruled this)

Extension of A50 ?

Again, opinion is that she does not need the HoC for this
BUT
she needs unanimous consent of all 27 EU members
AND she risks badly splitting her party

The EU almost certainly would extend if they can see the point

• but they might set conditions

(I live in Germany, so I can at least report the political mood here and Brussels opinion is reported a lot here too)

• People's Vote

• EU almost certainly would grant an extension but might require No Deal to be excluded as an option, i.e. only Remain vs WA

• GE

• again they would BUT the UK would probably not ask:

the most likely reason to call a GE atm is to dissolve Parliament and run out the time If Corbyn / Labour consents, then May could announce on 27 Feb that she is calling a GE for 3 April after which Parliament would immediately be dissolved and could do nothing to stop No Deal.

• If the UK just wants to dither some more

• the EU may NOT extend, or at least for no longer than about 1 June, to avoid disrupting the MEP allocations / elections

Some members need extra time to their No Deal prepping, so that is the only reason 1 June is possible

PS I have put the date of the march into my diary and I have nothing else booked that weekend

Extension if time is needed for WAIB

Absolutely certain the EU would extend for this

Merkel would go full blast for it, but in fact there would not be any dissenters
All want to avoid No Deal
and 3 months extension would be a totally minor concession

WAIB ?

I was very proud of the six members of my family who went on the last march. I'd like to go on this one and think they'd all go too but I do wonder how many marchers it would take to make the Parliament or the Government take notice?

They seemed to ignore the 700,000 who marched last time, possibly beacause they were peaceful, good natured and law-abiding. They paid more attention to 100 or so pro-brexit thugs shouting oscenities, attacking policemen and threatening to kill MPs.

Over 1 million peaceful demonstrators marched to protest against us being involved in the Iraq war and that was ignored too.

I am writing to my MP but he is a pro-brexit Tory who says most of his postbag is from leavers (and he may in this instance be telling the truth). What more can we do?

The ever excellent Dateline London, presented by the ever excellent Carrie Gracey. Trump and Brexit - specifically Corbyn and Brexit (hence the presence of Owen Jones, challenged ably at times on Brexit by Bronwen Maddox). As always very useful insights from American and European journalists.
www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b0c3j762/dateline-london-16022019

Yaralie
I am writing to my MP but he is a pro-brexit Tory who says most of his postbag is from leavers (and he may in this instance be telling the truth). What more can we do?
Remind him that if his actions make people poorer, they will not forgive him ....

If Corbyn / Labour consents, then May could announce on 27 Feb that she is calling a GE for 3 April
after which Parliament would immediately be dissolved and could do nothing to stop No Deal.

Surely TM would give the WA another try in the Hoc before dissolving parliament and undersigning No Deal? Why would she do otherwise? Genuine question

WAIB - Withdrawal Act Implementation Bill

Why would she do otherwise?

A fit of pique? She does seem like a woman who can get herself into a snit if she's challenged.

Surely TM would give the WA another try in the Hoc before dissolving parliament and undersigning No Deal? Why would she do otherwise? Genuine question

She might feel that losing a vote on the WA for a third time would be more embarrassing than calling a GE. If she knows the WA won't pass than why bother having another vote?

I don't think she will call a GE. I think she'll just let the clock tick but it's and option if she felt that there was a real chance that brexit might be stopped and she was determined that wouldn't happen

Thanks Solewindow :)

That would be tyrannical to say the least. I suppose it'd be naive to rule it out

Science and innovation.

www.independent.co.uk/voices/brexit-no-deal-science-erc-funding-scientists-eu-dominic-raab-a8783166.html

Given that the future of the UK’s economy should lie in jobs from science, innovation and technology, Brexit is clearly undermining the very fabric of our future wealth, before we even start the thing.

And Airbus again.

www.politico.eu/article/brexit-airbus-katherine-bennett-warns-of-catastrophic-no-deal-brexit/

As said, striking is the wrong thing to do, whatever you do needs to be targeted at the right people and cause. Some companies may feel they have to move to the EU to continue profitably but employers are not a monolithic block and many won't want to have to move as they obviously have families too.
Maybe some of you could write to Kenneth Clarke MP and other MPs who are strong Europhiles and ask what actions could be taken. KC has 'resigned' himself to leaving unfortunately but he is one with a pragmatic outlook. There is a Tory MEP that is probably good too but I forget his name.
Even contacting Mr Barnier or others in Europe. They are of course fully aware of the situation, and far more of course as they have been party to all the UK gov discussions and read all the press. Hate to think of what they make of the Express and Fail!

www.theguardian.com/business/2019/feb/16/flybmi-collapses-blaming-brexit-uncertainty