Westministenders: A Special Place in Hell

[RedToothBrush]

A quick start to a new thread (as I've not been paying attention this evening!).

May is looking to ditch the Malthouse Compromise. Cos its so rubbish.

The ERG look like they are splitting over it anyway.

Up to sixty Labour MPs could back the WA.

Half the ERG plus Labour Leave Rebels could be enough to get the WA over the line.

Donald Tusk, makes controversial comment by more or less stating the obvious.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/3492426-Westministenders-Abbreviation
Guide to Brexit Abbreviations and Terms

hey all, we should reset our mn passwords www.mumsnet.com/Talk/site_stuff/3501489-Ive-just-logged-into-someone-elses-account-using-my-own-details?watched=1&msgid=84760380#84760380

Just watching sky. Apparently there are cars being loaded onto container ships and no one knows what tariff or quota they will be imported under when they get to their destination just after 29/3. Yet the arch brexiteer is completely relaxed about it all. Twat.

Not so much brexit keeping me awake, but DS who is not sleeping properly at all and the realisation that now he's not going back to school I am going to be looking after him 24/7 for the next 18 months.

LOn top of that now last year's GCSE results have been crunched my dds school is apparently one of the worst in the UK. And overlying that is fucking brexit and the thought that a good education is going to be more important than ever so she can escape.

So a bit brexit. It's like a filthy layer of grime clinging to everything else you're worried about and making it worse.

That Bercow clip from twitter posted by RosaPalma just made my morning.

I can only liken what's happening now with the phoney war.

I was thinking that yesterday destiel. 50 days to go and they're still fighting like rats in a sack. I think we will no deal by 'accident' now.

Glad to do my bit BiglyBadgers

This sums up the EU in a nutshell.

What kind of language is that to use? May be its because panic is setting in across the EU. They know they will not survive without UK. They know almost all its members have debt levels far exceeding that set in the Maastricht treaty.

Germany, the only powerhouse left, starting to see retraction in economy especially its exports. Social issues across the continent as people demand something more than a collection of self serving politicians rinsing countries for their own gain.

The global economy super bubble is coming to a head and Britain will be hit hard, but the EU will collapse, its a mathematical certainty.

Thats what this psychopath, the mainstream media and assortment of establishment shills and ruthless political careerists don’t want us the public to know. People need to concentrate less in following media BS and politician rhetoric and more time getting themelves in the strongest position possible to weather the coming storm.

The global economy super bubble is coming to a head and Britain will be hit hard, but the EU will collapse, its a mathematical certainty.

Citation needed

Calming cat pictures

Beautiful @prettybird . My cat still has an important thing to say about the whole blinking shit show.

Is this a new flavour of chipolata I see before me?

What kind of language is that to use? May be its because panic is setting in across the EU. They know they will not survive without UK.

I'm glad we haven't lost our sense of humour and can make jokes like that :)

Going back to how do you protect your savings in a no deal scenario, am I better off having shares than cash in a savings account? When governments have frozen accounts in other countries, is that just what people have been holding as actual money?

The problem is under emergency powers, that's nothing you can do except hold gold. Accounts can be frozen, and cash simply made obsolete by introducing new notes - making any held useless.

I'd be surprised if account freezing can be particularly granular, so at least there will be the knowledge that while you can't get your money, your landlords bank can't accept it either.

But if things got that bad, money - or lack thereof - really will be the last thing on your mind.

Well that was fun after the forced password reset...

It took me AGES to get the email through.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/site_stuff/3501489-Ive-just-logged-into-someone-elses-account-using-my-own-details?pg=1
Thread to explain if anyone is locked out wondering wtf happened.

Sounds like a security breech of some sort. Not cool.

Mine is sticking his tongue out at Brexiteers. He is particularly concerned about security of electricity supply because he's protective of "his" radiator ...but would be very interested in entering into a trade deal over fishing.

(not sure how a post got revived - but I was forced to login again ?)

@RedToothBrush @BigChocFrenzy @DGRossetti and all those who are following this closely in the UK, can I ask you where Keir Starmer has gone?

TL;DR - who cares ? It's become apparent that no matter how well intentioned his reasoning and actions are, they're like farting in a hurricane.

My view is we are headed for no deal with the tiniest nod that the closer we get, the chances of revoke might increase. But bear in mind a thousand times fuck all is still pretty close to fuck all. All we are seeing happen is the increased pressure of time causing more and more leaks and rivets popping in the Good Ship Brexit as more and more things that weren't even in view 3 months ago are starting to look like rocks. The US news on "No GFA, no trade deal with us" for a start.

I'm still punting that Trump will happily screw the Brexiteers over and suddenly declare the UK an idiot nation for leaving the EU - after all, what use is it to the US now ? He'd have the perfect reason for changing his mind too: he never believed the UK would make such a horlicks of it. Bearing in mind Theresa May ignoring his "advice" would provide a bulletproof justification to the Trump faithful.

labourlist.org/2019/02/what-corbyns-five-demands-mean-for-labour-and-the-future-of-brexit/

Jo Maugham QC @JolyonMaugham
This, from @siennamarla, is a good, balanced piece on Corbyn's letter. The most important thing about it is what it doesn't say: that free movement must end.

Pippa Crerar @PippaCrerar
Significant development last night from ⁦*@jeremycorbyn*⁩: formally offering Labour’s support to get Theresa May’s Brexit deal through in return for customs union arrangement. 1/3

Will be privately welcomed in No 10 because it helps them put the screws on the Brexiteer Tories. “If you don’t back May’s Brexit, you’ll end up with a softer one altogether”. 2/2

But already causing some anxiety among Remainy Labour MPs and the membership, who fear Corbyn facilitating a Tory Brexit. (Reality is, Labour leadership knows that PM can’t agree) 3/3

And finally - it will bolster cross-party backbench MPs like @LucyMPowell & @NickBoles who have been calling for something similar. Early indications from Labour leadership are that they would be supportive of a backbench push for this outcome.

Labour HQ clearly a bit panicked by reaction from MPs/ members to Brexit letter - am hearing a letter from Jeremy Corbyn will be sent out to members shortly that makes clear a second referendum is still on the table, as per party policy.

can I ask you where Keir Starmer has gone

Holiday?

No idea.

They are running out of time for another referendum. That ship has pretty much sailed. It's WA or No Deal. Theresa May is running down the clock and Labour has nothing to add. The five demands are as meaningless as the six tests nonsense. FOM will only go with WA or no deal. That's it, at this point.

But already causing some anxiety among Remainy Labour MPs and the membership, who fear Corbyn facilitating a Tory Brexit.

We return to Tusks forensic analysis yesterday. Remains a dead duck and has no validity anymore.

What was it from Fawlty Towers ?

We'll deal with this first ... and the sackings later

For now MPs will have to clean up their own mess. Reckoning will have to wait.

Isn't Keir Starmer supposed to be meeting with David whatsisname the deputy PM today?

PMK 👑

So, assuming we drop into no deal territory ... there's obviously the exponential chaos that will need to be tamed ... probably a year or more before the UK can look like a functioning state again. Once we've secured food, medicines, energy and security, what's the first order of the day ? Presumably settling the NI lack of border issue, since without that nailed down in law or treaty, no trade deals anyway ?

Meantime the EUs timetable continues as indicated ... so what changes are coming down the line that could affect negotiations 2020-2022 ? Following the news that airline ownership needs to be settled, are there any other areas where the EU feels control needs to be in EU jurisdiction ?

It's all very well to laugh at the Brexiteer lack of planning leading to their beloved Brexit being spiked. But it's no excuse for people who do have working brains to make the same mistake.

Talk of rotting food at Calais is hysterical: instead, no deal would see the EU calmly dismantle Britain’s industries over time

Instead, the EU’s response to a no deal will be strategic: opening up advantage, sector by sector, calmly and patiently dismantling the UK’s leading industries over the course of a decade. They will eat the elephant one bite at a time. The problem with abandoning the rules of the international order is that you no longer enjoy their protection.

A no-deal Brexit would hand the EU enormous power: it would decide how and when to introduce new frictions between the UK and the single market, giving sufficient time for firms like Airbus, Nissan or AstraZeneca to relocate production. As recent decisions have demonstrated, even seemingly fixed capital investment is more mobile than many Brexiters imagine.

The EU would set out a timeline over which it would introduce compliance and rules of origin checks on the UK’s most competitive exporting sectors. It is not hard to imagine checks on automotive parts from 2021, pharmaceuticals from 2022 and aerospace from 2023, alongside constantly shifting sands of equivalence for financial services. This would allow firms an orderly departure from the UK to the single market. It will be a steady drift away from the UK, not an avalanche. Moreover, the absence of any agreement would mean lasting uncertainty that would deter future investment. The UK is particularly exposed in this regard: our serious lack of competitiveness is demonstrated by persistently large trade deficits. This means the UK is heavily reliant on foreign investment – the “kindness of strangers” – which would likely collapse. It is not hard to imagine a future government going cap in hand to the IMF for a bailout.

Those same Brexiters who have marched from failure to failure with no loss of enthusiasm still bizarrely believe that the UK could pocket the £39bn divorce bill while pursuing trade deals around the world. Yet the EU would, calmly and rationally, place tariffs on UK trade until it had collected what it is owed. And the damage to trade with the single market could not be replaced by new trade deals – in addition to the EU27, the UK has the benefits of trade deals with 40 other countries through the EU, all of which would evaporate overnight in no deal. That requires 67 deals to be signed just to stand still.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/feb/07/no-deal-brexit-medieval-siege-eu-britain-industries

Sounds pretty reasonable. And scary.

PMK after relogging in.