Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Brexit

Westministenders: May dug a deep stinky hole and UK politics has tumbled in

999 replies

BigChocFrenzy · 16/01/2019 15:17

May almost certainly won't resign even after this huge defeat.

She's survived umpteen other humiliating defeats.
Her record strongly suggests she'll cling on to office with broken fingernails until Brexit (or Revoke) happens

After the ERG failed to topple her last month, she can legally stay as Tory party leader at least until December.
Besides, would any of her likely successors as Tory Party leader - Leadsome, Boris, JRM, Gove - be any better ... or bring even worse horrors ?

Corbyn has called a No Confidence vote
NC debate to be held at 7pm today.

He'll lose, because the DUP and the ERG - who voted down her WA - have genuine Confidence in her, of course 🤔

The Labour Party conference agreed their policy would be to get a GE, but failing that to go for a PV.
However, Corbyns latest statement is still against a PV
Will he finally give in, or try to out-stubborn May ?

The HoC doesn't want No Deal - but can't yet agree what they do want.
if they and / or May don't specifically choose something else, then No Deal is what automatically happens

May had told the cabinet she'd just keep pushing the WA, but it's now a dead parrot of a WA.

So she's "reaching out" to the other parties whom she's rudely rejected for the last 2.5 years
Maybe ongoing cross-party talks will ignore her and succeed on agreeing a new approach
BUT
The EU have said they will only renegotiate if the UK drops some of its red lines
Otherwise it's either this unchange WA or No Deal

Many analysts think this impasse means that May will have to ask the EU for an A50 extension.
She keeps saying she won't delay Brexit - but after she became PM she kept denying she'd hold a GE, right up until she announced it.

EU officials have hinted they would extend until the end of June.
However, an extension would have to be unanimously approved.
Would any of the 27 countries veto, in exasperation with the UK's ridiculous performance the last 2 years ?

I know on Westministenders we're all exasperated with it !

OP posts:
Thread gallery
20
RedToothBrush · 17/01/2019 12:49

Just a reflection on the news from Williamson and the army reserves

From july
www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-politics-45007787?__twitter_impression=true
No 10 deny plan for Army role in 'no deal' Brexit

However No 10 dismissed newspaper reports that the Army might be called in to ensure food and medical supplies are maintained in more remote communities.

A spokesman said: "This is about putting in place sensible preparations in the unlikely event of no deal."

"There are no plans to involve the Army. I don't know where that speculation came from."

Motheroffourdragons · 17/01/2019 12:52

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ to protect the privacy of the user.

lonelyplanetmum · 17/01/2019 12:52

Take it we've seen this..

That's €50 m the French have had to commit to just this week.
Hopefully income from the businesses fleeing to Paris will compensate a bit.

Who'd be our neighbours by choice eh? It would take a lot of political promises of the hands of Prince George, Charlotte and Prince Louis of Remain to repair this damage. (Plus of course no French royals left to start arranging nuptials with.)

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jan/17/france-triggers-50m-contingency-plan-in-case-of-no-deal-brexit?CMP=sharebtnn_tw

RedToothBrush · 17/01/2019 12:52

Derxa my suggestion for plan B may soon be to lock all the MPs in the main chamber without food, water and toilets and to keep them in until they agree on something. Anything.

thecatfromjapan · 17/01/2019 12:54

Grieve's tabled a second referendum bill.

I guess we'll find out where Corbyn's colours are now.

OhLookHeKickedTheBall · 17/01/2019 12:54

My MP once said that he didn't think people wanted facts before. Bet he's regretting that now as the people in his constituency are angry he voted against brexit now (or in reality against the wa because he's a big no dealer, but people don't want those facts). Not heard so much visceral anger towards him ever. It's not just online either, lots of people about actually talking about it today. Which is why I am not fully convinced a people's vote is the answer to this mess.

derxa · 17/01/2019 12:57

Derxa my suggestion for plan B may soon be to lock all the MPs in the main chamber without food, water and toilets and to keep them in until they agree on something. Anything. Good idea. Or threaten them all with no salary/mandatory deselection if no consensus is reached.
I think a lot of them are thriving on the drama and love posturing on the media.

thecatfromjapan · 17/01/2019 12:59

Well, as Macron has pointed out, there is no easy answer to this mess.

There isn't.

And politicians and media have lied, appeased and placated for 2 years in an effort to find an easy way out.

They should have told people the truth: Brexit is a fantasy. People have been lied to.

They still aren't telling people the truth.

So there is no easy way out of this mess.

PestymcPestFace · 17/01/2019 13:04

Derxa my suggestion for plan B may soon be to lock all the MPs in the main chamber without food, water and toilets and to keep them in until they agree on something. Anything.

Yep, how many people need to go and surround the House to ensure this happens?
Would a couple of million suffice?

1tisILeClerc · 17/01/2019 13:11

twitter.com/tagesschau/status/1085610253922828289
Taken from the guardian clip above. Worth a minute to watch.

lonelyplanetmum · 17/01/2019 13:12

Grieve's tabled a second referendum bill.

That man seems like a lone voice in the wilderness. I'm writing to thank him and I don't even want a PV in case it has no deal on it.

As there's not even agreement about whether TM and JC can appear on TV or whether to meet now at all, how on earth would the remit of a PV be decided anyway.

Westministenders: May dug a deep stinky hole and UK politics has tumbled in
1tisILeClerc · 17/01/2019 13:14

{Derxa my suggestion for plan B may soon be to lock all the MPs in the main chamber without food, water and toilets and to keep them in until they agree on something. Anything.}
I suggested this a while back, a bit like selecting a new pope, wait for the colour of the smoke.

DGRossetti · 17/01/2019 13:14

Maybe the one thing that matters ...

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46891187

The housing market outlook over the next three months is the worst for 20 years, surveyors say.

A net balance of 28% of Royal Institution of Chartered Surveyors (RICS) members expect sales to fall in the next three months.

It's the most downbeat reading since records started in October 1998 and the pessimism is blamed on the lack of clarity around Brexit.

Lack of supply and affordability also continued to affect the market.

Sales expectations for the next three months are now either flat, with no change predicted, or negative, indicating falling sales, across all parts of the UK, the report said.

(contd).

Oh dear. Oh dear. Oh dear. How will the Mail spin this ?

PestymcPestFace · 17/01/2019 13:15

Machiavellianism and Brexit
A Cabinet Office source tells me today No. 10 is considering agreeing a second referendum with three choices: No Deal Brexit, May’s Deal or No Brexit. It would be by alternative vote, ie you rate your preferences 1, 2. The thinking is that the first round might go No Deal 23, May’s Deal 37, No Brexit 40. The second round would then go May’s Deal 60, No Brexit 40.
www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2019/01/machiavellianism-and-brexit

May will only agree to a second ref when she has found a way to win it.

1tisILeClerc · 17/01/2019 13:16

The other would be to lock them all in and throw the key away, forge Mrs Mays signature and send it to Brussels then carry on but have a publicity campaign to say that we have left the EU.

bellinisurge · 17/01/2019 13:18

Dear Cabinet Office. I'd vote No Brexit and because I'm a good citizen I'd put WA as second. That's it.
Saved you the bother of asking me to do so in an advisory referendum.

DGRossetti · 17/01/2019 13:20

Tory voters: are you happy with your purchase

MarshaBradyo · 17/01/2019 13:21

I know it’s media catnip but still Govt calls up British Army reservists to help prepare for No Deal

Cailleach1 · 17/01/2019 13:22

Rafals

The house may have voted it’s confidence in her but 117 of those votes didn’t have confidence in her last month.

That is a very interesting point. The ERG and fellow travellers have said people got to vote once on leaving the EU, and insinuate it is not democratic for another vote. Ignoring that a PV would be on the detail or type of Brexit, which was absent in the 2016 referendum.
Yet those 117 voted no confidence in May recently and have just voted again in a vote of no confidence. By their own propaganda, it is undemocratic that they got a second bite at the cherry. They even completely change their vote in such a short timeframe. Are they no confidence Regretters?
They really are hypocritical effers.

IsobelKarev · 17/01/2019 13:28

That man seems like a lone voice in the wilderness. I'm writing to thank him and I don't even want a PV in case it has no deal on it.

I liked the way he came across on Newsnight last night. Clearly stating that his amendments are about Parliamentary process rather than simply trying to get his own way. By comparison with other politicians I've heard speak, he came across as very calm and measured. I think that in an MP.

QueenMabby · 17/01/2019 13:31

Email to MP sent:

I have watched with a growing sense of horror parliament (and more particularly the executive branch of government) fail, yet again, to tackle the Brexit crisis.

The Prime Minister has shown herself to be both clueless and intransigent over the issue and it is now time that those parliamentarians (on both sides of the House) who care about the fate of the British people and the British economy step up and lead the way out of this mess.

The Prime Minster's party politicking and refusal to compromise and negotiate risks leading this country over the cliff edge.

It is my understanding that there is a majority in Parliament who agree that a no-deal Brexit would be a disastrous course to take and so priority must be given to removing no-deal from the table. As I am sure all MPs are aware, no-deal is this country's default position as we currently stand, unless action is taken to change that. Allowing Mrs May to use no-deal as a stick to beat half of her party, a carrot to entice the rest and a red flag to wave at the EU is preventing meaningful negotiation and compromise. By removing no-deal as an option this will allow a cross-party group of MPs to hopefully agree a position whereby we can move forward. It is naive in the extreme to believe that the EU do not have a very good idea of our options so I cannot see that taking no-deal out of the equation would prejudice our negotiating position as the EU has (very rightly in my opinion) been firm in its refusal to offer the UK more than what is already contained within the Withdrawal Agreement.

Should agreement not be possible, then the only rational option would be to require Mrs May to revoke Article 50 to avoid plunging this country into chaos.

Please use your vote in the coming weeks to help prevent a no-deal Brexit. MPs must now put country before party (it was putting party before country that got us into this mess in the first place!) and put an end to this national crisis.

I’ll report back IF I get a response.

jasjas1973 · 17/01/2019 13:31

Apologies if posted before, i think as this mess goes on, the polls are going to keep going toward remain - a customer of mine, hard core Leaver, told me today he wants a revoke as we've no idea what we want, a minority no doubt but i was shocked.

Remain 48%
Leave 38%
Don't knows 6%
No vote 7%

yougov.co.uk/topics/brexit/survey-results

DGRossetti · 17/01/2019 13:34

Notice how that YouGov survey had "no vote" as well as "don't know" ....

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 17/01/2019 13:39

Laura Kuenssberg
‏*@bbclaurak*
MPs who have been in talks this morning on different sides both seem to feel they have been listened to (so far)
But is there compromise on the way? Rumours govt working on customs union by another name BUT eurosceptics feel strongly reassured by PM this morning she absolutely won’t move to customs union as she knows it would ‘send party into flames’ one MP says -
Anyone would think that there are two things going on here - PM talking to Leavers and trying to reassure them, and other members of govt trying to make remainers and opposition feel their ideas might have a role
Remember there are physically two sets of conversations - PM seeing Brexiteers and DUP in No 10 , And Lidington, Barwell and Gove seeing the rest metres away in 70 Whitehall

LouiseCollins28 · 17/01/2019 13:40

@QueenMabby thanks for sharing your letter. I hope you have a non Conservative MP if you have repeated the Labour "attack lines" in your letter. Just IMO, I also really don't like it when people present "their" solution as the "only rational" outcome

Swipe left for the next trending thread