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Brexit

Westminstenders: What The Hell Happens Next?!

996 replies

RedToothBrush · 09/01/2019 14:14

John Bercow has just spent over at an hour dealing with a Points of Order, in which he has argued that he is defending the soverignty of the House of Commons and that is his duty, not to simply to be a cheerleader for the executive.

Taking back control seems to have rather upset ERG Brexiteers.

As Jess Phillips astutely pointed out:
"People only care about procedures, and protecting and conserving the procedures, when they don't like the outcome of the thing that is about to happen and never when it is going in their favour."

And given what we have seen the Executive do over the last few months in terms of trying to use procedure for its own political gain, this is quite a fair point.

There are however certain constitutional questions this is all raising. And we have a very real constitutional crisis here.

Bercow has ruled that he CAN allow an amendment (because the previous vote had prevented only a motion and a debate) put forward by Grieve to go to a vote.

This amendment would - if it is passed by the house - require May to report to the house within 3 days if the WA fails to pass next week.

This would be a significant victory, if it passed because at present the position is where May can delay reporting back to the house until it start to get to the point where politically the opposition can't influence things, and a 'meaningful vote' will in practice be more like a gun to the head by the Executive, rather than the House of Commons acting in a sovereign manner and being free to make its own decisions rather than be forced into a corner by Parliamentary Procedure and the politicking of Parliamentary Procedure to undermine the independence of the HoC.

Allowing more time for the opposition to hold the government to account, does not necessarily change anything. It just means the executive can not just run down the clock in the way it perhaps has been intending.

The HoC could of course, vote against the amendment.

The WA is to come to the HoC next week.

And we have no idea what the hell is going to happen next.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
34
borntobequiet · 12/01/2019 15:05

The Northern Ireland Sec barely knows where it is.
I expect she also thinks there’s a country called Southern Ireland as well.

BigChocFrenzy · 12/01/2019 15:06

Welsh party leader [Plaid] calls for Celtic political union

but he calls for it after Brexit and to include Ireland - not sure how that would work

https://www.rte.ie/news/2019/0110/1022489-welsh-party-leader-calls-for-celtic-political-union/

1tisILeClerc · 12/01/2019 15:17

{The Northern Ireland Sec barely knows where it is.
I expect she also thinks there’s a country called Southern Ireland as well.}
My point would be that following that admission she knew little about NI months ago that she would be ejected promptly and be replaced by someone who knows the intricacies of NI thoroughly particularly as NI is one of the bigger sticking points of this whole mess.

nicoala1 · 12/01/2019 15:41

Who would negotiate a Trade Deal with Britain now after this total mess of non negotiation, changing the goal posts, procrastination, stubborness, utter futile requests and so on. I am totally bemused by it all, if it wasn't such a serious matter for all of us.

I am equally baffled at those MPs who are insisting that No Deal is what they want either and will therefore vote against the WA. Can anyone explain their thinking on that one?

Hazardswan · 12/01/2019 15:52

Yes to change, no to brexit

remain employed, remain healither, remain in EU

Remain with freedom

Only the bastards want Brexit

BigChocFrenzy · 12/01/2019 15:58

Farage: ‘We're reactivating the people’s army’: inside the battle for a hard Brexit

While May & the HoC have been farting around ...
Guess who's been filling the vacuum:

www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jan/12/were-reactivating-the-peoples-army-inside-the-battle-for-a-hard-brexit

With Westminster gridlocked, Nigel Farage has spent the past four months mobilising his troops at Leave Means Leave rallies around the country
....
It is packed with more than a thousand people, most of them middle-aged and elderly

wherearemychickens · 12/01/2019 16:08

I still like 'Bin Brexit; Fix Britain' - I like that it acknowledges there are problems in this country that need sorting out, and would lead to discussion during any campaign of those issues and how they might be addressed practically if we're not spending hundreds of millions on a disastrous Brexit.

wherearemychickens · 12/01/2019 16:14

What people were voting for was change - the positive possibilities for that need to be highlighted, once we have a stable background economy again.

I do so wish Labour had David Lammy as leader. I came across this video the other day of an amazing street theatre production in London called the Sultan's Elephant in 2006 and he has a small cameo from when he was Minister for Culture. This is the country I would like back:

Icantreachthepretzels · 12/01/2019 16:18

I like all of those Hazardswan - thought the last one might be a bit contentious. Sounds good, though - emblazoned across pictures of JRM, Bojo and Farage. very fitting.

Quietrebel · 12/01/2019 16:18

Brexit Breaks It, Remain & Fit It

Quietrebel · 12/01/2019 16:18

Typo: Fix It

Hazardswan · 12/01/2019 16:29

I like the acknowledging one's to. It's lying to say all is well, there's plenty that needs changing it's just not our EU status! Parliament is divided, barking and breaking people.

pretzels Grin I'd loved to tattoo it on their heads.

1tisILeClerc · 12/01/2019 16:34

BCF
You should have put a warning on that guardian article, I feel sick now.

LonelyandTiredandLow · 12/01/2019 16:35

Remain: the only clear choice. Remain: our promises haven't changed. Remain in control. Let's take our country back.

Totally agree with you 're Lammy. I think he should start a cross party remain party. Loved that clip. Actually made me well up seeing everyone smiling, such a rare occurrence these days.

DGRossetti · 12/01/2019 16:38

Just seen that Lord Hattersley has called for a second referendum, www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46851664

Now, it's not from ill feeling, but the first thought I had reading that was "Oh, I thought he died a while back."

WickedGoodDoge · 12/01/2019 16:46

Ian Murray is also calling for a second referendum. He’s the Labour MP for Edinburgh South (I think that’s what it’s called- not my MP but close by) and despite not being a Labour voter, I quite like him. He’s always very measured and doesn’t fling mud.

nicoala1 · 12/01/2019 16:51

So what happens if a second ref = Leave again? What questions will be asked on the ballot paper? I am wary myself. Just think nefarious influences and money etc. could keep the status quo.

Bit of a gamble there, but does push the boat out for a bit of time I suppose.

1tisILeClerc · 12/01/2019 16:52

Something serious needs to happen to stop the lies being broadcast by Farage and he has to explain (if possible) how the people without decent jobs and all the 'ills' that we are talking about here WILL be addressed by whichever party he is promoting.

DGRossetti · 12/01/2019 16:59

In the absence of revoking Brexit, I think my next vote will go to the part which makes a manifesto pledge to introduce legislation designed to make it practically impossible to ever hold another national referendum. On anything.

If people want something so bad they can either vote for a candidate prepared to work towards that in parliament or STFU.

June 2016 was nothing to do with "democracy" and everything to do with odious little shits like Farage being able to circumvent it with the threat of the bully boy. And shame on Cameron for being so spinless as to invite it in. In a century, I can see him being called the English Hindenburg - although (sadly) not because he perished in a fire. Although I guess there's still time.

DGRossetti · 12/01/2019 17:00

Something serious needs to happen to stop the lies being broadcast by Farage

Maybe something 9mm wide Hmm ?

RedToothBrush · 12/01/2019 17:05

Caroline Lucas was an independent who happened to be in the Green Party rather than the leader of the Green party. She had and has no idea about anything beyond her own agenda. As an independent she fantastic and that's carried the Green Party.

But I don't believe you can be an MP and leader a party that operates on such a volunteer basis as the greens which has the flat leadership structure it does. There is only goodwill rather than proper structure and there is a point at which cooperatives and organic organisations without a proper hiaranchy reach an unmanageable level where accountability fails and mob rule effectively takes over through a numbers game.

OP posts:
thecatfromjapan · 12/01/2019 17:08

Has everyone already seen the story that one of the security services wanted to launch an investigation of Aron Banks during the Referendum - but was over-ruled by May?

It broke in November.

Theresa May STOPPED security services probing Arron Banks in run-up to Brexit referendum - as ex-Culture Secretary says PM 'has serious questions to answer'
By Richard Pendlebury for the Daily Mail and Joe Middleton For Mailonline

thecatfromjapan · 12/01/2019 17:08

Sorry, I couldn't do a link on my phone for some reason. But you can find it with the headline in a search engine.

DGRossetti · 12/01/2019 17:10

Anyone who wants an idea what a no-deal Brexit might look like, can always study the US from afar.

www.theregister.co.uk/2019/01/11/government_shutdown_security/

is a bit techy, but lifts the veil on a tiny idea of what can happen when government agencies are paralysed.

nicoala1 · 12/01/2019 17:12

Would be funny and interesting to see James O'Brien and Nigel Farage debating on LBC. Ha Ha.