The Brexit Arms

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This may be the last Brexit Arms thread that I will host.

It was intended to be a non-partisan and relatively light hearted thread for posters on both sides of the divide, but unfortunately this seems to have proved impossible so far.

It is not supposed to be a place for the disgruntled Remainer to use as an outlet to abuse and kick out at their perceived enemy.

I will give it one last go in the hope that things will change.

So.... onwards to Brexit....

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gardengeek I get what you're saying but in your examples everyone is striving for the same thing and will move hell and high water to achieve it.

We have done absolutely jack shit towards any kind of virtual border or other solution because we're still operating under the cake and eat it plan.

I looked at the examples in the report Faith refers to

I noted that the report was authored by an industry expert in Sweden/Norway customs.

I saw that Sweden/Norway was listed as the global best example of a smart border.

And then Faith, I googled and I found this

www.google.be/amp/s/www.politico.eu/article/brexit-ireland-border-customs-norway-sweden/amp/

This is one of the most interesting bits:

"In a report earlier this year based on a survey of 2,000 Swedish companies, the Swedish National Board of Trade said respondents identified customs as the main problem hampering trade with Norway."

Ah, here's another:

"Norway has the closest possible trading relationship with the EU without actually being part of the bloc, but its border with Sweden is still a haven for smugglers that requires an alert and nimble border force. And there were 229,286 checks on vehicles crossing in 2016, up slightly on the previous two years."

Please specify where they are mentioned

Read it.

So faith
Where is the example of a "Smart Border" operating on land, outside a Free Trade area ?

Are you all really as dull as you pretend to be?

Read it.

I've read it before faith.

You know you're talking out of your arse which is why you can't specify an example that even begins to compare to NI.

I get where you are going garden but we are linked, the GFA can't just be wished away and it links us.
We have many trade/custom/safety links based around flying, managing nuclear fuel etc that if we are going to pull out of have to be replaced seamlessly because we cannot manage without planes for a couple of years while we carefully create a bespoke deal and the infrastructure needed for it.
We aren't working in a vacuum and walking away from every current tie with the EU won't give us one to work in either.
I am not an idealist I am a pragmatist and none of the sensible middle ground is being taken.

faithhope
Are you all really as dull as you pretend to be? ..... Read it.
I have. I listed the examples. None of them are land borders outside Free Trade areas.
So clearly YOU have not read the report.

Try harder next time.

Sunday, the report does not say 'do it like Sweden/Norway'.

Nor does it say 'do it like Aus/NZ'

Nor does it say 'do it like Canada/USA'.

etc etc etc.

There is no current examples to refer to wrt what it is suggesting - it is explicit in that.

What it says, is that all the technology exists already, is being used in various ways, in different countries, in different combinations - and it's about bringing it all together in an integrated & novel way.

It is bizarre to me that there are so many people out there who have such dogmatic & plodding approaches to things that they shrink away from innovation.
Although it makes sense I suppose that the people clinging fearfully to the bureaucratic behemoth that is the EU seem to be of that mindset.

So clearly YOU* have not read the report.

Try harder next time.*

😂
Totes did.

Obvs read it more thoroughly than you, clearly.

It is bizarre to me that there are so many people out there who have such dogmatic & plodding approaches to things that they shrink away from innovation.

No, what is truly bizarre is the complete and utter shamelessness of your assurances that that report was the answer to everything when you know full well it's nothing of the sort.

I'll never comprehend Leavers lack of questioning.

I'll never comprehend your willingness to put your shit on the line for people who are playing you like puppets.

We're not going to leave the SMCU.

It'll just have a different name so you don't entirely lose face.

Get over it and move on.

No, what is truly bizarre is the complete and utter shamelessness of your assurances that that report was the answer to everything when you know full well it's nothing of the sort.

Un. Hinged.

faith give it up love.

You know damn well that report contains none of the assertions you claim it did.

If it did you'd point them out and make me and everyone else look like twats.

As it is, there's just one twat round here.

"Although it makes sense I suppose that the people clinging fearfully to the bureaucratic behemoth that is the EU seem to be of that mindset."

Now now. Still waiting for that explanation how to plug the NHS funding hole with your "global outlook"... but I digress.

You simply misunderstood the paper (or just haven't actually read it)... It helpfully presents a number of technologies with the potential to make the NI-RoI border more efficient (too bad our dream team couldn't come up with one and instead had to rely on our European friends), but it would still be a border, costly to operate, and complete with checkpoints.

You know damn well that report contains none of the assertions you claim it did.

....apart from the fact that it did, of course.

faith either put up or shut up.

Point out the parts of that report only you can see.

As it is, there's just one twat round here.

I dunno, I could name a few.

faith either put up or shut up.

Nope.

I think you need a lie down & some smelling salts tbh.

I simply can't imagine being as deluded as you are faith

There's nothing in that report that even implies we could function outside SM/CU with no hard border within the next decade, let alone the next few months.

It does go a long way to explain why Leavers are so blasé about everything though.

Blasé is easy if you don't live in the real world.

Aren't you even a little bit embarrassed about what a twat you look when you can't back up comments that you go around every house to defend faith?

Bear, the leavers will be back tomorrow after Mays speech to tell you how wrong you are and how wonderful Brexit is going to be. Because May said so.

Faithhope
We are all looking at the same document.
Its a good document.
Link to the paragraphs that support your assertion
or shut up about it.

Actually, Faith, the report explicitly says that the border should be an upgraded version of the Norway/Sweden border.

That said, there is a BIG difference. Norway and Sweden are both in Schengen, so no passport control.

Bear, the leavers will be back tomorrow after Mays speech to tell you how wrong you are and how wonderful Brexit is going to be. Because May said so.

I can't wait for the speech.

It's going to be a load of waffle as per.

We should take bets on how many times 'deep and special' is mentioned.

I kind of wish I was so simple that I took this shit at face value- life would be so much easier.

There will be not one ounce of clarity on anything.