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If that weren't true it would be funny surfer!

user, I think your point there is very valid; the EU wasn't really on most people's radar pre-referendum.

I'd agree with that. (!)

The shame of it all is, now it is on most peoples radar, other things by necessity have dropped off.

And since June 2017, what exactly has parliament done ????

The one thing that was called correctly before the referendum was that if there were to be a vote to leave, it would jam up UK government for longer than anyone expected. Would anyone care to challenge my assertion that is exactly was has come to pass ?

The one thing that was called correctly before the referendum was that if there were to be a vote to leave, it would jam up UK government for longer than anyone expected. Would anyone care to challenge my assertion that is exactly was has come to pass ?

...........no. You're right. No challenge from me!

Wow, 2 things Leavers and Remainers can agree on.

I have a dream ....

Jeez, so the only thing we can agree on is this taking up too much of parliaments time.

Do any other leavers have any opinions on TM's plan for yet another bloody speech about our 'ambitions'?

Are you honestly happy that that is as far as we've progressed halfway through A50.

So yes, having a place just for us would be nice actually. Why would that bother you?

It wouldn't bother me, surfer. I just don't think a public forum is the right arena in which to try to exclude people from contributing to any thread they wish to engage on, although it's quite obvious to me why you would seek to do so.

Driventodespair,
Yes grown man,
Sorry I didn't understand your post.
I have, unbeleivable to some, read the eu referendum pages of peter north and I am member of the rmt.
I also read the express and other papers online.
I listen/watch the news.
I can see where we are.
Like the majority of this country I have tried to move on since 2016 and embrace the current situation. I came here neutral.
Looking for ideas.
The leavers and others I recongise as neutral on other threads, have been welcoming.
Sadly not always case with remainers.
God will can be lost quickly.

user it's very easy to align yourself with those who promise unicorns for everyone and question nothing.

Less so to align yourself with those pesky Remainers who point out the problems and ask for solutions.

How do you “move on” when Brexit hasn’t even been finalised yet? How do people in NI move on when they don’t even know if there will be a hard border? Eu citizens in uk, brits abroad, car companies all in limbo

How do people in NI move on when they don’t even know if there will be a hard border? Eu citizens in uk, brits abroad, car companies all in limbo

EU citizens living in the U.K. have been given numerous assurances as you well know.
Brits abroad - don’t care really.
Car companies - problems within the car industry are not just Brexit related, again, as you well know.
NI border - work in progress. I’m confident a suitable agreement will be achieved.

But can I just add; The U.K. is not just made up of EU citizens, car companies, Brits abroad, & the people of NI.
There’s millions of other people as well. ( many of whom are happy we’re leaving )

lot of assumptions there surfer.

NI border - work in progress. I’m confident a suitable agreement will be achieved.

surfer, what would you think if it turned out NI was the stumbling block I think it is going to be and we end up paying for SM/CU access to avoid a hard border.

Talking of cliffs , was it the late great Sean Hughes who said the problem over north / south Ireland would only be solved by cliff erosion ? I think the government are going to struggle to drag out this whole brexit process even with a transition period long enough for that to solve the NI dilemma for them .

But if TM is saying no to SM and CU, then how can that be reconciled with the paying for it?
This constantly confuses me.
As apart from the Chancellor who was been banned from making a speech as his stay as close as possible doesn't seem to be the government position , the wording from the government is us being able to make trade deals is the wanted approach.

Hammond seems to be the only person in the cabinet to have a grasp of the impossibility of leaving the both the SM and CU without doing massive damage to (a) UK manufacturing (b) the financial sector (c) trade as a whole and (by implication (d) the NI border.

I can see that, but when he know that option is the option that will be the way the future goes wouldn't he be better pulling with everyone else in the cabinet..
As right now he comes over as an EU puppet

The U.K. is not just made up of EU citizens

Actually the UK is almost entirely made up of EU citizens at present: people like myself, who are angry at having their EU citizenship stripped away. I welcome the current debate about this.

"As right now he comes over as an EU puppet"

So... common sense approach = EU puppet. I suppose that's better than being an enemy of the people

twofingerstoEverything

I think he genuine feels that he knows what is best, as he has seen the figures, and I can understand that.

but when he knows that isn't the way the PM and others are making speeches about the way things will happen and his speeches are the oppersite to the official comments, enough that the PM has BANNED him doing this, can't you see what I mean?

Sorry guests.
I voted remain;
Because my views thought at time it was best option.
But reason for doing so have slowly changed.
Eldest feared it would reduce his future, we looked at options to move him to Canada.
He wants to stay now. He thinks there is a future.
Feared Scotland would go independant
SNP gone backwards since referendum

Started reading on here after referendum
The WM threads confused me/ so technical and I often disagreed with felliw remainers
Found early Brexit Arms- thanks surferjet for starting them
Easier to follow and more leavers
Found myself agree more and more with leavers
Especially wrongtrousers and ourblanche
So left eu threads alone
Read loads for both sgdes ocd probably
Much more neutral
So returned to talk on here
Very late to party, totally surprised to slowly change my mind
So I am still abit conflicted
But want Britain to succeed for everyone and Brexit will happen. So trying to go into it positively

I know there are many options
Leave on wto
North's flexit
Lexitters
Norway model
Swiss model
EFTA model
Even bears BINO

But in 2017 82%;of voters voted labour or conservative. Both parties stated no SM or CU..
91% of parliaments seats held.by them and DUP.
So surely it can't be a totally surprise to Mr Barnier and Eu27 whe our government told them that.
I wonder if Mr.Barnier and Eu27, thought we find it all too hard and just give up and keep to a BINO or Norway style

User I can understand where you coming from.

Some people can see this is what will be happening and accept and adapt to the situation that has happened, and realise it's a case of moving forward with what is there in front of them as the future.

I think the nearer we get to the date the more people will be of this frame of view, as there is nothing that can change at the moment but once the deal is finally announced that will be the time to implement the necessary changes.

Agnes
Whilst.Hammond keeps fighting with his chancellor's hat on. It takes our government longer to agree it position.
Honourable but we need a coherent way forward, not another 6 months of infight.
Either he agrees with rest of cabinet or resigns and joins Ken Clark to fight it from back benchs
Britain needs a clear exit plan
Not more cabinet infighting.
Surely thats another thing leavers and temainera can agree on?

Mummy2017
Yes,
Brexit will happen, rightly or wrongly, so for all our good, we as a country need to make it work.
Infighting makes failure easier
More I read on here, see in rl, less worried and.more positive I have felt