The Brexit Arms

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Welcome to The Brexit Arms!
Looking forwards, not backward!

All welcome 🍺

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"Did you not hear the interview from the PM yesterday"

Ha ha! Given that she's backtracked on literally everything since she activated Article 50, I think you may be investing just a teeny bit too much confidence in her...

So sad, hope eternal till we walk out...

Sadly I do think one of us is delusional, however time will tell which one...

Actually scrub that. We know it's you that's delusional. I'm hopeful that things might go the way I want them to - you are adamant that everything is going your way, despite that fact that nothing much has in the last several month...

How can accepting al the bad things will happen, knowing it having read it all, and then just waiting to see what the final outcome is make me delusional..

Nothing has be decided yet, unless you know more than the PM...

"Nothing has be decided yet"

And yet you keep telling us what is definitely going to happen.

Not looking very bright there...

what that we are leaving,,

So sorry you can't see the light, it's quiet Bright if you care too look.

To quote something a PP said (but corrected) - "Nothing has been decided yet"...

It's been decided we are going, how has not however, a very different think to what your hoping.

Keep on enjoying your delusions. Burying your head in the sand is a very Brexiteer thing to do.

So is Remoaning.

would be the biggest slap in the face to the people who voted them in to their jobs.

Correction: it would be a sizeable, and well deserved, slap in the face of the people who bought into the Daily Heil propaganda and are responsible for this Brexit clustef*ck. These people are not the entirety of the British people, roughly what? 25%? They are definitely NOT "the people". The lords should do what's in the best interest of the country, rather than respond to bullying.

In a representative democracy the parliament does not always follow the desires of the public. They do what they (as representative individuals) think is best.

For example capital punishment, the majority of the U.K. population supports CP (although I think the stats have changed recently) yet it was abolished in 1964 (ish).

Democracy does not mean the majority always gets its own way. In fact a well balanced democracy protects against the dictatorship of the majority.

If the HoL or the HoC reject the referendum or call for ref2 that is entirely constitutional and democratic.

What about when the Representatives have decided by an overwhelming majority to seek instruction from their constituents in a single issue simple majority Referendum? If they didn't want to carry out the will of the electorate they shouldn't have decided they needed direct instruction.

Yes that's entirely correct. There should not have been a referendum especially when the constitutional implications were not understood by the vast majority of the population.

Also they did not seek "instruction" it was an advisory referendum. All referenda are advisory ( in the U.K.) because parliament is sovereign.

DCs need to overcome a power struggle has resulted in this mess.

@howabout

There is some truth to that.

But a representative democracy can protect the people against bad decisions. In fact it would be a dereliction of duty not to.

Also let's remember the real motivation behind the EU ref. It was motivated but internal Tory politics and a weak PM. The British people didn't care about the EU until Tory politicians and maybe Fromage raised it as an issue.

The genius of the Brexit marketing campaign was to target people who've had it tough in life and tell them: look we know it's been bad but it's really all the EU and immigrants' fault, nothing to do with us Tories. Immigration is the EU. Now, there is this one thing you can do in your life to change everything and make yourself a success: Brexit. Ridiculous as it sounds, it actually worked on a lot of people.

JRM is now blaming the British civil service for Brexit issues. Please refer to the attacks on the 'undemocratic' EU Commission. Now it is U.K. unelected bureaucrats who want to stop Brexit.

Please make the connection to the scapegoats. It's the unelected officials, no one mentioned the U.K. had them and now the Commission can't be blamed it's the British civil service.

It's a pattern of othering administrators who are just doing their job. "We need to escape the unelected bureaucrats in Brussels" they cry but now they turn on the British counterparts.

The genius of the Brexit marketing campaign was to target people who

had never voted.

The problem is, we are now finding out why they didn't previously vote ... well UKIP are.

It's a little like being at a family Christmas dinner, and one, possibly older, member of the family who's been snoozing peacefully suddenly wakes up, says could you turn that TV down, dears, you do, and spent the rest of the afternoon struggling to hear, whilst disturbed relative has a peaceful nap.

Re JRM and the civil service row I think Bernard Jenkin has a point.

"If ministers are vague or divided, life for officials becomes impossible, as we can see now. Ministerial collective responsibility really matters," he said.

He added: "If the prime minister sticks to one policy and the chancellor keeps advocating another, what are officials meant to do?"

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-42935058

It might be time for PH to own his views (or direct his civil servants in line with Cabinet policy) as GO at least has / had the virtue of doing.

And when we life becomes difficult for politicians because of their own incompetence they blame the civil service. This is exactly the same as the way the Commission has been blamed by British politicians.

It's easier to blame an elite than form a coherent argument of your own.

Or - a novel idea perhaps - backbenchers could stop sniping from the sidelines and undermining May in the national press whenever they see their vision of a hard Brexit slipping away?

In case any of the fellow Brexit Farmers missed these.

Behind the scenes of TMbot's EU negotiations:

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/angela-merkel-theresa-may-brexit-demands-press-briefing-davos-eu-talks-a8183436.html

The Dotard ripped apart by Brexit Select Committee:

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-david-davis-video-questioning-select-committee-mocked-a8177881.html

Enjoy!

It's Incredulous the way people who had never voted suddenly become devil incarnate when they become passionate enough to vote..

You do know I crunched the numbers, something I can do when given the figures,

It took me ages, and is on one of the other posts.
We are going out because the people who lived the last 40 years with an EU that didn't just do what it said on the tin, It slowly over this time crept into every corner of our lives, and when given the chance the vote was carried by there people...

It was 50/50 ish for the over 25 to 65..
The young did vote in numbers but even had EVERY under 23 voted to leave, you still would not have won.
But age counts for nothing then.. as they stole your future.
Or gave it us back. time will tell.

Determined exclusively at EU level: trade, SM rules, intra EU migration, competition rules and oh yeah marine biology....

Everything else, (ie the vast majority of laws) the U.K. rules exclusively or combined a EU and U.K. The EU is still trade focused.

crept into every corner of our lives

No it didn't. That's just not true. The EU does not involve itself in the vast majority of U.K. legislation.