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Brexit

Westministenders: Happy Xmas (War is Over) - if only

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 07/12/2017 14:00

When is lying not lying. When you can get enough of your mates to agree it is not lying.

And so we have David Davis, who has made two statements to parliament which deliberately contradict each other and must constitute some sort of lie to parliament at some point however you cut it.

Will the Speaker risk the wrath of his party to uphold democratic values? We watch carefully.

Davis also reveals and exposes May too though. May one way or another is complicit in Davis’s lie, either through not doing her job in reading the reports or by protecting Davis when she knew the reports did not exist. This is gross misconduct in her inability to ensure her staff do their bloody jobs. All so she can keep her own job.

This is where whistleblowers in other institutions pop up.

It has also become apparent that May has not had THE conversation with the Cabinet over what shape Brexit should take. After 18months.
Why not? Is she incapable of consensus building or is she just incompetent?

And then we have the DUP seemingly not being properly being involved in the wording of the all important document.

Vote Leave’s Oliver Norgrove is perfectly right in saying that Hard Brexit is all but dead. Don’t let that make you feel happier. Hard Brexiteers know that there only option now, is No Deal and that’s what they will try and pursue.

There is no deal until everything is settled. Right now, nothing is settled, not even what the UK want out of Brexit, never mind the EU position.

May might well have blown the only opportunity for a deal too, because of her failure over NI and the DUP. Where does she go from here? The idea that she will stand up to anyone, is ludicrous given her track record.

We might all wish we could John Lennon's song was apt when it comes to this Christmas and Brexit, it seems the war for our future post Brexit, it seems it is only just starting.

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LurkingHusband · 07/12/2017 15:55

Graniud has some interesting notes ...

The Police Service of Northern Ireland has warned it does not want to return to an era when sex offenders, human traffickers and burglars use the Irish border to evade capture.

The deputy chief constable of the police force said 20 years ago there was a huge problem with aggravated burglaries on elderly with criminals fleeing across the border north or south to escape justice.

Strong co-operation between the PSNI and the Garda Siochana underpinned by European arrest warrant legislation and a bilateral agreement has made the rural border areas a place of “safety”, Drew Harris told the Brexit select committee which is visiting the Irish border today. He said:

Criminal gangs did evade us using the border. We’ve worked hard over the last 20 years to make sure that’s not the case.

What we want to concentrate on is that we don’t diminish where we are a the moment, that our relationships are maintained [post Brexit].

I served on this border are 30 years ago, we had good relationship with the Garda Siochana, but we just didn’t have the legislative infrastructure – and people flee across the border to evade the police.

The border also proved a means of evasion for people involved in road traffic accidents, the committee heard.

^Harris, deputy chief constable of the PSNI, said there would have to be a new extradition treaty with Ireland in the event of no deal.
Extradition attempts before the European arrest warrant agreement came in was difficult, he told the Brexit select committee in Armagh.^

TheElementsSong · 07/12/2017 15:56

Thanks for the new thread RTB - we're filling them up fast, lately.

LurkingHusband · 07/12/2017 16:00

I've just taken a copy, but it's interesting that as of now: 15:59 on December 2017, the BBC News front page has no mention of "Brexit" anywhere ....

EmilyDickinson · 07/12/2017 16:00

May is no remainer. At best she can be called opportunistic.

Thank you. That does make more sense.

lalalonglegs · 07/12/2017 16:40

Waiting to see what clusterfuck this thread will witness. Thanks to Red and all the wise Westminstenders

I've just written to John Bercow - I feel I have got quite a lot off my chest Smile

GlassOfPort · 07/12/2017 16:44

I have also written to Bercow

I am pasting the email address from the old thread, for anybody else who would like to have a word with him...

[email protected]

prettybird · 07/12/2017 16:49

lala - just for you to share around. Xmas Wink

I like making mince pies - these were the first 33 of this season (currently the count is 63 big ones and 12 mini ones - and I need to make another batch as I'm running out even though I haven't had a single one myself yet Xmas Shock)

Shameless place mat king. Xmas Grin

Westministenders: Happy Xmas (War is Over) - if only
lalalonglegs · 07/12/2017 16:54

It's a good thing I'm 400 miles away from you, pretty, or you might find baking mince pies became a full-time job. Those look magnificent Star

prettybird · 07/12/2017 17:02

I do make good mince pies even if I say so myself Xmas Wink - my mum's "secret" is half lard/vegetable fat and half butter, and then more than half fats to flour (most short crust recipes have half fat to flour) Xmas Smile (And in a nod to the nostalgia of Brexit, when I'm making the shortcrust pastry, for some weird reason, I find it easier to have my scales measuring in lb & oz, rather than grammes Xmas Confused)

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 07/12/2017 17:29

SDLP
@SDLPlive
SDLP Leader @columeastwood sent a memo directly to the Prime Minister warning the remain majority will not stand for a one sided negotiation. All parties must see the detail of the agreed the negotiating position if the DUP is to be consulted.

www.sdlp.ie/news/2017/eastwood-warns-theresa-may-that-the-dup-do-not-speak-for-northern-ireland/

Faisal Islam
@faisalislam
Other Northern Ireland parties are now demanding that they too are consulted on the wording of the Brexit border agreement as well as the DUP

EmilyAlice · 07/12/2017 18:15

Any thoughts about what the Tusk statement might be early tomorrow morning?

20nil · 07/12/2017 18:18

Thanks for new thread. These keep me sane.

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 07/12/2017 18:24

Not sure but

Jon Stone
@joncstone
Donald Tusk statement at 7.50am Brussels time tomorrow (so 6.50am London time) seems timed to dominate morning headlines, Today programme etc

RhiannonOHara · 07/12/2017 18:27

Harry Cole (the Sun's Westminster correspondent apparently) tweets that it 'sounds like a market mover'. I don't know what that means. Confused

EmilyAlice · 07/12/2017 18:29

I think it is just before the markets open.

RedToothBrush · 07/12/2017 18:30

No sufficient progress before Christmas?

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RedToothBrush · 07/12/2017 18:33

Laura Kuenssberg‏ @bbclaurak 4 minutes ago
Reuters now quoting Irish officials saying a deal is close - UK govt believes sides were far apart now getting closer, but not there yet

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RedToothBrush · 07/12/2017 18:38

Laura Kuenssberg‏ @bbclaurak 14 minutes ago

  1. Sounds like Tusk statement might not be that exciting tomorrow, but whispers tonight that new language has been discussed by UK govt, Commission and Irish govt that was being put to the DUP this afternoon
  2. No official confirmation of anything but separate source says 'dynamic is positive'

Laura Kuenssberg‏ @bbclaurak
But @BrunoBrussels says this...

Bruno Waterfield‏***@BrunoBrussels*
Something is afoot

Bruno Waterfield‏***@BrunoBrussels*
“Stay close by to the commission,” I’ve been told by two people on either side

To clarify, the tweet in the above post that says it was 4mins ago by Laura K was AFTER the ones in this messages, and Bruno Waterfield is regarded as 'impeccably connected', by several political journalists who seem rather envious of his contacts.

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HermioneIsMe · 07/12/2017 18:38

Well it loooks like DD was right.
A lot of scrambling and rushing around to find a deal right at the last minute...
I do hope that this will be a conclusive outcome.....

RedToothBrush · 07/12/2017 18:40

Ok we have a few of these now:

Peter Foster‏ @pmdfoster 4 mins
Also hearing from EU source that May could travel to Brussels as early as tonight.

Again UK/IE sources will NOT confirm.

#Brexit

Tony Connelly‏ @tconnellyRTE 57 seconds ago
Am hearing now that things are moving on a possible new text from the British side. Theresa May having to run everything by the people she has to run things by... #Brexit

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RedToothBrush · 07/12/2017 18:42

Bruno Waterfield‏*@BrunoBrussels*
Does May have to actually turn up in Brussels tonight?

Faisal Islam‏ @faisalislam
Scheduling of Tusk press statement is so he can go to Hungary on time at 0815 - he has already cancelled his trip to Israel in order to be available for a second May visit, which didn’t happen

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RedToothBrush · 07/12/2017 18:45

EU Council Press‏ @EUCouncilPress
.@eucopresident Tusk will make a press statement on #Brexit tomorrow at 7:50 in the Europa building. Further details will follow.

Florian Eder‏ @florianeder
#Brexit Serious situation...if May won't have made it to Brussels by Sunday, not much of a chance to get to sufficient progress at the end of the week...clock is ticking...we're all Irish.

StefanieBolzen‏*@StefanieBolzen*
Hearing from EU sources that “May will be soon in Brussels”. Whatever “soon” means #Brexit

Peter Foster‏ @pmdfoster
Snap. Heard same.

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OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 07/12/2017 18:46

Re: May's motivations. There was a petition about asking her to disclose her tax returns in order to see whether her and Phillip benefited from tax havens linked to the panama papers. I don't know if that would play a part?

uk.businessinsider.com/theresa-may-philip-may-offshore-panama-papers-blind-trust-tax-return-mcdonnell-2017-12

RedToothBrush · 07/12/2017 18:48

Laura Kuenssberg‏ @bbclaurak
Things definitely moving - doesn't mean a deal is done, but different source says serious proposals are on the table and being studied

and

Peter Foster‏ @pmdfoster
#Brexit

EU source tells me a deal is "done", but both UK and IE sources will NOT confirm this.

Given recent events, everyone should exercise caution.

But wheels are in motion.

Tusk is a red herring, am told.

Jon Stone‏*@joncstone*
This is what I’m hearing as well - can’t work out whether its because Brussels is more leaky/less disciplined than national governments, or something else

Peter Foster‏ @pmdfoster
So it seems caution was well advised. EU side may have jumped gun on #Brexit deal.

Per @tconnellyRTE May still to finalise text with Varadkar & Foster.

Many a slip tween cup and lip.

Faisal Islam‏ @faisalislam
“Not there yet” - on UK-IE-DUP wording deal - UK Govt source dampening down suggestion that the PM is on a plane

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RedToothBrush · 07/12/2017 18:48

Guy Faulconbridge‏*@GuyReuters*
Ireland and UK very close to Brexit border deal, moving quickly, seems a matter of hours - Irish official @padraichalpin

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