Westministenders: Money, money, money

[RedToothBrush]

The big developments are that the government have signalled they are prepared to pay more and to involve the ECJ when it comes to citizens rights on condition that we move to talk of trade. But no apparent progress on NI. Which is significant with Ireland threatening to veto.

The EU has not changed its stance at all. Since Day 1.

There is always a worrying omission and lack of commitment to retain the Charter of Fundamental Rights. The bonfire begins.

Talk is of Green still going in a reshuffle, possibly with Gove replacing him as Deputy PM.

Coalition talks in Germany have broken down, and the British have got excited about it, whilst the German response have largely been a slight shrug.

Its been a much quieter week, despite the budget. Thank goodness. There are lots of outstanding issues that are lurking in the background like the Green one though.

The main message coming from the budget, has not been any new policy, but the dreadful economic forecast for the next few years.

For those claiming that Uk workers can be trained instead ..
Well that hasn't happened in umpteen decades, so that idea seems as likely as DD's magic IT tech to avoid physical customs checks.

Lecture plus Q&A by Adam Ramsay of OpenDeocracyUK given at Cardiff Uni earlier this week on
Dark Money which funded the Brexit campaign

https://cardiff.cloud.panopto.eu/Panopto/Pages/Viewer.aspx?id=159971ab-971b-492b-be66-3ec1ee8bacdee_

I did a law course with Coursera (all 6 weeks of it so no expert), but no Parliament can bind its successors. Parliament can vote to overturn any law its predecessors have passed. It is sovereign in its right to do so. Hence can overturn law to join the EU by passing another stupid law to leave.

@BigChocFrenzy

Well put. These figures are hard to argue with and reaffirm the benefit of immigration to the UK. Same happens elsewhere.

The BOE's assessment is that immigration benefits growth but does not impact wage inflation.

BOE

lala Great celebratory news about the Daily Fail.

Perhaps Paul Dacre will do a complete volte face and support postponing or abandoning the exit.

(Still wouldn't even line the cat litter try with it in this house though!)

Some cheering news! The Daily Mail has just posted a £112 million loss in past financial year (compared to £200+ million profit the year before)

Not so much money in hate these days ? I'm guessing people are getting their fill elsewhere ?

For those claiming that Uk workers can be trained instead ..

Don't people get it.

"We" don't want people we can't control. If Brits are let into those jobs that industry depends on, they might do something stupid. Like strike for higher pay.

If we ensure those jobs go to immigrants - by deskilling our workforce - then we can keep them in line ... after all, we can kick them out if they lose their job and they can't vote. Win win. We also don't need to worry about paying them a state pension from the NI they'll pony up.

Did no one read "Immigrants: how to get rich without trying" ?

LH - they won't have had to look very far for their doses of hate in the past 24 hours. I came across notorious fascist sympathiser Anne Coulter spouting her views on Channel 4 News yesterday evening. And then she was on Today this morning doing it again .

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/3100882-Westministenders-The-Art-of-the-Deal?watched=1
New Thread. Rather rushed again I'm afraid.

Opinion shift on Brexit from Leave to Remain has been greatest in Scotland.

I did a law course with Coursera (all 6 weeks of it so no expert), but no Parliament can bind its successors. Parliament can vote to overturn any law its predecessors have passed. It is sovereign in its right to do so. Hence can overturn law to join the EU by passing another stupid law to leave.

The problem with that (correct) factual analysis, is that it flatly contradicts the Brexiteer narrative of "being ruled from Brussels".

The UK could - at any time in the past 43 years - have passed laws in direct contraction of EU directives. Admittedly we might have been treated like pariahs, and had a battle in international courts, but it was entirely possible.

In hindsight I suspect the UKs exit from the EU was sealed the day the Law Lords overturned a UK law as being contradictory with EEC law (if memory serves it was about equal pay for women, so even then the agenda to suppress women was ongoing). It was probably a nasty shock for the (many ?) voters and politicians who hadn't been paying attention.

I wonder if that shift is tied to the rumours that some nationalists voted Leave in the hope that Brexit would trigger Indy ref 2?

v-17 12:02:00
I struggle to understand how anyone can look at that HMRC HMRC HMRC spreadsheet and not accept that E27 immigrants bring significant economic benefit overall to the UK.

Agree, BigChoc

Thank you again red for these brilliant threads.

rumours that some nationalists voted Leave in the hope that Brexit would trigger Indy ref 2?
Don't know about that one lala but Scotland's culture as an enlightenment country looks more and more at odds with 'brexit'.

for jumbled post^

@MintyTeaboy
Bigotry hurts the economy, so the next time you want to blame minorities for your problems, first take a look in the mirror.”
― DaShanne Stokes

Lala - one of my friends knew at least one Indyref No voting person (and I've read of others) who deliberately voted Leave, despite supporting the EU, "to stick one on Nicola Sturgeon" , assuming that Remain would win

Wonder how they're feeling now

Weird decisions for Voting Leave really is the gift that keeps giving

lala can I offer you the vote leave reason from my home town? They didn't like the Polish congregating and drinking in a certain place in the town. The certain place used to be where the heroin addicts hung out. They go somewhere else now. This is apparently also the Polish people's fault.

They didn't like the Polish congregating and drinking in a certain place in the town.

Back nearly 8 years ago, I had a colleague who grumbled daily about "hearing Polish" when he popped into town at lunch. He has also never been to London (aged 35) and didn't know the Polish fought with Britain. He also had a problem with human rights.

Childish, but when we had developers that spoke various Indian languages, I brushed up on my Hindi, much to his disgust. We also had an executive from our European owners drop in once, which was another grumbling point ....

"We won't let East European alcoholics squeeze out our indigenous skagheads! You've got to be British if you want to abuse substances round here!"

**

Made me think of that Absolutely sketch with the bloke in the mad tartan outfit stumping up to the Scottish/English border in the middle of nowhere, shouting 'Poofs!' into the wind and standing back with an air of great satisfaction.

lala at least the skagheads had the decency to use the right accent when they could speak, I mean the liberty of these people. Tut

"to stick one on Nicola Sturgeon" confused, assuming that Remain would win

I must admit I toyed with the idea of voting Leave to stick one to Cameron, assuming Remain would win. I am extremely glad that I didn't and voted for what I believed in. I think doing things for the wrong motive can backfire - consider May calling the election to stick it to Labour and Corbyn and whoops, losing her majority.

any thoughts on what this vote result means?

Michael Mullaney‏
@miketmullaney
More Michael Mullaney Retweeted Britain Elects
Absolutely stunning gain for the Lib Dems taking one of the safest Labour seats in the south of England. Swing of 53.5% from Labout to Lib Dem must be one of the highest everMichael Mullaney added,
Britain Elects

@britainelects
Bridgemary North (Gosport) result:

LDEM: 57.9% (+57.9)
LAB: 22.9% (-49.0)…
3:37 PM - 30 Nov 2017

This Damian Green / David Davis story is hilarious.

Did I get this right?

Brexit secretary threatens to resign to protect his mate who likes to wank at work with porn downloaded on his laptop that we've all paid for