Westministenders: Money, money, money

[RedToothBrush]

The big developments are that the government have signalled they are prepared to pay more and to involve the ECJ when it comes to citizens rights on condition that we move to talk of trade. But no apparent progress on NI. Which is significant with Ireland threatening to veto.

The EU has not changed its stance at all. Since Day 1.

There is always a worrying omission and lack of commitment to retain the Charter of Fundamental Rights. The bonfire begins.

Talk is of Green still going in a reshuffle, possibly with Gove replacing him as Deputy PM.

Coalition talks in Germany have broken down, and the British have got excited about it, whilst the German response have largely been a slight shrug.

Its been a much quieter week, despite the budget. Thank goodness. There are lots of outstanding issues that are lurking in the background like the Green one though.

The main message coming from the budget, has not been any new policy, but the dreadful economic forecast for the next few years.

I saw that poll earlier woman
Interesting!

Further to that Twitter poll (and proving that there is no such thing as a light-hearted Brexit debate):

Martin Lewis‏Verified account @MartinSLewis**
8h8 hours ago
So far in the poll - with the benefit of hindsight having seen the €50bn 'divorce' bill shenanigans, 92% of remainers would still have voted remain, while 67% of leavers would've still voted leave.

Martin Lewis‏Verified account @MartinSLewis**
8h8 hours ago
To those who seem very worried about the drafting of my Twitter Brexit poll today, please rest assured, I have official confirmation it is NOT binding on the nation.

I think it's more to do with the Tories thinking anything is solvable if you throw enough money at it.

It's more nuanced than this - the already wealthy have to have more money thrown their way. The sick, disabled and poor need a kick in the teeth.

lala

That's true peregrina, some problems are solvable by throwing money at them others by taking money away until they die off. Sometimes literally

And lala missed your post but true too.

pretty I wonder if they'll ever learn that lesson. Probably not, war is business after all.

Piers Morgan‏ @piersmorgan
Good morning, Mr President @realDonaldTrump - what the hell are you doing retweeting a bunch of unverified videos by Britain First, a bunch of disgustingly racist far-right extremists?
Please STOP this madness & undo your retweets.

Known racist and right wing extremist tweets racist and right wing extremist content and Piers Morgan is 'shocked'. As if this is the first tweet Trump should be shouted at for.

I love tweets like this, when people suddenly realise their unconditional support might be a problem and might damage their own careers.

Still not there with Theresa yet though.

Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe's husband 'hopeful' for breakthrough in case
edition.cnn.com/2017/11/29/middleeast/nazanin-zaghari-ratcliffe-iran-medical-assessment/index.html

It really comes to something when Piers Morgan is the voice of reason.

artisancraftbeer That Channel 4 video on our knowledge of Ireland is shocking. Especially the elderly lady who thinks the Irish are a bit petty and they'll just have to 'lump it'. We are not arguing over who plays with the toy car in the nursery.

Or that Piers Morgan is to the left of the government.

Especially the elderly lady who thinks the Irish are a bit petty and they'll just have to 'lump it'.

She reminded me of whites in South Africa who made the same sort of arguments about the blacks - whining instead of accepting (like them!) that they couldn't always have what they wanted.

Then there was the person who thought the solution was for Ireland to leave the EU.

Andrew Lilico‏*@andrew*_lilico
I (& Conservative MPs) have given May the benefit of the doubt for now, accepting No. 10 denials that it's offered €40bn+ (either by number or by formula) unconditionally (ie to be paid even if it's No Deal). If it turns out she has agreed that unconditionally, she's toast.

May has constantly said she will do / has done / will offer many things.

She LIES. She MANIPULATES.

Haven't you worked that out yet mate? Or are you just happy when its been for the other side.

May is playing both sides. Has all along.

The Elements: excellent article. Many thanks.

Steve Bush on unhappy tories.
www.newstatesman.com/politics/staggers/2017/11/even-conservative-mps-dont-seem-really-want-brexit

Indeed Peregrina One of the things I detest about Conservative Austerity/Trickle Down Economics is the underlying assumption - no, the explicit policy - that the undeserving poor and vulnerable need to have money taken away in order for them to be incentivised to "work harder" , whereas the rich need to be given money tax breaks in order to incentivise them to work more

If anyone’s looking for a new game to play, I think I’ve got one you might enjoy

www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/brexit-bus-game-1-5300737

This is an article from the FT from a couple of weeks ago.

I'm not sure if anyone linked to it.

www.ft.com/content/c276ed98-be8e-11e7-9836-b25f8adaa111
Beware the Tory cult that’s steering Brexit
‘The difficulty of Brexiting is part of the appeal: only a great tribe can renew itself through sacrifice’

Its premise is to point out that Brexit is a Cargo Cult. And Boris Johnson is their spiritual leader.

What's a Cargo Cult?

Its when a society suddenly destroys its economic core in search of a golden age, because they perceive they are in some kind of decline.

This article today refers to it, using the comparison of the Fall of Singapore
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/nov/29/military-incompetence-brexit-psychology-britain-battlefield?CMP=share_btn_tw
What military incompetence can teach us about Brexit

But it was Dixon’s description of the disastrous fall of Singapore in 1942, almost without a fight, because the local command distrusted new tactics and underestimated the Japanese, that really chimes. And his description of too many second-rate officers repeating how they wanted to “teach a lesson to the Japs”.

None of this suggests that Brexit is somehow the wrong strategy, but that the agenda has been wrested by a group of people showing the classic symptoms of the psychology of military incompetence, including a self-satisfied obsession with appearance over reality and pomp over practicality, and a serious tendency to talk about European nations as if they needed to be “taught a lesson”.

Utterly fascinating.

She LIES.

I am sure that May doesn't think she does. Like saying she wasn't going to call an election. She would regard it as when the facts changed, she changed her mind, and bingo, it looked as though Labour would be slaughtered so she went for it.

I really think she believes the tosh she spouts about the Just About Managing, not realising, because of her narrow, blinkered vision that there are a whole load of people who aren't managing.

Voters should rise and say

We’ve been DUPed !

(another slogan for ear ? )

HoC breakdown of the probable final bill and whee it all comes from
It looks like €80 bn gross, which with offsets will reduce to about €60bn

The pound's fall increased the real cost to the UK, because the EU bill is in €

It could be spread out over a few decades though, in the case of pensions

including a self-satisfied obsession with appearance over reality and pomp over practicality
I was never keen on the british state's love of dressing up.
We used to be much more on the watch for cults in the 1970s, with the Moonies, Bhagwan etc. Lapses in vigilance are dangerous.

I've had a few goes at the New European's Brexit bus game. The best I managed was 30 days without trashing the bus.

Surprising NI poll on border after Brexit

Complicated, but Llooks like the DUP does not even represent most Unionists here.
At the very least, they are far too simplistic.

https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/11/26/exclusive-poll-unionist-supporters-content-with-east-west-post-

brexit-border-controls/

Poll question 1:
‘People should be prepared to accept border controls between Northern Ireland and Great Britain,
if this is agreed in the Brexit negotiations between the Government and the EU’.

Overall, 49% agreed with this, and 39% disagreed (with 12% neither agreeing or disagreeing).
But, perhaps surprisingly, willingness to accept such controls was stronger among Leave voters (64% agreed),
supporters of unionist parties (59%) and Protestants (54%)

This probably reflects a willingness to live with east-west border controls as the price of a Brexit successfully negotiated by the British government.
Lower levels of agreement from Remain voters (44%), nationalist supporters (47%) and Catholics (43%) imply, by contrast, reluctance to contemplate any kind of new border controls.
....
Poll question 2:
‘After the UK leaves the EU, there should be free movement across the Irish border, as at present,
but border controls between the island of Ireland and Great Britain’.

Overall, 64% agreed and 25% disagreed (with 11% undecided).
But this time the relationship with certain critical groups was reversed.
Support was strongest among supporters of nationalist parties (75%), Remain voters (73%) and Catholics (68%)
– but it was also high among unionist supporters (56%), Leave voters (also 56%) and Protestants (60%).

That would mean majority support in NI, including among Unionists, for a border in the Irish Sea
Economy first ?