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Brexit

Westministenders: The Tory Civil War – The Knives Are Out Again. A Big Battle Looms.

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 12/11/2017 13:56

Today has seen the publication of a story about how Johnson and Gove are holding May hostage in a ‘soft coup’ and have made various demands over what they want for a hard Brexit. The letter which was for May’s and Barwell’s eyes only has some how leaked. Don’t forget how Gove has just joined the Brexit Cabinet.

It comes at a time, when the Observer is also leading with an editorial demanding Johnson goes over his handling of the Nazarin Zagheri-Ratcliffe case as well as his long list of poorly judged comments which have had diplomatic consequences and another newspaper is leading with a story about how 40 Tories are ready to no-confidence May.

It all smacks of a personal battle between May and Johnson to govern the party, which has been playing out publicly for some time, most noticeable in the parallel Tory party conference leadership speeches and Johnson’s freelancing.

Johnson also seems to be potentially caught up, with what happens in the Mueller investigation due to a photo and lying about having met Misfud which could be politically damaging.

Priti Patel’s –sacking-- resignation also fits in neatly with the story. The Foreign Office were not informed and there is the curious side story that May DID know various details but told Patel to keep quiet, so not to embarrass the FCO. Or more to the point, be seen to be undermining Johnson.

Whether this is true or not we don’t know. It does have implications if its true, but it also says something if its not too. Why leak the story at all? Once again its about the Johnson v May dynamic.

As it stands, if Gove and Johnson have been leading May then why would they decide to ditch her and go for power without her?
Notably Gove has the best satisfaction scores of the Cabinet amongst Tories on Conservative Home too. He has had a lot of favourable comments over his statements over pesticides. The pair seem to have put differences aside and are working together. And May has become more and more of a liability. Johnson, also came second favourite to be Tory leader amongst Tories (if you discount don’t knows and none of the aboves). Maybe they fancy their chances…

Or it’s a last ditch attempt to cling on to that power as threats that Johnson might finally get the boot – if Zagheri-Ratcliffe does have her sentence extended and Johnson’s position is no longer tenable for even May’s self-preservation. Whilst much has been framed about it being about May’s political survival, its definitely not just her whose future is in doubt. Who was the ‘dead wood’, that young Tories demanded be ditched in a reshuffle to bring in young blood? Either way, Gove has firmly hitched his wagon to Johnson's effectively repeating Johnson's dismissal of Zagheri-Ratcliffe's case.

Anyway another week and another set of high political drama is a foregone conclusion.

A round up of other developments this week:

Tory Party / Government

  1. May announces intention to enshrine Brexit leaving date in law to force rebels to tow the line. This has many implications, not least tax related and putting more pressure on the UK government. It’s generally regarded as a desperate move by anyone sane.
  2. The Impact Assessments were a dogs dinner that was done at the last minute, and were not worth the paper they were written on. There was no detail to them.
  3. Priti Patel’s –sacking—resignation after having undocumented and unauthorised meetings with a series of Israel ministers. And then lying about it.
  4. Penny Mordaunt, who lied about the UK not having a veto to stop Turkey joining the EU, replaced Patel.
  5. Damien Green Porn. Another ex-policeman is backing the story that it was found on his computer despite Green’s denials.
  6. The ongoing Zagheri-Ratcliffe story with Iran and Johnson’s gaff and none apology
  7. Photograph of Johnson with ‘The Professor’ Misfud has been found. This links Johnson to how events in the US might pan out. If there are lots more revelations in the Mueller inquiry about him, then that might reflect on Johnson and make him subject to some difficult questions. Politically this might be problematic for Johnson.
  8. Claims that the whips office leaked the name of someone who reported allegations against Nigel Evans which occurred 6 months after Evans had been cleared of rape and the sexual assault of six men
  9. Suspended Tory MP Charlie Elphicke has complained that he is yet to be informed of what he has been accused of.
  10. Young Tory MPs issue threat to May that she brings in young blood and gets rid of ‘dead wood, who do nothing but screw up’. Give her until the New Year to do so.
  11. 40 Tories apparently ready to no confidence May.
  12. Lord Ashcroft’s latest poll reveals a very small percentage of people want a no deal situation despite all the noise of it being a good idea.
  13. Lord Ashcroft mentioned in the Paradise papers. Reported as domiciled in Belize despite assurances given to parliament that he would give up his non-dom status and pay tax in the UK as a Lord.

Parliament / Opposition both inside and outside parliament
14) May facing a possible revolt over Universal Credit. MPs due to vote on reducing wait times.
15) Talk that there are enough Tory Rebels prepared to back a Dominic Grieve amendment to force a meaningful vote on the Brexit Deal.
16) May under increasing pressure from business leaders to make a deal after a meeting with them at no. 10.
17) Lots of distraction in the Paradise Papers generally which raises the question over the power and influence of the super rich versus the poor. This plays well to Labour’s narrative and against the idea of a low tax post Brexit Britain.
18) Lord Kerr, author of the a50 clause states that May has misled the public and insists that it is reversible.
19) New Money Laundering and Sanctions Bill in the Lords. Government looking to omit 4th EU directive on tax avoidance. Naturally raises questions about whether UK would adopt new rules due to come into force the week after Brexit Day.
20) Money Laundering Bill also has lots of overlap with immigration and home office operations, raising some rather sinister questions over who could be affected and why. Potential for abuse seems to be huge.
21) Leave leaning Cornwall and Grimsby seeking special status in the face of Brexit – in line with remaining to preserve business / economic interests
22) Suicide of Welsh Assembly Labour member who was under investigation for sexual harassment
23) A Labour MP accuses the already suspended fellow Labour MP Kelvin Hopkins of inappropriate behaviour.

EU
24) Ireland demands the UK stays in the customs union.
25) Brexit talks have not progressed at all despite apparently being speeded up. Barnier saying that progress in December only possible if UK makes moves on the settlement deal. Prospect of stage two being delayed until March being raised. This leaves just 7 months to come to a deal, which plays to the No Deal Crowd’s interests.
26) EU believe the UK are not working in the best interests of the UK and there is a failure by May and Davis to understand the process or what No Deal will mean.
27) EU signalling that there is no bespoke transition. Only available options ae EEA or EFTA fudges.
28) Increasing view in Brussels that No Deal likely. EU think May hasn’t got the authority to come to a deal and its easier for her to drag UK off the cliff. Though they have doubts she will survive much longer.

World
29) Trump sides with Putin above the US Intelligence Community over the Russian election interference. On Veterans Day.
30) US’s Wilbur Ross said UK will have to dump European food safety standards and that losing our passporting rights to the EU would harm our interests with the US.
31) Developments in Lebanon, with it being said that Saudi Arabia said to have declared war. Many would consider this to be a proxy war against Iran. Crown Prince has purged political opponents including several with significant Wall Street interests. Eight died in a helicopter crash.
32) Large scale far right march in Poland as part of their Independence Day.

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RedToothBrush · 13/11/2017 18:37

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/israel-police-benjamin-netanyahu-bribery-evidence-enough-prime-minister-a8052821.html
Israeli police 'have sufficient evidence to charge Benjamin Netanyahu with bribery'
Prime Minister accused of accepting gifts worth hundreds of thousands of shekels

Israeli Police believe they have enough evidence to charge Benjamin Netanyahu with bribery, according to a new report.

The Prime Minister and his wife are accused of accepting gifts worth hundreds of thousands of shekels, in what has been dubbed Case 1000.

My.
How shocking and incredibly unusual.

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RedToothBrush · 13/11/2017 18:40

Siobhán Fenton‏ @SiobhanFenton
Brokenshire says he has commissioned someone to do an independent review into whether MLAs' pay can/should be stopped.
They'll report back to him on 15th Dec

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lalalonglegs · 13/11/2017 18:42

Haven't MPs yet to vote on whether to approve the money given to the DUP?

BigChocFrenzy · 13/11/2017 18:45

May is so weak, that she couldn't even tell investors that there is no need to pull out of Britain Shock

She doesn't dare offend Redwood by contradicting his advice to his wealthy investors ?
< or she's totally clueless >

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/nov/13/labour-accuses-john-redwood-of-talking-britain-down

Downing Street would not comment directly on his advice to investors.
Asked whether Theresa May agreed with Redwood that it was time for financiers to start pulling their money out of the UK,
the prime minister’s spokesman said:
“We are working to secure a good deal for Britain and also a deal that works for the European Union. We think we’re heading in the right direction and we’re confident of achieving that.”

< Why not say firmly: "no, there is no need for investors to flee the UK"
Does she also fear that some of the wealthy would be dangerous enemies if they lose some money due to her advice >

Mightybanhammer · 13/11/2017 18:48

What do people think ? Has Keir made his first mis step in welcoming that vote on the final deal?
DD confirmed I think that a no vote= no deal brexit. Apocalypse 2019...
I need to remain optimistic but am failing miserably.

Peregrina · 13/11/2017 18:49

Redwood is the one who should be advising to invest in Britain - he's the one who believes in Brexit and has spent the last 25 years angling for it. The truth is IMO he's now been exposed as wanting it for himself to make money.

mrsreynolds · 13/11/2017 18:58

What can one do?
Just save as much money as poss I suppose between now and 2019 😔

BigChocFrenzy · 13/11/2017 19:00

There are no legal constraints on a politician about lying to their constituents

However, Redwood is paid £180,000 for his second (or main ?) job as chief global strategist for Charles Stanley
He might be worried about being sued, at least for his backpay, if he gives bad faith advice to them and their investors

thecatfromjapan · 13/11/2017 19:44

Worrying.

Thanks for the thread, people.

HesterThrale · 13/11/2017 19:52

Yes Lurking I agree it's a good idea to donate a bit of cash to the Guardian. Apparently they're receiving more and more public donations/subscriptions, which may help towards their financial deficit. It's encouraging that over 1,000,000 people are willing to pay in some way for fairer news:

www.theguardian.com/gnm-press-office/2017/oct/26/guardian-reaches-milestone-of-500000-regular-paying-supporters

Tanith · 13/11/2017 19:53

“It's unfair to single out the good burghers of Wokingham. Almost all voters use rosettes as a proxy for critical thinking.”

I don’t entirely agree. The query was why Wokingham keep on voting John Redwood in despite being a strong Remain area.
The reason is that it’s a heavily Tory area that has never elected an MP from any other party and probably never will.
The day the Conservatives lose Wokingham is the day they know they are finished as a political influence.

Although there are some that are solidly for one particular party, it’s certainly not the case all other constituencies. If it were, then there would be no point in holding elections and Amber Rudd would have been spared that very anxious night a few months ago.

RedToothBrush · 13/11/2017 20:07

Laura Kuenssberg‏ @bbclaurak
Hearing Tory Chief Whip had tricky meeting with MPs this afternoon, and was left in no doubt about resistance to Withdrawal bill - Davis concession this afternoon doesn't seem to have shifted sentiment among Tory rebels
One Tory says 'he and the government should be very worried'
And @Anna_Soubry says Davis concession is 'insulting..it's absolutely meaningless' - says govt 'might get a nasty shock'

Fingers crossed.

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RedToothBrush · 13/11/2017 20:15

Btw there are 186 pages of amendments to the Repel Bill to work through...

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Holliewantstobehot · 13/11/2017 20:17

Downing Street would not comment directly on his advice to investors.
Asked whether Theresa May agreed with Redwood that it was time for financiers to start pulling their money out of the UK,
the prime minister’s spokesman said:
“We are working to secure a good deal for Britain and also a deal that works for the European Union. We think we’re heading in the right direction and we’re confident of achieving that.”

What was her husbands job again? Grin

Peregrina · 13/11/2017 20:47

Asked whether Theresa May agreed with Redwood that it was time for financiers to start pulling their money out of the UK

Followed by the typical, tangental non answer from May. What she should have told Redwood is that if he wasn't prepared to back Brexit by keeping his money in the UK, why should she continue to appease him? He's as odious and as much of a trouble maker as Farage IMO.

OlennasWimple · 13/11/2017 21:05

Proof that the furore about a Muslim woman apparently ignoring the victoms of the Westminster Bridge attack last year was created by a Russian bot

I wish the Russians would fuck off out of UK politics Angry (we can screw it up all on our own, we don't need their help)

HesterThrale · 13/11/2017 21:13

How will May ever be able to convince ANYONE that Brexit will help the JAMs ('Just About Managings') who she said she'd champion? Ain't gonna happen.

HashiAsLarry · 13/11/2017 21:25

@faisalislam
PM: Russia is meddling in elections, hacking Danish ministry, the Bundestag ...it is seeking to weaponise information, planting fake stories
PM: Russia is attempting to sow discord in the West and undermine our institutions ... We know what you are doing. And you will not succeed.

Good job there's been no major elections over here recently then Hmm

Mightybanhammer · 13/11/2017 21:28

Forget redwood for a moment.
What do we think of today's debate?

Mightybanhammer · 13/11/2017 21:31

Please, anyone. This is hugely important

mrsreynolds · 13/11/2017 21:44

I think we're fucked
I've thought that since June 24th last year

GaspodeWonderCat · 13/11/2017 21:48

From the Guardian - MPs and peers will vote on agreement, but will have no say in case of no-deal Brexit, will not be able to reverse decision and will not be able to reopen talks.

As MrsR says we are fucked if Parliament rolls over and agrees to this. They have to fight for a meaningful vote and not allow ministers to use Henry VIII powers at will.

Govt and DD have proposed this to get Tory backbenchers on side for now. Jam tomorrow, never today. Trust us .... I mean what could go wrong ....

Mightybanhammer · 13/11/2017 21:59

I think we ( and I include myself in this as a professional public service person with savings) - are utterly absolutely and comprehensively fucked too. What hope for the barely managing?
Anyone anything else to add?
Please stop chasing the flack and concentrate on the catastrophe our country is facing.

Cailleach1 · 13/11/2017 22:10

They are effing the country over like vultures at the same time as pretending the elites are somebody else. out of 65million people, where is the intellectual exposure of all his?

Cailleach1 · 13/11/2017 22:14

I don't think the redwood thing is flack. it outs him for what he is. if someone didn't falsely attribute it to him.