Rumour has it, some remainers are a little glum.....

[Carolinesbeanies]

So in the spirit of sharing our deluded brexiteer cheerfulness, heres a round up of some of this weeks good news.

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-5040279/UK-exports-booming-outside-Europe.html

http://www.londonlovesbusiness.com/business-news/london-news/big-boost-world-bank-ranks-uk-seventh-in-its-doing-business-report/18554.article

https://global.handelsblatt.com/politics/world-trade-makes-a-comeback-845798/amp

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-volkswagen/vw-explores-uk-banking-licence-ahead-of-brexit-idUKKBN1D22KR

The government have 'found' £60billion to put is a slush fund for brexit.

https://amp.ft.com/content/f3271ac7-7439-319f-ba90-9252f59aafee

And in the week that saw the interest rate rise, the Bank of England said gloomily "as migration tightens, we will see wage growth". Note the 'we will'.

Excellent. All this whilst the media obsess over impotent politicians as Britain works.

I think it was more incumbent upon the Remain campaign to highlight the NI conundrum tbh

Absolutely, the focus was on contradicting the leave campaign instead of focusing on the benefits of staying. They spent way too long banging on about the big red bus.

I would also be interested to see how many remain posters mentioned Ireland in the lead up to the Ref.

Couple of articles here:

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/brexit-valuable-irish-information-ignored-by-remain-campaign-1.2736080%3fmode=amp

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.newstatesman.com/politics/staggers/2016/04/eu-debate-must-not-ignore-northern-ireland%3famp

It’s a bit late to be throwing arms up in the air after the event about important issues that were not highlighted to ordinary folk at the time.

They spent way too long banging on about the big red bus.

You mean one of the many big fat lies?

I would also be interested to see how many remain posters mentioned Ireland in the lead up to the Ref.

Lots of people in NI I imagine. Probably why NI voted to remain.

Northern Ireland’s greatest fear from a Brexit is the return to conflict

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jun/21/northern-ireland-fear-brexit-conflict-good-friday-agreement-eu

It’s a bit late to be throwing arms up in the air after the event about important issues that were not highlighted to ordinary folk at the time.

Are you saying people were misled?

No, just highlighting that the campaigns were crap.

Lots of people in NI I imagine. Probably why NI voted to remain.

I should have been more specific, I meant remain posters on MN. I could go and check I suppose.

There ya go;

Brexit effect on Ireland? Any opinions/knowlege

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/2657522-Brexit-effect-on-Ireland-Any-opinions-knowlege

Ghost - thanks that’s saved me time but, with all due respect it’s only two pages. Threads about Ireland run for longer than that now but it’s after the event and too late.

I think it was more incumbent upon the Remain campaign to highlight the NI conundrum tbh. Why on earth would a campaign which is trying to persuade people to leave the eu highlight problems?

This makes me feel, in equal parts, sad and interested.
Sad because a civil war within our (current) borders, settled by a treaty which is entwined with our EU membership, is surely a big enough 'problem' to be worth consideration by everyone? Dismissing and ignoring it doesn't prevent it being a barrier to leaving the EU.
Interested because I haven't seen many continued-leave-supporters (as opposed to people I know IRL who voted leave and now regret it) who admit that the Leave campaign ignored the problems that Brexit would throw up. So thank you, faith, for that honesty.

I agree that the Remain campaign didn't raise these issues effectively.
I saw lots of debate over it, but that's because I read ROI and NI newspapers and blogs alongside the British press. Those just reading London-centric newspapers wouldn't have seen much. Yet another thing I'll never forgive the Conservative party for.

Ghost - thanks that’s saved me time but, with all due respect it’s only two pages. Threads about Ireland run for longer than that now but it’s after the event and too late.

How many pages would have been sufficient for you? Of course people are talking about it now - the mess is unfolding.

Long before the referendum did English, Scottish, Welsh folk take a general interest in NI politics? I would say no, particularly once the violence stopped.

Ghost Well for something this important I would have said more than two and for it to have at least have got a mention by the remain campaign. This should have been talked about a LOT more BEFORE not after.

With regard to your second para I wouldn’t have a clue but I suspect you are correct, however, a lot of that is due to the fact it’s very rarely covered by the media over here. As Somerville mentioned you would have to subscribe to an NI/ROI paper/s to keep up to speed.

Part of the issue is how complex the history is, and how little of it is known by Joe Bloggs.

Irish history and the civil war should be taught on the UK history syllabus. We can't learn from our mistakes if we live in ignorance of them.

I seem to remember the DUP’s Gavin Robinson dismissing concerns over the border and the GFA as “project fear” pre-Referendum?

I seem to remember pre-Referendum the DUP’s Gavin Robinson dismissing concerns over the border and the GFA as “project fear”?

(Sorry - glitchy phone)

Everything got framed as project fear pre referedum it allowed leavers to shoot everything down without any detailed analysis.

It all brings us back to the point that EU membership is far too complex to be framed as an in/out referendum.

The lack of coverage on NI whether in the media or during the referendum IMO stems from British arrogance that has always seen Ireland as a backwater and a "problem" or irritant.

Leavers argued that remainers were out of touch metropolitan elite types who could not understand the lives of ordinary folk in small market towns. By the same token the average leave voter in England does not understand the lives of those who lived through 70's and 80's in Belfast.

I went on about NI and Scotland on MN Brexit threads all the time. As did others.
If you wanted to rip us out if something that was keeping the peace then it is on you to explain why it was a good thing, Leavers.
But no, it was all about the bus lies and sovereignty etc etc.

Irish history and the civil war should be taught on the UK history syllabus. We can't learn from our mistakes if we live in ignorance of them.

Absolutely agree with this.

TBH, NI was waved away as a concern by leavers. Trade deals were going to be easy. Good to see leavers now washing their hands of any pending shit storm.
I think you'll find remainers have very little time for David Cameron and his misguided decision to call a referendum.

And again I’ll repeat myself:
The Leave campaign’s sole motive was to persuade people to vote Leave. Why on earth would they scupper their own ambition by highlighting problems?
Thinking it was incumbent on the Leave campaign to address NI is naive at best, and monumentally stupid at worst - woefully disingenuous regardless.

The onus was on the Remain campaign to persuade & inform re the benefits of remaining & pitfalls of leaving. They instead fell back on the tried & trusted project fear approach of indyref** and failed to make their case.

The only posters I saw on MN talking about NI were those with an Irish/NI connection - the majority of those who are now talking about it on various MN threads did not pay much attention to NI until after the result.

Did you post lots of vociferous persuasion highlighting the NI position during the campaign Ghost?

The only posters I saw on MN talking about NI were those with an Irish/NI connection

Rubbish. I posted on NI and have no Irish connection. I'd bet money that I'm not the only one.

Faith, you are as deluded now as you were when you voted Leave.
This shit storm in NI is absolutely on you if you refused to listen to people telling you how risky it was.

Did you post lots of vociferous persuasion highlighting the NI position during the campaign Ghost?

Yes, not that it is important.

Why on earth would they scupper their own ambition by highlighting problems?

Sums Brexit up. Dressed up as patriotism and opportunity for ordinary people was actually an excuse to asset strip the country for a few wealthy elites. How ironic.

“Why on earth would they scupper their own ambition by highlighting problems”

Because it would be honest and some might have been persuaded to vote for you if you had addressed this and the MANY other risks identified by Remainers.
Instead you won by a narrow majority of people who actually voted. And we are all supposed to shut up now.

So the Remain campaign bear no responsibility for not making an issue of NI then?

KK.

Faith, you are as deluded now as you were when you voted Leave.
This shit storm in NI is absolutely on you if you refused to listen to people telling you how risky it was.

Calm down dear.

So the Remain campaign bear no responsibility for not making an issue of NI then?

When we vote I believe we have a responsibility to seek out fact and differing opinions ultimately arriving at an informed decision. Clearly people voted on emotion and/or whatever bullshit was peddled to them on the side of a bus. This is all on the "winning" side.

Calm enough to remember the IRA bombing campaign of the 70s 80s and 90s.
But thanks, I’m plenty calm.

Nice to know that Leaver policy is to blame all the shit that happens on Remainers not warning people.

Just coming on to say I'm liking this thread .

I was a Remainer, with a small 'r'. I have long since excepted we're leaving and I like reading some positive stuff. I don't think everything will go our way, but neither do I think it'll be the zombie apocalypse that many people think.