Westministenders: No Brexit is Better than a Bad Brexit

[RedToothBrush]

Happy Anniversary!!!

These Threads are officially 1 year old today.

I don't know who started the very first thread, but it was about how Cameron quitting had handed the Boris a poison chalice because he had to be the one to trigger a50 as Cameron walked away without having done it.

Of course Boris didn't become PM, and we found out that triggering a50 and Brexit were even more complex than even the majority of the most informed thought it would be.

A year on we have a minority government, a zombie prime minister, a government who don't really know what the concept of democracy, millions of EU citizens (who include British nationals) who face an uncertain future, the fear of the cliff edge, a huge scandal over inequality and Jeremy Corbyn appearing on the Pyramid Stage at Glastonbury within the hour.

Snap, woman .

Golondrina I don't know whether to be relieved or disappointed that the Dutch are not alone in having a backward outlook.

pointy things

@faisalislam
UK Paper includes case studies of who gets to stay where and with what rights post Brexit: Sarah, Lukas, Agnieszka, Christophe, & Andriana

British Government document on migrant control uses the same name, Sarah, printed on all Jewish German women's documentation during Weimar.

www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b08vwmxc

At 9.23 John Major with some insightful comments on DUP deal. He notes that even with it, a few by elections in the next few months will fritter away this expensive deal. He sounds really concerned about GFA.

Matthew Holehouse‏*@mattholehouse*

Is EHIC a) an acquired citzens' right that govts must protect (UK view) or b) a perk of membership that expires on Brexit (Barnier view)?

Those Spanish Pensions should be worried...

Pensioners.

There may be dark days ahead. In this grave hour I send to every household and to all people this message.......run for the hills, NOW!

William Hague in the Telegraph (behind paywall) says we all just need to be a bit more positive about Brexit

Golondrina - so, someone Spanish, living in the UK would need to choose to take on British nationality (and lose their EU citizenship?) to stay in the UK? Is that right or have I misunderstood something here?

golandrina isn't that called having your cake and eating it? Not many of us get to do both.

Very few countries allow dual nationality. The US doesn't, but the UK does. But taking US citizenship means signing up to pay US taxes wherever in the world you live.

The UK is more relaxed about dual nationality than any other country (that I know) in that you may become a citizen of Utopia while retaining your UK passport. Many many people fortunate enough to have entitlement to a UK passport keep it as a back up.

Sock My DDs have dual nationality - Netherlands/US. The US does not recognise dual citizenship - the US does not see my DDs' Dutch citizenship as something that is a thing. They also do not and will not force them to drop their Dutch citizenship, however,

The Netherlands and Spain do take away their people's original citizenship if they take on citizenship elsewhere. And that is backward and parochial and small-minded.

SwedishEdith

Spain only recognises dual citizenship with Portugal, Andorra, South American countries...

However if you are Spanish by birth you can take a second citizenship from another country and there are provisions in the Law allowing us to keep Spanish citizenship if we formally declare this is our wish in the 2 (or 3, don't remember now) years after we have taken the new citizenship. You just have to go to the Consulate with a few documents and sign a 'Acta de Conservación de Nacionalidad' in front of a consular officer. This document is later registered with the Civil Registry where our birth is registered.

I know because I have just done it! Because there is no dual citizenship treaty between the UK and Spain I am not a dual citizen. I am a citizen of two countries. For Spain I am Spanish only. For the UK I am British only. Although both countries know I am a citizen of the other.

It's free, btw.

I think Spain should allow dual citizenship within the EU (& UK after Brexit) and wrote to Ministerio del Interior (Home Office) last year, but I'm a nobody!

Someone told me once that Spain would not know if you had not renounced to British citizenship. I don't know if there is a legal loophole... I have been told that there is a lot of misleading information on the Internet. I would check in Ministerio del Interior web, not in any forums, and then I would ask a solicitor about the options.

How is maintaining the rights I have now to ensure that I can continue living in Spain where I have a house, a business, a husband and children, where I have lived half my life having my cake and eating it? I can't actually have my cake and eat it as Spain won't recognise dual nationality, so I have to choose. I will choose Spain as it's where my life is.

Interesting list. Thanks.

Watching BBC 1 and reaching for the morphine lol!

Spain would not know if you had not renounced to British citizenship.
I've heard that too, but when renewing your UK passport I think there is a question about other nationalities and I'm not sure how it affects your application to have another (i.e Spain).
My children were born in Spain to a Spanish father (my DH) and so are Spanish but also have UK passports through me. I knew there was something about retaining both but didn't know the details. I might look into it a bit more.

Actually, rereading your post, they can't as they are 6 and 9 and have had UK passports since babies so it doesn't apply to them.

Golondrina, yes, the 2 or 3 years will count for them once they are 18.
My eldest is 15 so I've already looked into that.
A relative of my mother, who is a diplomat, told me that once we have done the 'Acta' is just not forgetting to renew the Spanish passport or ID card and everything is fine, you keep the Spanish citizenship forever.

I would have not applied for British citizenship without this 'perk'.

Golondrina, yes, the 2 or 3 years will count for them once they are 18.
My eldest is 15 so I've already looked into that.
A relative of my mother, who is a diplomat, told me that once we have done the 'Acta' is just not forgetting to renew the Spanish passport or ID card and everything is fine, you keep the Spanish citizenship forever.

I would have not applied for British citizenship without this 'perk'.

See how complicated it is living abroad. One reason why I didn't do it when I was younger. I think I must have known we would eventually leave the EU.

Golondrina, i think it might depend on where they live when they are 18 but Spain only allows this, having more than one citizenship/passport, if you formally declare you want to "continue being Spanish". I'll send you a pm with a link to the MI info if I can find it!

Golondrina hope that works out.