Westminstenders: The Negotiations Continue - The DUP ones

[RedToothBrush]

Tomorrow is the Queen’s Speech. In honour of that the start of this thread is written in its honour:

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Immigration is bad. Except for that good immigration.
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Brexit means Brexit
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Pilot scheme.
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Money for –the DUP-- NI
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Brexit means Brexit
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The Internet is Bad. Newspapers are good.
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Brexit means Brexit.
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Britain wave your flag.
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(The Queen’s turns over the page to read the back of the A4 sheet, only to find it blank)

Emma Pengelly has canvassed a neighbourhood wrt Loyalist Paramilitary Flags and said she supports the residents that they are not really a problem, to paraphrase. Can you imagine if some IRA support flags were dotted around the mixed area? Mind you, they seem to regard the Irish flag that. The DUP were asking people out onto the streets when Belfast Council voted to only fly the Union flag on the same amount of days as other parts of the UK. Naomi Long and Alliance were the targets of much abuse.

It is the hypocrisy. They try to portray themselves as squeaky clean. NI has a history. There are legacy issues on all sides. Of course, the DUP don't believe there should a review of any terror campaigns on the part of the security forces. Maybe because it could reveal the Loyalist paramilitary links. Or how there are so many webs connecting even self defined respectable organisations.

www.irishnews.com/news/2017/06/21/news/dup-s-emma-little-pengelly-criticised-over-uvf-flags-in-shared-neighbourhood-1062249/

Also, interesting article on the reassessment of a historical case. I imagine a lot was buried.

www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/coroner-to-examine-bullets-in-case-of-teenager-marion-brown-shot-dead-40-years-ago-after-kissing-boyfriend-goodnight-30574595.html

It is a difficult one about security forces. However, the state must uphold the law. They shouldn't just be another paramilitary style outfit. Goodness knows, there were enough on both sides. I saw a very good TV programme about the special army terror squads roaming in NI. That was their function. They did randomly murder and maim.

But I digress. Only a little, as the DUP may hold sway soon. They are not really being examined. John Bercow's remarks about the dinosaurs and their millions of year was a little naughty. Lots of the DUP are young earth creationists. They take as gospel everything was created by the God of the Bible 10,000 years ago. I don't know if it was in 7 days or one day.

James O'Brien Shocked By Conditions Social Tenants Live In Luxury Flats
James O'Brien was left flabberghasted after discovering how social housing tenants live like second-class citizens in their own homes.

She lives in one of 10 social housing flats in a development of 60 properties. They have a separate front door - known colloquially as a "poor door" - by the other residents' bins.
They don't have a lift or access to any parking.
But the bit that really stopped James in his tracks was that they have no access to the development's garden. Other residents can take their dogs in it, but Jabeen's children are banned.

There are no words to adequately describe the horror of this.
Who allows this to happen?
Has nobody any sense of shame any more?

The trouble with public sector procurement, in my experience, is that it's almost always a paper exercise. Very rarely does anyone check that the winning tenderer is doing what they said they would, to the standard they promised.
I suspect many an unmarked envelope stuffed with cash has passed from developers to local administrators as payment for the blind eye.

Did anyone watch Question Time? I missed it, but heard it was dramatic. What happened?

Somehow I don't think the EUbis going to accept this wonderful offer. Let's hope it's just an opening gambit rather than serving stone

In other countries there can also be visa waiver if you own property and have business or job. Do if you are under x years you can stay.

What if they are reading these threads to come up with policy? Or the beano?

It's all rather embarrassing

Hester I didn't see it, but here's this:
www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/david-dimbleby-just-threw-guy-10672842

I saw QT in bits (Apple box/iPlayer snafu) and think it skipped a big chunk in the middle when I tried to rewind to catch one if the audience questions. From what I saw:

1. good panel (Gina Miller excellent) except for Peter Oborne, who was a shouty, opinionated windbag;
2. audience generally quite testy, asking pointed, difficult questions and partisan clapping/booing at points;
3. massively disruptive middle-aged male Corbynista who heckled/shouted out over other questioners and the panel so extensively that the panel were eye-rolling & face-pulling and the audience were getting mutinous. When Dimbleby finally snapped and told him to leave near the end, there was rapturous applause from the audience. I thought Dimbleby did well & tried to shut him down ("you're one person in an audience of 150, i think we should hear what other peopke have to say" etc).
4. Managing the heckling made Dimbleby rather snappish with panel guests. I hope he apologised afterwards.

Hahaha - I see from Woman's Mirror link that I captured all the maun elements. One audience member also made a pointed remark about the panel being late for the show in a reply about infrastructure spending in the SW.

Happy Independence Day everyone 🌈🍾🥂

From Glastonbury

Misshoolies, Happy Independence Day! Think we need one of these too. 🦄

I gather from analysis just coming out of the GE results that almost as many young people 18-24 voted as older voters. Young voters were predominantly Remain, and older Leave. It makes me question at what stage the politicians will have to admit that the demographics have changed and there is no longer a mandate for Brexit?

Particularly as the generations pushing the Brexit bus off the cliff are not the ones who will. E living with the consequences long-term.

The country seems to be broadly 50/50 on this. However, the politicians know that if they continue with this folly the Remain half will put up with it and make the best job of it they can while if they stop it the Leave half will cause all kinds of trouble and at the very least will cause chaos to the political system for decades until there is another Referendum with another Leave result.

Rolling back on leaving would bring up some very extreme and scary characters.

The genie is out of the bottle with this one and I can't see a way to get it back in.

Math - to go back to your earlier point about bribery in construction. It may happen but in my experience it is far more likely to be overstretched and under resourced employers. For example, a tender would usually specify standards for materials. The contractors would tender on this basis.

If the tenders are over budget, there will be a value engineering exercise in which some reductions in standards are agreed to keep the cost down without properly considering knock on effects because there isn't the time or budget to do so.

Rolling back on leaving would bring up some very extreme and scary characters.

I am not 100% convinced that this would happen. UKIP is only Farage when it comes down to it; UKIP haven't been able to muster the thousands on marches that they promised. How many people would have voted Leave if we hadn't had the Mail, Express and Telegraph screaming for Leave and whipping up hatred against immigrants? The Press is a declining force as far as the young are concerned.

The recent atrocities and tragedies have shown that there is a huge core of decent people out there willing to help their neighbours.

Agree with peregrina

With all due respect, nauticant, this argument that Leavers will take to the streets if their will is thwarted etc etc is one that is often trotted out about Brexit. I can't see any evidence to back that up (and given the age and economic status of many Leavers, I think it is unlikely to be too great a danger). Yes, there are lots that are very good at sending abusive tweets and threatening FB messages but in terms of actual organisation... not so much. We can't plough on with Brexit regardless which has many genuinely scary outcomes because of a small possibility that some slightly scary people would be disappointed.

I also agree with Peregina. There is no leave mob out there. And if there is what are the leavers going to do? Wave their pension books abd blue passports at the young ever growing remainers?

Farage is a facist but unless he gets into bed with the BNP and EDL he doesn't have an organised rent a mob. Just some very vocal keyboard warriors. He couldn't even organise a supporters march last year

www.google.co.uk/amp/www.telegraph.co.uk/health-fitness/mind/norman-lamb-my-sons-mental-health-problems-made-me-determined-to/amp/

Norman Lamb came to my workplace a few years ago and I can confirm that he is a thoroughly decent bloke and genuinely passionate about mental health.
He sat in with me seeing a patient who was floridly psychotic, dressed only in shorts and wellies and who spent an hour ranting about Anglo Saxons conspiring to kill all the dogs in the UK and the Police being on a secret mission to make everyone homosexual amongst other things. Norman didn't bat an eyelid. He stayed for ages just chatting to staff and seemed genuinely interested.

The 5 year thing is existing EU law.

"As an EU national, you automatically acquire the right of permanent residence in another EU country if you have lived there legally for a continuous period of 5 years. If you fulfil this requirement, you can apply for a permanent residence document, which confirms your right to live in the country where you now live permanently, without any conditions." It is the application (85 pages for the UK?) for permanent residency that seems to have caused so many problems for EU citizens in UK.

Rolling back on leaving would bring up some very extreme and scary characters

Possibly.

I'm really hoping for more of a consensus after summer.

My guess will be that

• Europe will look stronger. The economy in Europe seems to be improving. Brexit seems to have scared Europeans away from their own leave/more right wing elements.

• Britain will suffer over summer. Increased inflation will make life harder for people in the uk. Anyone holidaying abroad will be shocked at how much more it's costing them out there.

At home people will notice price rises at the till. Spending will drop and the economy will suffer.

Hopefully this will lead a big backlash against hard Brexit.

Have posted this before but Survation polling is showing increasing remain

mailchi.mp/survation/post-election-poll-for-the-mail-on-sunday-1118637?e=c37db807f4

Also today that people want soft Brexit and referendum on the deal

Latest Polls Indicate Majority Support for “Soft” Brexit & referendum to accept or reject a deal. Round up blog by Survation's @tom_bristow

It's going to be an "interesting" summer...