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Brexit

Westministenders: Election Mayhem

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 02/06/2017 18:50

Tick tock, tick tock goes the Brexit Clock.

Don’t panic, just don’t turn up to debates because you have talks starting on the 19th June and have to perfect the 100 page document relating to at least 750 international agreements that need renegotiating before then. Anyone who turns up for their job interview for that, is just wasting time.

If only someone hadn’t called a distracting election.

This election was dubbed to be about Brexit. Yet it is remarkable that we have barely had debate over it. No one wants to admit it really. We nearly got a consensus between Barry Gardiner, Nick Clegg and David Davis over it being a political not economic decision on Question Time on Thursday 1st June, but we are not quite there yet with the admission that the economy is toast. This means the addition money the Conservatives have promised for the NHS won’t be available but we can’t have this discussion. Its properly the fault of purdah. Instead the subject rapidly got skipped over. Instead Davis said that the target May had just set for immigration to be at tens of thousands by 2022 was unrealistic.

In post-election rumour has it that Davis is about to get a promotion to the FCO, whilst Johnson gets the boot. On the other hand Gove is also rumoured for NI and May loyal Gummer gets Brexit.

Meanwhile the 1922 Committee of Tory Backbenchers are said to be plotting the downfall of at least one of May’s guard dogs, Nick Timothy following the decision about the Dementia Tax and subsequent U-Turn. Farage also mentioned Timothy in his statement over the breaking news that the CPS are pressing charges on the Conservative Candidate for South Thanet (the former MP there), his agent and a Tory Party official over election expenses. It seems almost inconceivable that Timothy can survive a traditional Tory Knifing.

This is all as May’s leadership approval ratings are in freefall as the honeymoon is firmly ends, after the public finally got to see her create an army of strawmen as answers, in a barely concealed contempt for the public’s concerns. May’s reaction to a negative reaction? Go back into hiding from media accountability and get the Mail to do her dirty work.

Elsewhere the EU have lined up to criticise Trump over his hard ball attempt to renegotiate the Paris Climate Deal. May was noticeable by her absence as she’s trying the same trick over Brexit and is desperate to keep Trump onside. What is Trump offering us in return? Apart from a Brexit Opportunity to get stiffed.

As for the polls? Despite them, it’s difficult to see the Tories not making a net seat gain. For Labour to do well it relies on widespread tactical voting, young who haven’t previously voted turning out in levels not seen since the 1970s and this being spread across the country and not concentrated in University areas. This will be tough to achieve to simply stop a Tory Landslide, never mind a hung parliament. Labour winning a majority is the stuff of pure fantasy (needs Lab to be 12points ahead of Cons). That said, if the result isn’t much different to the 2015 result, it will beg major questions over May’s leadership and her ability to read the public mood. It will say something about her refusal to engage with ‘the saboteurs’.

Expect an increased Tory Majority but not of the epic scale of 470 they originally were aiming for.

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Zxyzoey31 · 02/06/2017 21:55

Having seen his answers on the terrorist apologist questions and the audience responses, I can see he goes down better with the young. I don't think labour are actually going to do that well in the actual GE

woman12345 · 02/06/2017 21:56

I don't know in what circumstances I'd use a nuclear weapon ffs.
One can't , that's the point.

Zxyzoey31 · 02/06/2017 21:57

Ooo he has just been so sensible and tried to explain the issue about trade tariffs. I hope some people really took that in.

Cailleach1 · 02/06/2017 21:57

That guy talking about zero hours and students was sent in with that question. He was at a loss when Corbyn said 'It is all right, I won't stop you working.

Valentine2 · 02/06/2017 21:59

Ok then. May is thoroughly fucked.
I love it. Grin

Cailleach1 · 02/06/2017 22:00

I really think some of these people questioning Corbyn are set ups. The guy poking the other one for him to ask the question. He isn't shaken by them though and is well able to respond.

HashiAsLarry · 02/06/2017 22:01

@davidschneider

Audience: How dare you not condemn the IRA killers
!Audience: How dare you not be prepared to kill millions of people!

Pretty much sums that up

Eeeeeowwwfftz · 02/06/2017 22:01

I can't work out what makes 'ordinary members of the general public' have such confidence in their judgement about when it would be right to press the red button.

woman12345 · 02/06/2017 22:04

I don't think labour are actually going to do that well in the actual GE
But they've already won the campaign. They'll lose the election, but that won't be the end of the story. Never is. Smile

RedToothBrush · 02/06/2017 22:06

Just heard something about the Royal Mail delivering lots of election leaflets to the wrong constituency or not at all.

This pisses me off, as I know we didn't get one of ours.

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Zxyzoey31 · 02/06/2017 22:07

That was Corbyn's thing, changing public discourse to further left. I don't think the campaign can be said to have achieve that. Clearly parts of that audience thought him a complete idiot.

officerhinrika · 02/06/2017 22:09

Quite irritated that it's already being sliced, diced and repeated on the news, I've just watched the full thing without editing thanks.

Booph · 02/06/2017 22:10

I was surprised how both of them seemed to be caught off guard by a few of the questions. I assumed they would've been prepped for all areas, especially given than there's so much debate online and in the media in general.

The Trident obsession is bizarre. Shouty Daily Mail people in the audience. That woman talking about her husband being deported was completely right.

PigletWasPoohsFriend · 02/06/2017 22:14

The Trident obsession is bizarre. Shouty Daily Mail people in the audience.

It isn't just Tories that believe in Trident btw. Nor do all those that do read the DM lazy stereotyping

PigletWasPoohsFriend · 02/06/2017 22:16

But they've already won the campaign.

Maybe however the whole point is winning the election. You don't get anything for coming second.

The whole point of Labour is to get into government not be a party of opposition.

squoosh · 02/06/2017 22:17

Is red button obsession a macho posturing thing? I've never once had that on my list of desirable qualities in a candidate.

Gumpendorf · 02/06/2017 22:17

He isn't shaken by them though and is well able to respond.

That was the big difference between them. May did well by her recent standards but I got the impression she had been rehearsing all day. I could see her thinking "NHS - this my answer" etc

Corbyn is more conversational - yes, he has his speaking points but he can also improvise. May can't.

Loved the way he spoke about single market and supply chains. You could see the penny dropping. Also the chap complaining about CT rate increases seem to take on board that businesses need skilled labour.

We need more of that in the remaining week.

Valentine2 · 02/06/2017 22:18

Take a drink every time May says 'Magic Money Tree'.
Yet ANOTHER bet I win. She said Abbot four time while I was in the living room (left the room for a while).
Corbyn has given some amazing stuff there.
If you can't pay the living wage, you are not a viable business.

ElenaGreco123 · 02/06/2017 22:18

Apologies, but I do not know how deploying Trident works. How reliant are we on the US while operating Trident? Are we really that independent?

Gumpendorf · 02/06/2017 22:18

Not the single market but tariff free access...

TheElementsSong · 02/06/2017 22:19

Is red button obsession a macho posturing thing?

It's rather worryingly phallic and ejaculatory, isn't it? Grin

BigChocFrenzy · 02/06/2017 22:19

He has moved the Overton window to the left and shown that more people vote Labour when they are a clear left alternative, not a kinder version of the Tory party.

Traditional Labour will be rejuvenated and New Labour is dead; probably so too is Blair's idea for a new centre party.
The next Labour leader, who will probably win a 2022 GE, will do so on this kind of traditional Labour manifesto

The original lead in the polls was around 25%, so he has had a very successful campaign to give the Tories such a scare.

imo, a narrow Tory majority is the best result for Labour, because this GE is best to lose, to avoid carrying the can for Brexit.

BigChocFrenzy · 02/06/2017 22:23

It's the non-tariff barriers that are the real problem, all the customs delays, costs, infrastructure needed.
Also 80% of UK exports aren't physical goods at all - they're services

BigChocFrenzy · 02/06/2017 22:24

WTO doesn't deal with services and most FTAs don't either

Zxyzoey31 · 02/06/2017 22:25

Corbyn said he didn't want to be in the position to make the decision. That implies disarm so he doesn't have to take responsibility.
I consider being prepared to make hard decisions and take responsibility is pretty important in a pm.
Corbyn is that part of the left that won't make the compromises needed to win. As above he might not even care about winning that much and certainly not enough to compromise his believes.

He was surprisingly good on the economic questions in qt.

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