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Brexit

Westministenders: Brexit Britain = Gridlock Britain ?

999 replies

BigChocFrenzy · 09/03/2017 16:03

We keep getting told the Uk can get a deal like Canada, Turkey or other non-EU countries have, without FOM.
Those deals do not provide the same privileges as EU members:
They have quotas, restrictions and must obey EU regulations

e.g. After CETA, Ron Davidson, head of international trade for the Canadian Meat Council stated:
"We do not have what we would call commercially viable access to the European market".

The deal with Turkey abolished tariffs, but did not give free acess. This is what that means:

www.ft.com/content/b4458652-f42d-11e6-8758-6876151821a6

"On a recent Saturday at the Kapikule border crossing, about 30 minutes drive from the Turkish city of Edirne, a line of trucks 4km long stretched along the highway, inching along glacially towards the Bulgarian checkpoints.
"Today is a good day", said Ibrahim Kurtukcu, a 42-year trucker who had been waiting 14 hours.
"Last week the line was 7km long".
The record is 17km. It can take up to 30 hours to get through to the other side."

Of course, UK ports (and French ports) do not have the capacity, facilities, storage space or trained staff to handle customs processing of the vast amount of British exports & imports.

Building this additional capacity - where ? - would take several years and there are no signs that even the planning stage has started.

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BigChocFrenzy · 09/03/2017 22:33

Customs for NI, I mean and thorough inspections of all goods from anywhere in the UK entering the EU

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BigChocFrenzy · 09/03/2017 22:37

Ninon That was a brilliant link that clearly explains why many Scots think they would have more comtrol over their lives as a member of the EU with veto power than within the UK and no veto on anything

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Mistigri · 09/03/2017 22:38

The customs fraud case is very damaging to Britain's standing going into negotiations.

mathanxiety · 09/03/2017 22:46

There would be a certain element of karma if it turned out the brexit voting inhabitants of Kent had voted to have their motorways and towns turned into permanent lorry parking lot

There will be a lot more than karma floating around if Dundalk or Lifford and surrounding countryside become border post traffic jams.

The possibility of a shady contraband industry springing up is one that should concern the government far more than it seems to have up to now. Where there is money to be made from contraband there is always organised crime.

YY to 'how will it all work when we are the tax haven of Europe ?'

prettybird · 09/03/2017 22:48

I've met Paul Kavanagh (aka Wee Ginger Dug - the author of "The Cow in the Caravan" article ): he is an articulate cosmopolitan linguist citizen of nowhere Wink. He is not a member of the SNP - but he is a supporter of Independence (you might have guessed Grin)

I met him at a talk where he described his "journey" towards supporting independence.

BigChocFrenzy · 09/03/2017 22:57

Hammond “will not saddle our children and grandchildren with ever-increasing debt,” Hmm
Liar, liar, pants on fire !

"Hammond is set to borrow no less than £141.1 billion on our behalf over the next four years – a jaw-dropping three and a half times more than Osborne predicted just 12 months ago. "

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/03/08/real-scandal-boring-budget-141-billion-pounds-extra-borrowing/

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BigChocFrenzy · 09/03/2017 22:59

In NI, it is the paramilitaries who thrived on smuggling and will do so again if Brexit = customs borders

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SwedishEdith · 09/03/2017 23:16

Britain Elects‏ @britainelects 15s15 seconds ago
Liberal Democrat GAIN Hailey, Minster Lovell & Leafield (West Oxfordshire) from Conservative.

SwedishEdith · 09/03/2017 23:30

Britain Elects‏ @britainelects 15s15 seconds ago
Liberal Democrat GAIN Hailey, Minster Lovell & Leafield (West Oxfordshire) from Conservative.

mathanxiety · 09/03/2017 23:33

I would like to add 'piling up ill will purely to indulge a taste for churlishness' to descriptions of TM.

So 'reckless' therefore.

Peregrina · 10/03/2017 00:19

Liberal Democrat GAIN Hailey, Minster Lovell & Leafield (West Oxfordshire) from Conservative.

Well, well. The sort of place which has been Tory since the Tory party came into being. Seems like the 19,000 loss of Tory votes in the Witney Parliamentary by election started a trend.

comfortandjoyce · 10/03/2017 00:38

Seems like the 19,000 loss of Tory votes in the Witney Parliamentary by election started a trend.

Or maybe not:

twitter.com/britainelects/status/839993872944136192

Westminster voting intention:
CON: 44% (+2)
LAB: 25% (-)
UKIP: 11% (-1)
LDEM: 10% (-1)
(via YouGov / 08 - 09 Mar)

twitter.com/britainelects/status/839992109306372096

Conservatives have a 19pt lead over Labour in tonight's YouGov (taken post budget).
Largest w/ the pollster in eight years.

HashiAsLarry · 10/03/2017 06:33

Good on the Lib Dems. I know the Tories quite fancy a return to the 19th century, looks like the Whigs may be coming back Grin

HashiAsLarry · 10/03/2017 07:04

Jolyon Maugham on another IndyRef 'being inevitable' according to an FT article:
A result, not of the decision to Leave, but of the Government's contempt for the wishes of those who voted Remain.

I think this is a very very important point oft missed by those who herald 'will of the people' and 'you lost get over it'.

PattyPenguin · 10/03/2017 07:12

According to the Grauniad, Verhofstadt is still lobbying for individual UK citizens to have freedom of movement in the EU. www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/10/let-britons-keep-freedom-of-movement-says-eus-brexit-negotiator

Good. Count me in, Guy.

Kaija · 10/03/2017 07:24

Thanks for the thread, bigchoc.

I can't help feeling that the NI rises are a dead cat to stop the media connecting the budget with Brexit. Seems to be working.

Badders123 · 10/03/2017 07:26

Yep

Some sleight of hand going on!

Don't look at that! Watch this!!

🤔

woman12345 · 10/03/2017 07:35

Thanks Swedish it's a good win. I still think that the lib dem win in Sunderland signalled a huge change, in a brexit/labour town.

Kaija · 10/03/2017 07:37

By the way did you all see that Farage visited Assange at the Ecuadorian embassy yesterday?

SingaSong12 · 10/03/2017 07:39

Mostly a lurker on Westminstenders Just catching up - badders thanks for cheering me up after listening to the news Smile

Badders123 · 10/03/2017 07:49

You are very welcome sing 😀

This is getting more traction I think?

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/conservative-party-election-expenses-scandal-battlebus2015-david-cameron-theresa-may-a7621731.html

Badders123 · 10/03/2017 08:01

Well I would not blame the Scottish for voting yes in indyref this time

The end of the union would sadden me but perhaps it is the best thing for the future of Scotland?

I'm no fan of the snp but like ukip I believe they will achieve their goal eventually

Perhaps after secession labour might make gains in Scotland again?

The Ireland question is far more complex imho

I can't see how there won't be hard borders?

Badders123 · 10/03/2017 08:02

Kaija...by he can't remember why!?

What a cockwomble

Peregrina · 10/03/2017 08:12

LibDem trend in some parts at least. This still may be a hangover from the feeling of betrayal that people in Cameron's old constituency feel. These are real crosses on ballot papers, not just Opinion polls, which haven't been too reliable of late.

prettybird · 10/03/2017 08:25

I fully expect the parties in Scotland, if when it does achieve her independence, to reform and re-invent themselves.

The SNP will probably ultimately split - or at least elements will split away - once its uniting raison d'être has been achieved.

Labour might will re-discover its principles backbone.

The Tories also have a chance to re-invent themselves. The old paternalistic One Nation Tories used to be popular in Scotland. Maybe they could be again I hae me doots

The LibDems might even end up being a major party! Shock

Or even the Greens Smile

The point is that we can have new parties; they won't be defined by Westminster politics.

That's why I genuinely don't understand those people who say that they don't want independence because "I don't like the SNP"

Well, news flash ..... You. Won't. Need. To. Vote. For. Them. Grin

Best way to get rid of the SNP as the majority power in Holyrood? Vote Yes in an Indyref Wink