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Brexit

Westministenders: Brexit Britain = Gridlock Britain ?

999 replies

BigChocFrenzy · 09/03/2017 16:03

We keep getting told the Uk can get a deal like Canada, Turkey or other non-EU countries have, without FOM.
Those deals do not provide the same privileges as EU members:
They have quotas, restrictions and must obey EU regulations

e.g. After CETA, Ron Davidson, head of international trade for the Canadian Meat Council stated:
"We do not have what we would call commercially viable access to the European market".

The deal with Turkey abolished tariffs, but did not give free acess. This is what that means:

www.ft.com/content/b4458652-f42d-11e6-8758-6876151821a6

"On a recent Saturday at the Kapikule border crossing, about 30 minutes drive from the Turkish city of Edirne, a line of trucks 4km long stretched along the highway, inching along glacially towards the Bulgarian checkpoints.
"Today is a good day", said Ibrahim Kurtukcu, a 42-year trucker who had been waiting 14 hours.
"Last week the line was 7km long".
The record is 17km. It can take up to 30 hours to get through to the other side."

Of course, UK ports (and French ports) do not have the capacity, facilities, storage space or trained staff to handle customs processing of the vast amount of British exports & imports.

Building this additional capacity - where ? - would take several years and there are no signs that even the planning stage has started.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
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Kaija · 13/03/2017 20:04

I suspect he hasn't moved on much since 1973.

Kaija · 13/03/2017 20:05

Trying, what makes you think Scotland won't vote for independence?

unicornsIlovethem · 13/03/2017 20:08

Kaija, surely you know that the "will of the people" once ascertained will never ever change and is carte Blanche for the losing side to be totally ignored (see undelivered promises about Scottish autonomy).

HashiAsLarry · 13/03/2017 20:11

Kaija, surely you know that the "will of the people" once ascertained will never ever change and is carte Blanche for the losing side to be totally ignored (see undelivered promises about Scottish autonomy).
Hence why we will no longer need general elections soon enough too

SwedishEdith · 13/03/2017 20:12

Rob Ford is a Professor of Political Science, Manchester University.

Rob Ford‏ @robfordmancs 3m3 minutes ago

Just doing some charts for presentation.Excluding Batley (special case) Lab vote share has fallen in every by-elec since Brexit. Avg fall 5%

Rob Ford‏ @robfordmancs 3m3 minutes ago

That's 5 falls in a row: pretty extraordinary for main oppo party. Has there ever been such a long string of oppo by-elec retreats before?

Rob Ford‏ @robfordmancs 1m1 minute ago

Meanwhile, LDs have seen their vote share rise in every by-elec since Brexit. Average rise across 5 votes is 13.7%

SwedishEdith · 13/03/2017 20:17

"*Green" yes I think some really clever whipping has been done and promises made. Clarke had no reason not to vote against and the fact that he didn't (or abstained) makes me think that there might have been some behind the scenes commitment to something sensible (EFTA with EEA transition for example) - or am I just clutching at straws?"

I think so too.

Badders123 · 13/03/2017 20:19

There has to be

Surely?

It's economic and political suicide any other way...

SwedishEdith · 13/03/2017 20:19

Kate Hoey is 70, I think, hence why she's so totally unbothered about going against her constituents - doubt she intends to stand again.

woman12345 · 13/03/2017 20:20

^Theresa May warned that Brexit is 'heading back to the courts' after she refuses to give MPs a ‘meaningful vote’
‘If they don’t follow proper constitutional process, there will be litigation – and that litigation will hold matters up’, former Tory Attorney General Dominic Grieve warns^

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-article-50-theresa-may-meaningful-vote-lords-eu-nationals-a7628206.html

Badders123 · 13/03/2017 20:21

Good for her

Such vampire economics from the older gen

I despair

woman12345 · 13/03/2017 20:24

Deutsche Bank economists in early March predicted sterling would plunge to $1.14 by the end of March - this would be a new 31-year low for the currency, even including the flash crash that sent the pound plunging more than 6 per cent on 7 October

www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/pound-sterling-latest-brexit-article-50-trigger-what-happen-theresa-may-prime-minister-a7627741.html.

Lalelou · 13/03/2017 20:41

"WM votes down Lords amendment to guarantee EU residents a right to remain by 48 votes."

Three million women and men, boys and girls who were born in a European country or who were born in the UK to parents who were born in the EU face an uncertain future as of today.

These women and men, boys and girls are members of British society, they love and live here, they volunteer and work, they pay £££ toward British public services, they do cutting edge research at universities across the country, they nurse the very sick and elderly, they share our trains with which we commute to work, they sit in our dc's school assemblies, singing the same songs and listening to the same stories as our dc, they are friends with our dc, they are our neighbours and friends.

Today British MPs voted for turning the lives of these people upside down. They came here legally, in good faith as friends and we are now showing them that they are nothing to us.

Today, for the very first time, I am ashamed to be British.

Alfieisnoisy · 13/03/2017 20:42

Me too Lalelou.

So very sad about it.

Brexit is fine but Brexit while ignoring the European people who live here, work here and volunteer here is appalling.

SwedishEdith · 13/03/2017 20:42

I've felt ashamed since June 24th, tbh.

Badders123 · 13/03/2017 20:43

Lou

Yep

😞😞😞😞

Kaija · 13/03/2017 20:43

Me too Swedish.

twofingerstoEverything · 13/03/2017 20:45

Has this been posted yet? Sinn Fein wants vote on Northern Ireland leaving UK 'as soon as possible'

SwedishEdith · 13/03/2017 20:47

I've felt ashamed since June 24th, tbh.

Lalelou · 13/03/2017 20:47

BoJo has a plan - a new royal yacht and this will pave the way to all sorts of lovely trade deals!

Three words: ship of fools.

SwedishEdith · 13/03/2017 20:48

Sorry, laptop crashed.

NinonDeLanclos · 13/03/2017 20:48

The revenge of the Celts.

NinonDeLanclos · 13/03/2017 20:50

Parnell and Braveheart unite.

HashiAsLarry · 13/03/2017 20:50

lale people are nothing more than a resource to these people. I'm still trying to find any remnant of pride in being British but am really struggling.

twofingers I'm surprised its taken so long Wink

BigChocFrenzy · 13/03/2017 20:53

You are fiendishly paranoid LH Smile
The Tories would be sinking to the lowest depths < but they seem to get away with it >

Personally, I think I'm pretty much fireproof wrt what the govt can do to me.
I suspect this will hit the less well off middle aged / elderly, or those who left substantial assets in the UK - move them now, including deposit accounts !

Remove my UK citizenship ?
Good riddance, if I have associate EU or German citizenship

Education ?
I'm childfree.
Usually advisable for young professionals to move abroad pre-DC, or at least before DC start school, to avoid affecting their eduation

Pensions ?
For the young professionals, or anyone with a decent private pension, the state pension amounts to bugger all.
I know people with a private pension pot can be stopped from moving the pot abroad - which is why I don't have a UK pot ! My pots & main bank accounts are in Germany & with the gnomes of Zurich.

A really evil govt < yes, eyes T May > might stop pensioners receiving their monthly private pension, although I'm sure there will be another Gina Miller type taking them to the Supreme court.

NHS and the (v low) benefits
Not relevant if you don't wish to return to the Uk, or are sufficiently well off not to need those state services
I took out private insurance 30 years ago, after having to pay for various ops for my late mum - even then, the NHS was inadequate

OP posts:
RedToothBrush · 13/03/2017 20:57

I'm ashamed to be British. I want my red EU Passport. I do not want an ID card (Yep you wait, they are coming. Soon. If you can't afford one, even if you are British and eligible for one, you are going to have a problem. There will also be one nice big data base to run. We know how good the government is at big data bases. And lets not talk about the hackers or increased potential for fraud. Yep increase, not decrease.)

Re: Indy Ref 2. Any referendum in Scotland will be difficult for the government to win in these circumstances. This is why May will resist it.

Indy Ref 1 won because of the economic logic. The economic logic will be irrelevant now to many people who voted on that basis. It will be about democracy. Rational heads got emotional and we know how that goes.

What positive argument can the government use to win? Honestly. I can't think of one. I'm not in Scotland but I was very anti-independence. Now, if I were Scottish I would support it.

No surprise at all that Sinn Fein wants a NI vote. They won't get it. Which ups the temperature there again.