Westministenders: Brexit Britain = Gridlock Britain ?

[BigChocFrenzy]

We keep getting told the Uk can get a deal like Canada, Turkey or other non-EU countries have, without FOM.
Those deals do not provide the same privileges as EU members:
They have quotas, restrictions and must obey EU regulations

e.g. After CETA, Ron Davidson, head of international trade for the Canadian Meat Council stated:
"We do not have what we would call commercially viable access to the European market".

The deal with Turkey abolished tariffs, but did not give free acess. This is what that means:

www.ft.com/content/b4458652-f42d-11e6-8758-6876151821a6

"On a recent Saturday at the Kapikule border crossing, about 30 minutes drive from the Turkish city of Edirne, a line of trucks 4km long stretched along the highway, inching along glacially towards the Bulgarian checkpoints.
"Today is a good day", said Ibrahim Kurtukcu, a 42-year trucker who had been waiting 14 hours.
"Last week the line was 7km long".
The record is 17km. It can take up to 30 hours to get through to the other side."

Of course, UK ports (and French ports) do not have the capacity, facilities, storage space or trained staff to handle customs processing of the vast amount of British exports & imports.

Building this additional capacity - where ? - would take several years and there are no signs that even the planning stage has started.

Kiss goodbye to your UK pension.

DH and I were sorting out papers for our forthcoming house move yesterday, and came across a 2004 letter from HMRC inviting us to keep up our NIC. Glad we didn't bother now!

I don't support Scottish independence but no denying that NS is a gifted politician, and it's hard to disagree with her argument: brexit changes everything, and the Scottish people's voice should be heard.

Summary of Sturgeon's position from the BBC:
First Minister Nicola Sturgeon announces independence referendum will be between Autumn 2018 and Spring 2019.
Ms Sturgeon says she will seek Scottish Parliament approval for a second independence referendum next week.

I don't support Scottish independence but no denying that NS is a gifted politician, and it's hard to disagree with her argument: brexit changes everything, and the Scottish people's voice should be heard.

+1

In 2014 - not being Scottish, not living in Scotland, I was ambivalent about Scottish independence. Any objections I had were sentimental, not practical ... it wasn't my decision.

However, I do agree that the UKs membership of the EU was played so heavily, that a new referendum is entirely justified. And if that results in a different outcome, so be it.

Now here's where it gets interesting ... if Scotland were to vote for - and achieve independence - then could it be argued that the 23rd June result needs revisiting. After all 4 countries voted, but only 3 get to enjoy the post-Brexit sunshine ?

No chance at all of Scotland leaving and the Brexit result being revisited, imo .

Now here's where it gets interesting ... if Scotland were to vote for - and achieve independence - then could it be argued that the 23rd June result needs revisiting. After all 4 countries voted, but only 3 get to enjoy the post-Brexit sunshine ?

I don't think May has the will, ability or the patience to do it. And once A50 is triggered, i don't know how it will work in theory.

I dont want Scotland to leave the union

But i think they should be able to vote again based on brexit and i would support that decision

Anyway, the negotiations would be complete/almost complete by the time of the Indyref if A50 is triggered this month. It would simply result in lots of the noisier Brexiteers shouting "Good riddance, we never liked you anyway. Now we can have a truly disastrous pure Brexit."

Dh just made the interesting point that this might give the Lords more confidence in playing ping pong (if the Commons do as expected reject the amendments) because of the danger to the UK.

Alternatively it might give the House of Commons more backbone but I'm not holding my breath

I wonder what the Queen thinks of the prospect of the break-up of the Union?

Of course an independent Scotland - in the EU - adds another UK/EU land border into the mix ....

There are plenty of ways - some of them very nasty - in which the UK could make sure that UK citizens don't get any ideas about swanning of to the EU.

Absolutely, LH, and I think it would play very well amongst Brexiters. Just a quick glance at some of the sentiments expressed in these threads re patriotism, treason, foreign taint being the sole cause of voting Remain...

The queen is pro leave

Allegedly

Well, she's old, rich and didn't go to uni so she fits the profile.

Mother - so is she hoping to delay A50? Because - sadly - I think that is a very forlorn hope.

😂

God I'm depressed

Excellent move by NS to give this speech today. Things are about to get interesting. We may get to a point where the only possible option for TM is to agree to remain in the EEA / customs union.

I dont want Scotland to leave the union

But i think they should be able to vote again based on brexit and i would support that decision

Agree.

I'm half Scottish, half English (Scottish Mum, English dad), born in England but have lived more of my life in Scotland than England.

I think Scotland is better as part of UK (economically) and I think the UK is the better from having Scotland as part of it.

However, if Scotland vote for independence then so be it - they should get to decide for themselves what future direction they want - the UK should be a union of consent, not a prison.

Well, she's old, rich and didn't go to uni so she fits the profile.

Thanks for making me laugh.

The queen may be pro leave but she's very much more pro the union and I imagine if push came to shove she'd pick the union over brexit.

The problem is brexit so fundamentally changes the shape of the union, so it is only fair that all countries in the union get the chance to say if they want to be part of it. Though WM have never liked those rules, hence all this issue with EU

Love that lala